UK mums - state nursery provision

[anna*]

Someone told me today that near enough NO state nurseries round us do January intake - it's all September after their 3rd birthday. With Audrey's birthday in October, that means she'll be 3 years and 11 months before she can get a place??!?

When Stan was small you could get a place from the start of the term following their third birthday - but no she said it's all changed, because no primary schools round here do January intake, the nurseries are sort of forced to follow suit??

That can't be right surely? That means that a baby born in August would have two years of nursery experience (not to mention two years of free childcare for a working parent) before starting at school, where as Audrey will have one?

[C&B&E]

Our nursery at a childrens centre did January intakes 

[*Ali*]

No Anna an Aug baby will still only have one year as they will start reception the month after they turn 4yo (legally they can wait until after the turn 5yo to start FT school but hardly anyone does these days). So actually it is better to have a birthday earlier in the year as if you take up the 15hrs straight away you can get an extra two terms in.

Here school nurseries only do Sept intake but preschools and private nurseries will take kids the term after they turn 3yo which is when they get their free 15-hr entitlement. It does rely on them having space though and the good ones may well be full with kids who already started in Sept.

My two are victims of this. Cadan was 3yo in December and just started nursery attached on our primary school this week. He was entitled to his 15hrs from January but I wanted him to go to the school nursery and he couldn't get in until Sept so that would have meant two terms at a preschool and then moving which I decided against. In fact his school nursery did say if they have empty places they take children with September birthdays the month they turn 3 and then they offer children with oct birthdays, then nov then dec birthdays and so on to start in January but since they are normally oversubscribed they rarely get past the September birthdays. And those kids do then get 2yrs of nursery.

Colby is Aug and will start school nursery next year in Sept a month after he turns 3yo.

HTH

[*Liz*]

Places not an issue here as there are no state preschools - we all use playgroups and private nurseries for our 15 hours,

But the funding does mean some kids get more if they start the term after they turn 3. Jacob is a Sept birthday so was funded from Jan 12 until starting school Sept 13 ie 5 terms. Megan is May so is funded Sept 13 - sept 14 ie 3 terms.

[creations]

If you write/email your local council they will send a full list of all the local providers including childminders and private day nurseries who are listed for the 15 hr provision.  You will be able to register (often need to do it early) for a day nursery for the term following the 3rd birthday (so January for A) and do 2 terms there whilst also registering for your chosen state nursery for the following sept (3 terms).

I was a bit lost and unsure how I felt about it when I first started looking but honestly now I feel like it is a better option to do a term or two in a private day nursery.  The one I have registered DS at is great, a much smaller group of kids (roughly 16 kids to 2 staff, if the group reaches 20 kids they get another staff member in compared to the state nursery which has 32 kids in a group and 2 staff) and is much more 'homely', to me it looks and feels like a much kinder/gentler introduction to 'school'.  The state nursery is far more class rooms and corridors iykwim where as the day nursery looks much more like play group. I'm actually really happy that he will have a term to transition and get used to being left alone before he goes into a larger group and a more 'school' type environment.

One of the most popular here has the places filled about 18-24 months in advance and is unlikely to take January starters, they will take the child early, at September with the parents paying for the provision for that term which then secures the place.
Where I have registered DS they will start at any point in the year so long as when you register they have not yet filled their spaces, so I put his name down around April time for a start next April and am guaranteed a place now.  I even considered leaving him there for his full 4 terms because it seems to much nicer, so much more what kids should be doing (playing and learning to socialise, learning to help themselves to lunch, pour drinks, go to the toilet etc), I still might, although my hope would be that he went to the state nursery and then got a place at that school, so would have made friends to start reception with and be used to the environment etc.

[cuckoochick]

We are struggling with this too. I want C to go to a school nursery rather than a private one. We may not get a start at the state nursery until next September so are currently exploring sending her for her free hrs at 2 local independent schools. Have some visits lined up in the next fortnight.

The school nursery I want C to go to is v popular and because nursery places aren't allocated by catchment and purely on D.O.B. They fill up straight away in September although there may be a few afternoon slots free (least popular choice!)

[anna*]

The official council policy is that children can apply for a place on w they turn three but in practice spaces only really come free in September.

Tbh I don't think we'd send her to a private place. The round here they have a minimum tenure that is waaaay more than 15 hrs so end up v expensive. The best state nursery is our nearest, it does full days if you want/need, and has amazing outdoor spaces, so rare in London. The other great state nursery near here actually teaches them swimming, hence why Stan is so confident in the water.

[creations]

A mum I know is paying for her son to join the state nursery this Sept as his free hours wouldn't start until January but they rarely do a January start (depends on numbers) so she has managed to secure a place that way, only paying the 15 hrs.  It's not something I'd be interested in but may be an option for you?

[anna*]

I don't think any of our nurseries ever have paying kids. Definitely not something I've heard of ever happening. I'll enquirer but it seems to me that if they're full, then paying wouldn't make a space come free, yk?

[*Ali*]

What about a preschool like those at children's centres or in Church halls?

[cuckoochick]

The official council policy is that children can apply for a place on w they turn three but in practice spaces only really come free in September.

This is certainly the case for the popular state school nurseries around here. We could get her in a private daycare in a flash but I'd like her to go to a school nursery hence why I'm looking at independent schools rather than a private day nursery.

Hope you can get something sorted Anna. C is so ready for nursery that we really don't feel waiting until next September is a good option for us.

[anna*]

I don't know the difference between a preschool or a nursery - I don't think there's a distinction in this borough.

I did find out that we can apply as soon as she's two. A friend did get lucky and got offered a place from January (LO turns 3 in December) so maybe we'll be lucky, or maybe she would get a place from the September where she turns 3 in October.

[cuckoochick]

Yeah lots of councils are offering places from 2 if you are eligible from certain criteria.

[anna*]

Our really great local nursery offers places from 2 but only with a referral from a Dr or HV - so kids with certain problems or with parents who need that support.

[cuckoochick]

Yes but I think people who are in receipt of certain benefits are entitled here too. I know some people whose LOs have been offered places for that reason. I guess different councils will have different levels of finding?

[anna*]

I'm sure that's right ^^
I guess all I can do is put her name down in a couple of months time and hope for the best!

[cuckoochick]

Good luck with it. It's frustrating for sure that she might miss out on a few terms because she was born a few months out!

[creations]

I don't think any of our nurseries ever have paying kids. Definitely not something I've heard of ever happening. I'll enquirer but it seems to me that if they're full, then paying wouldn't make a space come free, yk?

I didn't think that state nurseries would take payment either but it's happening here for that first term prior to LO getting their free hours.
The point about payment is that the place is taken from September so they DO get a place where as if you hoped for a January start they wouldn't get a place if there was no January start in that year or in that nursery.
I also know someone got a September start with an October birthday but again paid for the first term because the free hours do not begin at the 3rd birthday but the term following the 3rd birthday.

If you look at the available preschools and day nurseries in your area you might find you like one of them for 2 terms and apply for the state school provision form the September.  You can look up the ofsted reports for all the private day nurseries, see their website, visit them and chat etc.  I honestly didn't think I would be so attracted to the private day nursery that I registered DS at, it took me by surprise how good it is and how much they do with the kids.

[*Ali*]

The free two year old places are for those with benefits or special needs or under social services. Run of the mill working families earning over about 16k a year are not eligible. It is a national thing that started this month.

Sorry,  by preschool I mean those nurseries that aren't attached to schools but are not a private daycare.  So they don't do all day care while parents work they just have two three-hour sessions morning and afternoons. All the kids just go for one or the other.  They generally take place in halls in churches or community centres and the like. Around here they tend to be under subscribed so it is easier to get a place.

[anna*]

Oh right. OK I haven't made that distinction. Of the places nearby, two are 'stand-alone', two are attached to schools, but they all seem to have similar entry criteria. They all do either mornings or afternoons only to start, but at some point (with Stan it was his last two terms) can offer full days (9-3). In fact, the two placesI would really like to go to are both pre-schools by that definition - up to rising 5 only, not attached to a school. But heavily oversubscribed. Maybe because most primary schools in the borough DONT have nurseries attached?

[*Ali*]

Yeah maybe

[Hedgehog17]

There is only one local authority run nursery in our district council area, and it happens to be the one DS goes to!

He is currently in the 0-3yo section but will move up to the 3-5yo section in January when he gets his 15 hrs funding (September birthday). We were advised that to get a place we should enrol him in the 0-3 section for at least a term first (eventually we decided to put him in for 2 terms + over this summer doing just 2 mornings a week) and we got our first choice place (5 mornings) in the 3-5 section  The nursery is in the same building as the Sure Start Childrens Centre so we had been using that for ages before DS started nursery.

All the other nurseries and pre-schools around here are private, some are attached to primary schools, but afaik they start children at any time of year..

I think the problem is that Audrey was born in a boom year so there are a lot more children than places unfortunately  My DS (who will be 1 school year ahead of her) may find it difficult to get into our first choice of primary school due to this as well 

If she does have to wait, is the childminder able to provide suitable activities for her which would be similar to what they do at nursery?