Short nights and short naps

[anna*]

How old is he now Berni?

It was never an issue with Stan because by that time he was sleeping with the door cracked anyway. I believe - although I've never tried it - that you can set it so that at 'night' the light is totally off and only lights up when it is 'morning'.

When we got the Groclock first it was like going through sleep training again. A few rough mornings, then he got the hang of what was required.

[*Becky*]

both kids have a gro-clock and both have pitch black rooms. We just turned the light on the clock off (you can) so it is dark and then the sun comes up at 6.50am for M and 7.15pm for H.....we went through one weird patch with M where she was EWing but we are back to her waking somewhere between 6.15-7am, usual is around 6.30am and she waits for the sun but this am we had a 7.15am lie-in! xx

FWIW H could not sleep with a blue light on, it would really disrupt him so I was v pleased that you can turn the light on the clock off.

[mumofalice]

Thanks for the replies ladies - if you can turn the light off then I think it's definitely worth a try then. Didn't seem like that was the case when I read the reviews online  I love that I can get better advice from my lovely BW friends 

How old is he now Berni?

He is the ripe old age of 21 months!

It was never an issue with Stan because by that time he was sleeping with the door cracked anyway.

Funny you should mention this as I always wondered when that would happen - but DD still can't sleep with her door open - it has to be firm shut!

When we got the Groclock first it was like going through sleep training again.

I feel like I'm permanently ST the little man LOL!

but this am we had a 7.15am lie-in! xx

How lovely 

[*Becky*]

def give it a go..DS was 22 months when we started, DD 26 months.

[mumofalice]

It is ordered and should arrive courtesy of Santa next week 

He sure is a little man of mystery . . . here's a couple of examples:

Last Friday DH had some lieu time he needed to take so we went Christmas shopping. DS had woken around 5.30am give or take (his usual) and I knew that it was going to be a bit of a nightmare day nap wise, etc as we were out and about - however, he was in the buggy so I thought he would probably nod off (bit of APOP napping!) - who was I kidding?  He managed to stay awake all through the shopping, then we had lunch (around his usual time) I changed him and put him back in the buggy around his usual nap time - he still didn't fall asleep and even stayed awake through the train ride home! He finally crashed as we started to walk back from the station - by which time it was 1.30pm  He slept for 45 mins - wasn't expecting much more and couldn't transfer him to the cot either to see if he'd go back off as we were going to DD's achievement assembly.

Today he woke around the same time (5.30-ish) and after dropping DD off at school I left him in the buggy and walked down to our local 'town' (same walk we did to the station the other day) and when I stopped off at shop I realised he was fast asleep in the buggy - and that was at 9.15am  Seriously that is just as shocking as a mammoth A time. He slept for about 30 minutes. I put him back down just after 1pm in the hope he'd have at least a short nap around his usual time but 20 mins later and he's still chuntering!

[*Becky*]

he sounds v similar to M tbh....I think they are the types that can easily go past tired and get a bit 'wired' yk? M always faffs about after her one morning at nursery each week and I know she is exhausted but she just seems hyper. I do know for M that sleep begets sleep...that day you said he did a really good nap and then a good night - he probably does need that but how you get it regularly is the tricky bit. The gro-clcok has helped us a lot in that M knows we won't be getting her up when she first wakes now and so will hang out and often dozes. Before the clock we were always in the 5am hour

[Joy-filled]

I really hope the gro-clock improves things for you and your DS! 

I've continued to follow your thread as out of all the other LOs, it seems you and Becky have the most similar LOs to my DS.  I've found Becky's insights into your DS so helpful and I think both your DS and mine really truly are OT and do need the sleep - it's just tricky to figure out how help them get that sleep regularly.   Sleep begets sleep for my LO too but I can't seem to figure out how to help him consistently get it.  However, I am very happy that he has finally learned to SS (more often than not) when he wakes up crying mid-nap.   Perhaps with the gro-clock your DS will learn to do that for his nap too?  But, on the other hand, as Anna said in a previous post

Some kids are just not good sleepers, and nothing we can do will change them

Are you doing set naps/BT?  If so, what times are you doing these days?

[mumofalice]

Hi all *waving*

Haven't been on the boards much (did a bit of lurking to get a fix  ) over the festive period - so thought I'd just pop on with an update.

I would love to be shouting from the rooftops that things have massively improved but with all the madness of the festive season things didn't really improve at all - TBH I didn't really expect much as our 'routine' (I use the term routine very loosely LOL!) tends to get a bit off track when DD is on hols and there's no school runs, etc.

The good news is that naps tend to be a bit longer than they used to - and are more regularly around the 2h mark, not always but even sometimes is an improvement (celebrating even the smallest of victories over here  ) The bad news is that the EW are still with us - we did have a few post 6am WUs in the week before Christmas and I did wonder if we were finally on the right track - however, as I said earlier, the festive madness seemed to put all that to pot and we returned to our pre-6am WUs.

Santa did bring the Gro-clock (lucky DS  ) but I have to admit that I haven't actually moved it into DS's room until last night  DH did plug it in downstairs and he showed DS the sun a few times so he had an idea what was going on (kept saying 'light' when he walked past it). I did keep meaning to move it but then I'd sit down to read a BT story (after bath, etc) and realise it was still downstairs, and so another night would pass  Yes, I am that rubbish 

Anyway, this morning was day one of Operation Gro-clock and true to form DS woke before 6am (I read the sleepy farm book that came with the clock at BT last night and explained that we had to wait for the sun before we could wake up). When he started calling for me I went it and told him that the sun was still sleeping and it was still BT, I laid him down with his muslins and his monkey (his new 'lovey' since he received it on the Santa Train just before Christmas - and I said Monkey was still sleeping too). He did cry on and off and I returned to him a few times (didn't actually count but would say in total it was 4 or 5 times) and said the same thing over and over - although he didn't go back to sleep he was still laying down the whole time - which in itself is unusual and felt like a positive step as he normally just sits right back up if I lay him down. I did wonder as I returned to him if I should've set the WU time earlier that I actually wanted (and moved it gradually as he got accustomed to the idea) so that it wasn't such a long time to wait, iykwim? But we survived til 7am and he was very excited about the 'light' in his room - might have also had something to do with the song and dance his Mummy performed when she went in 

Okay, there's a couple of things I wanted to comment on but I need to go and get on with the BT routine - hopefully BBL.

[anna*]

Sounds like you both did great! If he usually wakes at (say) 5.40am, I would set the clock for 6am and then AS SOON AS he manages to stay quiet/or go back to sleep until 6, move the clock on in 10 mins increments every couple of days. On the other hand, seeing as this morning really went quite well, you could equally just leave it as it is. Stan was a little bit older (24 months) but we told him, if you see the moon mummy is sleeping. Then left him to it, didn't go to him, just called out from my room "Mummy is sleeping!" every so often.

[*Becky*]

How's it going?

[mumofalice]

Back again *waving*

Just thought I'd update on where we're at now - I was sure that I had been back with an update since Operation Gro Clock began but I either imagined it or I lost the post 

All in all things are still not great - the Gro Clock didn't solve all our sleep problems but I guess I didn't really expect it too 

DS still wakes on average around 5.30/5.40am - but we also had a 5.02am and a 5.08am waking last week  I kept the WU time set at 7am. He will chat to himself for a while (usually playing out little scenarios, singing songs, etc) and then will usually say 'Mummy out please' (to which I will reply 'The sun is still sleeping, Mummy is still sleeping') or his new phrase 'Mummy light on please' - his way of telling me that he wants the sun on  He does seem to get how it works, ie we say goodbye to the sun and nap and BT and if I ask him what do we have to wait for when we wake up he will say 's(h)iney' (his word for sunshine), if I ask him what to do if the stars are there he says 'bed' - he just doesn't practice what he preaches so to speak!

I still have no idea how to tell when he's tired  He will literally keep on going til he drops. His one saving grace used to be that when I put him down for BT he would go to sleep within mins - I reckon he takes about 30mins on average (chatting away to himself) to go to sleep now. As soon as I put him down in his cot he starts rolling around and messing about - I just say Goodnight and leave. I don't generally have to go back to him but he's thrashing around for a while. When I put him down for nap he will chat for about 5-10mins - not sure if this is just what he needs to do to settle 

So at the moment our 'routine' (if you can call it that!) looks like this . . .
WU: 5.30-5.40am (out of cot at 7am)
Nap: 12.30/45 for up to 2hrs (Gro Clock set for 2.30pm WU)
BT: 7pm (usually asleep by half past)

I've just started pushing the nap a bit (despite the extremely long morning A time) towards 12.45 as he's recently started waking earlier from it. I say it's up to 2 hrs but more often now it's down to 1.5hrs - sometimes 1.75hrs.

We have the odd NWs but for the most part he does STTN - even if it is only for 10hrs  He usually just wants a cuddle, which I do in the cot, and he will got back off.

Despite all of the above I do have to share some good news - we've just had 2 post 6am WUs in a row  Wednesday was 6.40am and today was around 6.30am  I'm pretty sure both days he cried out at 5-something but he didn't wake and chat til much later. FX we're finally turning a corner as DS hurtles towards his 2nd bday  but just in case we're not any advice is still welcome 

[*Becky*]

He sounds so like M! We STILL have EWings every few weeks or so and then we have a good patch, then EWings, it has always been this way.

Great news about the 2 later mornings. At this age we were doing a 1pm nap for 2 hours with M.

I would stick to what you are doing but maybe set the nap at 1pm. Yes it is a long morning but we found M can handle that and tbh I would rather than than a really long time to bed! Stick with the gro-clock and happy dance when he waits. We role play whenever we can about staying asleep/quiet until the sun goes up, they do get the message after a while! I try to leave M to it and rarely go in, only when she is being v noisy/singing etc.

[mumofalice]

He sounds so like M! We STILL have EWings every few weeks or so and then we have a good patch, then EWings, it has always been this way.

I'm keeping my FX that N will start having good patches that last more than 1 or 2 days - followed by weeks of EWs 

I am pushing the nap towards 1pm - but I can't let him sleep for 2 hrs at that time. Gro-clock is set to come back on 1t 2.30pm after nap (he does sometimes sleep past it coming on) but I have to get him up at 2.45pm latest to pick A up from school. Have to admit that waking him is not a pleasant experience really - TBH I'm not sure I would be over the moon if someone woke me up, dressed me in outdoor clothes and then bundled me into a sling/backpack/buggy to do the school run all with in the space of 5 mins!

I will keep plodding along the same road - after the 2 later mornings he returned to his 5.30/40am WU for a couple of days but we have had a couple more post 6am WU and believe it or not he slept til 7.02am one morning (or at least that's when I first heard him!  )

[*Becky*]

yes 2.45pm is our cut off too but we cap M's nap to 1 hour now.

Have to admit that waking him is not a pleasant experience really - TBH I'm not sure I would be over the moon if someone woke me up, dressed me in outdoor clothes and then bundled me into a sling/backpack/buggy to do the school run all with in the space of 5 mins!

totally agree with this! Am hoping the warmer weather will make it a bit more pleasant.