Pink mucous!?

[ZacsMumme]

If the mucus has never eased I suspect the gut has never had time to heal...this is what happened with Tom. He never healed so when we introduced solids (reluctantly) he got worse. I know you want to bf, but I'm wondering if its worth trailing neocate/elecare and pumping to see if it makes a difference? - until healed the but will continue to bein a bad state and she will struggle to tolerate even safe/bland food YK?

[ENMS]

(((hugs))) Alex.

have you ever considered the GAPS book? I found it was a very interesting read and it helped me understand how important it is to heal the gut

http://www.gaps.me/

[draxela]

Gah! Needing the hugs right now ;(

Sara, am really considering Neocate ATM given weight gain issues BUT am currently having heaps of trouble with pumping output. I have a super awesome pump but I just think my heart's not in it or I'm not mentally 'there' enough. Also, the paed reckons her gut issues are only mild and thinks bf is the best thing ultimately for her gut, so he's not keen on trialling any formulas. He thinks her weight gain is fine because she's still tracking on the growth curve and my other LO was also slow to gain.

Elise, I've got the GAPS book but I have to admit that I hid it in a cupboard when I got to the bit about not vaccinating, keeping your LO away from environmental toxins (like perfume and car exhausts etc) and so on. I have pretty bad anxiety stemming from a tendency to obsess over things and reading books like that just kind of tips me over the edge into full blown panic attacks about how I'm a terrible mother. Nevertheless, I'm trying to follow most of the GAPS principles, such as avoiding grains (or soaking them before cooking), taking multi-strain probiotics, eating naturally fermented foods, making and eating bone broths etc.

Sigh. Just feeling a bit over the whole thing really. I keep thinking about all the LOs out there whose mums just ignored their symptoms, called their babies 'fussy', pushed through the first year with gritted teeth and came out the other side pretty well unscathed. Ignorance is bliss?

[ENMS]

so many (((hugs))) hon. it's so hard isn't it? we're over that awful phase now and I can't say it's easy, but it is definitely easier. my DS is thriving, loving to eat, happy. you will get there too.

I keep thinking about all the LOs out there whose mums just ignored their symptoms, called their babies 'fussy', pushed through the first year with gritted teeth and came out the other side pretty well unscathed. Ignorance is bliss?

ikwym. I often wonder too. But I can't shake the feeling that yes, they come out the other side ok, but there is still an underlying issue, and it can present itself in so many ways, they are not 'better off', yk? but even today I have moments when I wish I didn't know everything I know now. But overall I am happy. I have applied those principles to my DD as well (she 4.5) and she is THRIVING like she never has. She never had digestive issues other than some constipation that started approximately a year ago. but she is a new girl on this new diet. happy. confident, lots of energy. she eats about twice as much as she used to and is so healthy right now. even our friends have noticed it - have asked us what happened to our girl?

I did/do the same as you for GAPS. definitely not doing it litterally at all. I found that that info on the digestive process etc was really enlightening it made me understand so many things. but I take what works for me and just ignore the rest. I also have that same tendency as you to get really stressed about it. knowledge is power but knowledge also has obligations... once you read, how can you ignore it? (sorry english is not my first language so maybe it's not worded right but hopefully you understand what I mean!

what diet are you on now? are you doing something similar to the GAPS diet yourself?

and BTW you are so NOT a terrible mother! look at veverything you're doing to help your LO, you're a fantastic mother!

[ZacsMumme]

Hugs lovely. Your pead is right...ultimately breast is usually best. But...(from what I've learned with T) it isn't ALWAYS best. Your amazing that you have kept at it, but if you do feel you want to or need to try neocate to see if things settle then please don't feel guilty at all. At the end of the day some babies just don't tolerate anything! My auntie is a plunket nurse and has been for 40 years. She said some babies are just allergic/intolerant to their mums milk period. Nothing to do with us or them. They just can not tolerate it.

I breastfed my first for 18 mths. And I have to admit, I do feel my bond with T through his bad patches was less in that bf Z helped us both relax. I didn't have that with T. But really, if I had kept trying - I'd be in a loony bin by now, and T would still be cr@p.

Ignorance is bliss sometimes. But I agree with Elise. I think issues also will manifest later on in life. My DH has IBS now, I wonder if as a baby if things were different his gut would be in a better state now as an adult. your a wonderful mum, and with babies like ours, it's literally about survival. You have to do what works. There is a point where it's just too much.

Is your LO on slippery elm?

[Buntybear]

My DH has IBS now

I have Crohn's, it does make you wonder how all things things are related... if they are at all

[ZacsMumme]

I agree! I'm not saying they are, but who knows...back when we were little knowledge on all this stuff was negligible.

[Buntybear]

My consultant said there was no relation at all. They are finding new things out all the time though so who knows  could be a rogue gene?

[draxela]

I love you girls, seriously. Thank you!

Elise, your English is incredible! If I could speak/write my second languages as well as you I'd be a very happy woman.

Re: my diet; I'm dairy, soy, wheat, eggs and fish free ATM, with the occasional slip up of something 'hidden'. I'm not really following GAPS myself other than taking daily probiotics and having chicken broth regularly (not daily though...)

What diet are your LOs on Elise? My DD1 doesn't eat anything that isn't homemade, but she does eat a LOT of chicken and wheat.

Sara, I'm not averse to trying Neocate, I just fear that at this stage she'll completely reject it, and I really don't want to force something odious-tasting on her just when we're starting solids. Also, I'm not sure what T's symptoms were like but A only has varying degrees of mucous and the very occasional rash. I really think her night wakings are down to hunger because she's so tiny (below 3rd percentile). We've recently started giving her a bottle for one of the NFs and she drinks a massive amount and then has a really big sleep. I think because of the TT and LT she's still very inefficient at the breast and struggles to get enough.

I'm curious - is it possible for LOs to have MFPI without being dairy intolerant?? Whenever I have a hidden dairy slip up I barely notice a reaction, but wheat and eggs cause green mucous.

[ENMS]

Elise, your English is incredible! If I could speak/write my second languages as well as you I'd be a very happy woman.

Thank you I'm very fluent as I live in a bilingual city but sometimes my posts don't come out exactly how I think them!

Has your DD been treated for her tongue tie and lip tie? They can really affect digestion. My DS has his TT clipped for good (after 3 failed attempts, it was severe and posterior) at 7 months and at that point he was on a bottle and it really really helped him.

My son has a genetic enzyme deficiency and so he can only digest limited amounts of sugar (sucrose) and starch. So despite having an enzyme replacement medication, we have to be very low sugar, and low starch. My DD can eat more things than him but for simplicity we try to get everyone to eat the same meal. So it means I have had to adapt most of my recipes and / or start cooking everything from scratch at home. So I don't follow any specific diet but I do try to eat nutrient-dense meals. I also restrict gluten, we barely eat wheat anymore, although I can't say we're 100% wheat-free, and we're low on dairy (just a bit of cheese but not too much and DS is drinking goat's milk).

Sorry hon but what is MFPI? I know of MSPI but never heard of MFPI?

It could very well by that your DD is having more issues with eggs and wheat than with dairy. If she has issues with eggs, be careful with chicken since there can be cross-reactions between the two from what I've heard.

[draxela]

So today, for the first time ever, we have blood in the stool. I'm thinking it's the chicken broth so I'm well and truly stopping that, and will also pull chicken from my diet too to see if it makes a difference. Poor little thing, she's been very very wakeful the past few nights and now I know why!

Elise, MFPI is Multiple Food Protein Intolerances.

Can I ask about your DS's TT and LT? A has had hers clipped twice and they've reattached both times so I've kind of given up that particular battle. We still use nipple shields because she has a terribly shallow latch but even on a bottle I can hear her clicking. Do you think it's worth getting them looked at again? She's 6 months now so it wouldn't be a particularly pleasant experience (the last clip was at 4 months). I've been toying with the idea of a dentist rather than going back to the GP who did it before. A's TT is 80% posterior, or something like that.

Also, Elise, how did you find out about your LO's enzyme deficiency?

Sara, you asked about slippery elm; I've just started giving it to her again today. I've been told it's very high in salicylates and some LOs can react badly, but I've also been told that its great for Crohns and colitis sufferers so I'm giving it a go.

Looking forward to NOT having to stress about my children's bowel movements some day...

[ZacsMumme]

Is it? I always thought it was good for gut healing.. period but I don't know a lot about sals intolerance...
http://www.cherishyourhealth.com.au/tag/salicylate_sensitivity/ she mentions it here being ok?
Sorry about the blood hugs

[ENMS]

Oh (((hugs))) good idea to pull the broth and you can try other meat broth next time

DS's issue was a severe posterior TT. The dr clipped it at the hospital, but it was only the easy TT that could be seen so it did nothing. Then the dentist clipped it twice with a laser. It definitely helped, but there were still many issues. I was convinced the TT was causing him issues so I kept researching and finally found a GP who is specialized in breastfeeding and TT (the only doctor that tries to clip a posterior TT here). She accepted to see us. M was 7 months by then. When we arrived, she made a huge point of telling us she probably wouldn't do anything about it, he's 7 months old, not breastfeeding anymore, there's no research that says that clipping will help anything other than breastfeeding. Then she examined him and was totally shocked!!!! She said it was the tighest one she's ever seen in her life! And she's a TT specialist  So immediately she said we can clip it, I can't promise anything but we can try if you like. We did, she did it with scissors, without anesthesia, and it changed our life. Immediately when DS had his bottle I could feel that he had pull, before I think he could drink because the bottle would drip but now I actually felt his sucking, it was amazing. I don't know how much the TT had to do with his reflux but within 2-3 weeks, he was reflux free and we stopped the first med, and the second one a month later. He also saw a chiro around that time for the reflux so it's hard to be sure what helped, but I'm sure the TT clipping helped tremendously. If you feel that it's an issue for her, definitely ask to be seen by someone else. For us the dentist was not the way but I've heard good things about it so it may be the solution for you.

I don't recall, is she on probiotics?

Looking forward to NOT having to stress about my children's bowel movements some day...

Aaahhh so do I... can't wait for that day too