The final stages of the 1-0

[ZacsMumme]

I think were possibly in them

With a nap Z won't settle to sleep till 8.30-9 and is up at 7-7.30 (his usual WU) 1.5 hr nap ATM (I can cap but he hates being woken)
Without a nap BT is 5.30-6 and WU 7-7.30

BUT every 3 days to so he needs a nap, he can't last till 5.30 and I fear much earlier will result in EW anyway where he won't be able to then last again to 530

So...where do we go to from here?

[*Kara*]

Welcome

I started using car naps when it was like this... just 15-20 mins to take the edge off so we could get through dinner and off to bed.. .I found that she was much happier to be woken if she was going somewhere and not just mom telling her to get up

[ZacsMumme]

I would love it if Z could nap in the car. It's virtually impossible to get either of them to nap if the other kid is in the car though! Sometimes I can do car naps for T (2-1) as Z goes to his nanas/daycare etc but it's almost never I can get this for Z

I gave him a nap today 2-3pm and he was 'ok' I think I timed it right for light sleep but that's so hard to do!

[creations]

I'm so glad our nap is gone. Months of waking crying from his nap and being a grouch most of the afternoon to only brighten up just before BT!
Sorry, not much advice, I don't plan DS's catch up naps he just takes one in the car if/when he is tried enough to nod off in the lulling environment, heater on, movement, radio...  i give him 10 or 20 mins, helps if I wake him and say we are at the4 shop rather than at home though, home = upset, shop = fun.
But, what about an extra snack in the afternoon, maybe cake (some sugar energy) and a drink to help him through to BT?  I did do one or two EBTs at 5.00 but our night is not as long as yours (6am to 6.30am WU)
If you feel like experimenting, DS did his total drop after a 2.5hr nap when he was ill so maybe do one longer nap every couple weeks instead of a shorter one every 3 days?  Just a random, out there, idea.

[TB9]

I just offered a nap every other day, and put up with the later bedtime until she was ready to go every day without

[michaeljacknnugg]

I think we just increased the number of days between naps - DS didn't reallocate respond to capping either. Could you do 3 days then 4 days then 3 etc for now and then move to nap every fourth day when he's ready?

[ZacsMumme]

Mmm good food for thought. He can already go 2-3 days without one. So we would be looking at 2x a week most likely and on these days how long would you give. On an hr one yesterday he didn't go to sleep till after 8.30 (BT 8 )

[michaeljacknnugg]

Does he cope with capping?

I didn't cap in the end as he was just grumpy and lethargic until the normal time his nap would have ended. I let him take as long as he needed and just lengthened the time in between naps. Does that make sense?

[ZacsMumme]

I did 1 hr yesterday capped but if I cap at the wrong time, or too early he typically is TERRIBLE afterwards if I don't cap he will nap for hours - so I have had to cap his nap since 1 nap as he's always napped his life away

After a 2 hr nap at my mums last week he was up till 9pm hen up at 7 so the night was really short and we then get in that predicament of does he have a nap that day from the short night or not

On the 1 hr nap yesterday he had this
WU 7.15/30 I just went in and he was awake.
Nap 1.45-3 but he wasn't asleep till 2
BT 8.15 (in bed at 8 and books) but not asleep till after 8.30 maybe 8.40 asleep?

WU I'm waiting but not sureif. He's just lying there awake

On a NND he does this
WU 7.15/30
BT between 5.30-6
He usually does a 13-14 hr night with 1 brief ENW if daycare days or on the 2,3 NND

[michaeljacknnugg]

Wow, that's a monster night! Maybe keep at an hour then but stretch the time between naps?

[ZacsMumme]

Yeah he's been a good sleeper since the 2-1 and then he would do 3 hr naps and 12 hr nights it won't last but he is very good at tacking on.

So that would mean 8.30 BT ugh.....maybe I. Should wake him at 7am to get a more reasonable BT?

* sorry I just realised did you mean stretch no of days between naps?

[michaeljacknnugg]

Yup - you're heading for no naps ever so might as well get there asap!

[*Kara*]

Honestly hun, when we got to the point that BT pushed out that far and we still had a normal wake time (leaving you with a short night and a very hard day without a nap), I just cut it out completely.  We had the same issues as creations mentioned - brutal after I woke and just crabby all around.

It was a tough couple of weeks to get used to it and we had some very early bedtimes, but we came out the other side okay!

[ZacsMumme]

I was afraid you would say that kara lol.
Tbh I think it would be easier in some ways to go CT but I'm terrified Z will get too OT. We used EBT to ward it off, and it works BUT given BT is EBT without a nap anyway I'm not sure how I'd ward it off if he started NW and ew if BT was already in the 5s... We get OT NW almost all NND - very brief sometimes not really awake he stays in bed. We sometimes also get a midnight NW or nt but touch wood they haven't occurred in a while and I wonder how much of them was related to him being sick.

Today he had a NND...BT 5.45 and NW 6.40 maybe I'll try stick with a short nap 2 x a week and see how it goes first. If he copes then the jump will be less horrid!

[creations]

I know this sounds back to front but I saw fewer NWs when the nap was gone.  DS could not do NNDs, I tried and he was not only OT he was a *danger* - all his regular rules of life were totally forgotten (like he ran in a car park - never done that before or since) and would have terrible falls etc, really dangerous not just bad tempered. So I plugged on with the capped naps and utterly AWFUL mood for hours after capping, then NWs.  Not pretty.  Several months later when he dropped the nap (and was tired but no longer a danger to himself and others) he slept so much better at night (but when I say gone, he was getting 5 or 10 mins in the car a couple of times per week which I know you can't do).  I suppose what I'm saying is the NWs won't necessarily get worse when you totally drop the nap.

Maybe making BT 5.30 rather than 5.45 each night would help?  An extra 15 mins every day rather than switching between nap and NNDs?