new to EASY - 7 week old

[gb18]

Hi.

I have started over the last week to try and follow the 3 hour EASY routine with my 7 week old boy. I chose EASY as it appeared to fit in roughly with what we were doing already as he had sort of fallen into 3 hourly feeds naturally.

I am experiencing the current issues and would be really greatful for all advice.

Routine is as follows -

E aim for 7 but normally up at 6.30am - not feeding till 7.30 as often not hungry from night feed
A
S 8am - sometimes try a bit sooner as often tired. Using Shh/Pat  - normally takes 30mins to settle. Sleeps no longer than 45mins and will not resettle most of the time despite trying.
E 10 ish
A
S 11 ish - as prev no longer than 45 mins and taking a while to settle
E 1ish
A
S2.30 ish
E 4ish (although often wants food before this)
A minimal
S - rarely get to have any nap time
E 6ish
A bath
E 7.30
S 7.30/7.45 - normal settles better at this time

night time waking is variable - he will often go 5 hrs till about 1.30am but then wakes every 11/2 to 2 hours. I will feed if hungry. For example last night he woke at 11 am (fed) 1.30am (fed) 3.10 - gave dummy (paci) 4.30 (fed)5.00 patted to settle 5.30 patted to settle and then up at 6.40am.

Problems are -he only ever eats for about 10 mins max on one breast (although weight is excellent - large baby  13lb 8oz now, 8lb 15oz at birth) so feeding time always very short
 - short naps only, no more than 45 mins therefore overtired - screamed so much last night that he could not eat after bath.
 - never sleeps longer in the night after first period of waking - I had been giving a bottle of expressed milk at 11ish prev but this seemed to make no difference
- due to last night feed at times being as late/early as 5 am ish then often not hungry for 1st feed
- regular night waking - does not always seem hungry
 - consistent 4.30 waking - since about 2 weeks old - not always been hungry

Don't know if I am expecting too much of my LO so would be greatful for al your advise.

Thanks

[Ima shel Alon]

Hi and welcome to BW!

I think the main problem is that he is OT. At his age he should be doing around 1:15h A time so it could be that you are putting him too late for his first nap and if the first nap goes to pot then the rest of the does as well usually.
I would try and put him down earlier, perhaps an hour after he woke up and see if it makes a difference.
If you are getting a short nap then he probably won't be able to do a full A time after it and I think it's better to rather keep the A times on the short side, on the EASY you posted it seems as if he was awake from 11:45 till 2:30 which is A LOT for a baby his age.
I believe that once his A times are more age appropriate and you get a bit more than 45min naps then it will change the NW as well. It's still normal for him to wake up to feed around 3 times a night, but the frequent NW after the first stretch are probably because he is OT.
Does that help?

[gb18]

Hi. Sorry I have taken so long to reply!! That does help, but the problem is that he will not settle to sleep at the right times. I am desperately trying to settle him with Shh/Pat but it does not seem to work!! He was awake from 7.30am today (after feeding at 5am) until 11.30 as he would not settle despite me trying from 8.45 am till 10am. He was just crying all the time. I am getting so stressed out with it!! He finally fell asleep at 11.30 but I am sure that was only because he had his immunisations so had cried even more!! He then slept only for 45 mins.

Feel like things are getting worse not better!! To increase the 45min naps what shall I do? Also shall I just keep on with Shh/Pat and hope for the best? Will definitely keep trying to settle after around  1hr and 15min A but am really struggling.

All ideas, help, experiences of others greatly appreciated

[Ima shel Alon]

Maybe 1:15h first thing in the morning is too much? It sounds like you are missing the window and then he can't fall asleep anymore, gets all wound up. Don't feel bad and please don't stress over this - you are doing the best you can and getting the right A times is possibly the hardest thing about EASY. If it makes you feel better it does get better with time because you practice more. You'll learn more and more to read him and then put him down at the rightish time. Think about it like this - you only know him for 8 weeks, that's very little time to know the ins and outs of another human being, what he wants, what he needs.
IIWY I would try and settle with Shush-pat till he is in deep sleep (at this age they need help to fall asleep and stay asleep) but only for 40min. If after 40min he is still awake I would take him out of his room, have a quiet A time for 20-30min and then try again. If you want to try and extend naps you can do that with Shush-pat as well or HTTJ (hold through the jolts). You can read about it more here: How do I address habitual wakings? (wake-to-sleep and other methods)

[mummy of 3 littlies]

Hi gb18,

I have a 6.5 week old dd who is following exactly the same patterns as your LO. The ash/pat method I'm struggling with the most as my LO literally screams and fights against me. Are you experiencing this also?

Have you tried any other techniques worth giving ago?

Sorry I can't help but thought we can deal with this together 

Sera

[gb18]

Hi all. Thanks for the replies. Really helpful to have a forum to chat on. Sera - my LO does not tend to scream, only at night times when I try and put him down for the night and I know that this is because he has had nowhere near enough sleep therefore is really tired. This is when he wont take any breast milk which I get concerned about (plus means we are up more in the night!) I have been using a swaddle for the last two weeks which has helped with the night time waking. Are you using a swaddle Sera?

I am reducing A times as much as possible now. Yesterday was a particularly bad day as did not settle at lunch, therefore did not settle for the rest of the day. 7 hours with only the odd 10 min nap!! You can imagine the nightmare that was bedtime!

I just wondered as well if anyone has found that because they are concentrating on getting their LO's to sleep at home with Shh/Pat that they then do not ever nap in the pram? Thinking long term and wondering if this would be a difficulty and limit my ability to go out? What have others found?

[Ima shel Alon]

Is your LO falling asleep now in the pram? DS always did. In fact, as I couldn't get him to nap anywhere else, he had all his naps in the pram till he was 4m old! Then when we did ST with Shush-pat and he started napping in his crib he could still fall asleep in the pram. I tried to leave the house a few minutes before it was nap time to he could fall asleep in the pram if he wanted to.

[mummy of 3 littlies]

Hi all,

Yes we do swaddle with a woombie swaddle. It's like a lil cocoon that's zips up so she's much more settled since we have that. Just to update you...over the past couple of days dd has been sleeping quite comfortable on her own if I just leave her to it. Maybe the fees days of me sitting next to her and doing sssh/pat has either paid off or she was getting annoyed with me picking her up all the one to stop the crying. If I get the window right I swaddle, put her down and kiss her she may grizzle for a few minutes if she refuses the dummy or someone's she had just floated off into sleep. It's like she's changed over night.
I am the same as you gb18 regarding the pram. My LO won't sleep in it when we are out and about either. I think she maybe getting so used to sleeping in her Moses basket.....

Also gb18 I have found that watching the clock esp in the morning has helped with keeping on time wot naps as if she yawns that's a lil past the window...my LO can only last around 40mins from wake to going down again. Is this the same for you? It's so hard to get that window right isn't it?!

[gb18]

Hi.

I have had a bit of a break through too!! managing to consistently get morning naps over last 3 days. They are only 45 mins but at least is a nap. Yesterday managed to get a lunch nap (only on me though) and a nap in the car seat in the car and he stayed asleep when I brought the car seat in. All 45 mins. no cat nap despite a 50 min walk out in the pram and all naps way off schedule but slight progress. Still screamed at bedtime as still over tired.

Just wondering how to adjust EASY if only having 45 min naps as, for example today we woke and fed at 6.30am, napped at 7.45 to 8.30am. Did not resettle therefore I have just fed him. Wen do I put him to sleep as it feels like I am just getting into a cycle that is eventually going to mean that if he is A time is correct then he will be due a sleep and a feed at the same time. What is best to do? Also do you think that maybe my son only needs a short morning nap? Does that ever happen?

[Ima shel Alon]

I think at this age babies still need good naps, but it could be that he prefers a short first nap. I would still think that it's either routine related or developmental.
Re short naps and feeding I wouldn't actually feed when he wakes up from a short nap, unless he is really really hungry. If he can last 3h then I would feed in the middle of his A time, even if it's short before his nap. As long as he has a short A time before S then it's ok. Your EASY will then look like this: EASAEAS.

[gb18]

Thanks, that's really helpful advice. Regarding the extending of naps do you think I should try this now or just let him wake when he wants? I managed to get him to sleep again the other day but this involved getting him up and letting him sleep on me before transferring him to the moses basket- which I know is not the correct way to do things.

Sorry for all the questions, just want to try and get a good routine going to give my LO the best chance of sleeping.

Really positively, night time sleeping is tonnes better now. Much less waking. This seems to have coincided with a decrease in napping etc. Do you think this is related? Do others report this?

[Ima shel Alon]

Sometimes when you have bad days then night sleep is good because LO is really tired but doing that for more than 1-2 days will cause him to be extremely OT and you'll end up with more problems like many NW and EW.

I would give extending naps a try, it's always worth a try.