Night wakes and props connected? 5.5mth old

[Jennzed]

Hi there,
I hope you guys can help me figure this out. I started a thread on here about a month ago looking for help and I definitely improved some things, but still struggling....

5.5 mth DS
3.75/4h EASY
Activity time 2H between morning wake and first nap. Others, 2.5 hour activity times.
2 naps and a 30min catnap each day. Goes something like this:

7:30am wake, BF
8:30am solids (started solids a week ago, but sleep issues and props been happening for a long time)
9:30am nap (can't get him to sleep more than 45 min consecutively. Sometimes I can re-settle and extend another fee minutes)
10:15am wake
11:00am BF
12pm solids
12:45pm nap
1:30pm wake (this is the easiest nap to extend a little with re-settling)
2:30pm BF
3:00pm snack, mum mum crackers, yogurt snacks
5:00pm catnap (always 30 minutes, to the minute nearly!)
5:30pm wake
5:45pm BF
6:15p. Solids dinner
7:30pm BF
7:45/8pm bed
Night wakes - Tuesday: 10pm, 2am, 5am. Wednesday 9pm, 4:45am, 6:30am. Thursday: 8:30pm, 3:30am, 5:30am. Friday: 10:45pm, 1:30am, 5am.

Positives: daytime routine is pretty good. I'm catching his sleepy cues. Feeds well. Solids going well.
Challenges:
-  propping to sleep: swaddle, paci, walk around quietly for a minute, then sit down holding him and bounce a little till he closes eyes. Try to transfer promptly. Shush pat if he stirs on transfer. If he wakes up early, repeat the above. Never able to re-settle without picking him up.
- wakes from naps after 40-45min
- wakes several times per night. Rarely sleeps longer than a 4-hour stretch. Usually 1 longer stretch of sleep, followed by several wakes between 4am-7:30am
- I'm so tired from all the wakes, I end up taking him into bed and feeding sidelying for at least one of the wakes each night. He ends up sleeping in my bed for 1-2 hours and is hard to move back into his bed.

I don't know what to think the short naps and night wakes are caused by.
Maybe that he can't settle himself after stirring from a cycle?
How would you tackle the holding/rocking to sleep at this age?

Thanks so much for reading!

[becj86]

This should answer most of your questions.
All about the 3-2 transition- 5/6 months

I'd reckon the NW's early in the night are short-term OT from the shorter naps - extend A times to get longer naps, even if you have to resettle at 30min for a few days to get the new A times bedded down.

The NW's in the early hours of the morning are most likely due to 2hr A time first up - at this age, should be more like 2.5 at least and closer to 2:45-3hr. When LO knows he's getting a nap so early on in the morning, there is little incentive to sleep in the early morning

[matisse22]

I also do think your night wakings are related to props. Sounds like you are holding too long. At this stage, you should be able to put baby into crib wide awake and baby should know how to settle. 

[Jennzed]

Thanks, I'm unsure of whether to use shush pat or PUPD?

I will read up on the 3-2 transition. The thing is....he seems ready for all his naps when I put him down at 2-2.5 hours, but the short naps, so I guess that's under tired.
Now that you're saying, there were two times this week we were out and about and he didn't go down till 3 hours, and he slept 1h-1h15.

Do you also think he needs an earlier bedtime? We're working with 7:45/8 because that's when our toddler is going. But I could do earlier...if you think?

[becj86]

Do you also think he needs an earlier bedtime? We're working with 7:45/8 because that's when our toddler is going. But I could do earlier...if you think?

Only if you're prepared for WU to get earlier I think once his naps are restorative, you'll find the NW's in the early part of the night will settle down.

The thing is....he seems ready for all his naps when I put him down at 2-2.5 hours, but the short naps, so I guess that's under tired.

This is often the case when a LO has had the same A time for a while - they get used to it and feel sleepy even if they're not really tire enough - you've set his body clock to sleep 2hr after waking for the day...

PUPD is a last resort method. I would stick with shush/pat, especially while you're sorting out ore age-appropriate timings - you could well find he doesn't take such an effort to get to sleep if he's more tired when you put him down.

[Jennzed]

Hi, thanks so much. I seriously never thought about it being the 3-2, so I'm so happy I posted.

Naps weren't very good today, as we were out til 2pm so he had 2 car naps and the cat nap. But bedtime at 8pm went well. I'm going to stick with the 8pm bed. As you've pointed out, earlier=earlier wakes and I don't want that. This bedtime has always worked with our daughter.

So I will try 2:45-3h A times for a couple days and report back.

I am currently feeding him twice in the night, if he wakes. Like 1am and 4am. Should I be trying to settle without feeding?

Thanks wonderful ladies!

[becj86]

2 night feeds is great for this age - keep them - 6mo growth spurt will be along shortly in all likelihood

[matisse22]

Thanks, I'm unsure of whether to use shush pat or PUPD?

I will read up on the 3-2 transition. The thing is....he seems ready for all his naps when I put him down at 2-2.5 hours, but the short naps, so I guess that's under tired.
Now that you're saying, there were two times this week we were out and about and he didn't go down till 3 hours, and he slept 1h-1h15.

Do you also think he needs an earlier bedtime? We're working with 7:45/8 because that's when our toddler is going. But I could do earlier...if you think?

When I make the switch to two naps, i always move bedtime 30 minutes earlier...and then if there is a lot of waking, I move it another 15 minutes earlier. My kids rarely get up earlier. If wakeup is 7:30, then baby should be in bed by 7:30 the latest, if you ask me.

Also, two of my kids went down for their morning nap about 1.5 hours after getting up. Then the he second nap would be 3 hours later. I like the short gap in the morning because we can then get out of the house early for activities, but my current 7 month old is ready for a nap about 1.15 minutes after getting up for the day. She doesn't nap very long (an hour), but she takes a super long afternoon nap. My point, they don't' need two super long naps, they just need enough nap that they are restored ;-) If they wake happy, they got enough sleep.

i'd wait till after the growth spurt and then work on the 1am waking.  But keep in mind that after that 6 month wonder period, you are in PU/PD territory, no more shush/pat.  The later is just too much stimulation! In fact, my current baby can't even be picked up when she is upset. She needs to resettle herself with me giving her my hand in the crib. So just be sure you don't overstimulate, they can't settle then, and/or require nursing.

[Jennzed]

Hi there, I need some moral support. Pretty mixed up with all this right now. 6 months old now.

Current successes: 3 hour A time is going fine. He goes down well for naps. For us, that means swaddle, paci, hold him til drowsy, or sleeping, transition to crib, and if he stirs, gently shush and lightly bounce the mattress til he settles. Been on solids for 3 weeks, going well, he seems very hungry and ready for them. Still BF-ing 5 times in 24hrs.

Challenges: naps are still 45 min, even with 3rd nap gone. Because he's short-napping, he's up 4.5 hours-ish till bed time. Then he goes down easily, but wakes multiple times. Last night 4 times between 8pm and 10:30. Finally so exhausted I brought him in bed with me and fed him. Woke 1:30 fed, woke 5am Fed, and then put him in his bed and he still woke at 6:30am. It's a struggle to get him to do 13 hours sleep in 24 hours. I want to remove props, but feel I should get his EASYsettled first, so I can read him better.

* he has a slight cold right now, but is acting pretty much same as usual. Also. We were away this past weekend 3hrs ahead time zone, but I kept him on our time zone, his naps were all 30 minutes, but he was having only one night wake.

Tuesday
Wake 6:20am (night wakes were 10:45, 1:55, 4:40, 5:30)
E solids 7:30am (BF WAS 5:30am)
S 8:30am-9:00am, 9:05am-10:20am
E BF 10:30am, solids 12pm
S 1:10pm-1:53pm
S 2:25pm-4pm
E BF 4:20pm, solids 6pm, BF 7:05pm
S 7:40pm (wakes 8:05pm, 9pm, 9:50pm, 10:40pm BF, 2:00 BF, 3:20am BF, 5am BF, 6:10 wake for day)

Wednesday
Wake 6:10am (BF at 5am)
E solids 8am
S 9-930am, 9:45-9:55
E BF 11:50am
S 12pm-12:30pm
E solids 1pm
S 2:20-3pm
E BF 4:45-4:55, solids 6:45pm
S 7:35pm (wakes 7:55pm, 8:17pm BF, 11:30 BF, 4:45am BF, 6:10am, 7:05am BF)

Thursday
Wake 7:05
E BF 7:10am, solids 8:30
S 10am-11:00am
E BF 12pm, solids 1pm
S 1:55-2:30pm, 2:55-3:22pm
E BF 5pm, solids 6:30pm
S 7:40pm (wakes 8:30pm, 9pm, 9:45pm BF, 10:20pm, 10:35pm BF, 1:25am BF, 5am BF, 6:30am)

Thank you so much for reading

[becj86]

hold him til drowsy, or sleeping, transition to crib,

Now he's 6 months, this is likely why he's needing a resettle rather than self-settling at 45min. You can use gradual withdrawal (PD drowsy but awake and increasingly awake as he learns to fall asleep in his bed with shush/pat or whatever settling you're doing while he's in the cot).

Have a read of what's going on in his brain right now: http://www.thewonderweeks.com/mental-leap-5/
This is what leads to him needing to be in the same place when he stirs at 45min as he was when he fell asleep so he can self-settle back into that next sleep cycle without waking fully.