Author Topic: Help for a friend?  (Read 2246 times)

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Offline anna*

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Help for a friend?
« on: February 03, 2014, 22:24:45 pm »
My dear friend M, one of the gentlest, kindest, most compassionate souls I know, is having a really rough time with her daughter E, who will be two in May.

It sounds like E is pretty much ruling the roost with her sleep. She is up for the day at like 4.30am, with a couple of NWs. Trouble is, if she gets at all upset she will start banging her head really hard against the cot - hard enough that she'll have a big bruise that lasts for days. Which of course M finds really upsetting and goes to her because she feels like she can't leave her to brain herself on the cot!

At the moment M is sleeping on the floor in E's room - because her older son was being woken all the time and getting upset at E's distress.

She goes for a nap at 1pm every day - it could be anything from 45 mins to 2 hours. Sometimes she goes straight to sleep, other times she insists on having M stay with her.

M is in a bad state. She is going on two years of disturbed sleep now and six months of 4.30-5am wakings. She's feeling resentful and overwhelmed. She's trying to set up a business and super busy so since she had typed out a bunch of stuff to me I said I would post here for her and come back with questions, and maybe she'll join the thread later...

Here's what M sent me:

"So, she started waking up in the summer we let self-settle, which she did sometimes, but woke up again half an hour later, & then it just got progressively worse & earlier & she would just cry forever & not give up, & be absolutely totally beside herself (like beyond redemption). I had to go in to her to try get her to calm down. A week of that and it upsetting Dyllon so much, I had to pull the plug on trying to get her to self-settle & would bring her through to our room to try calm her & at least be able to let us all have some sleep. Then I started staying with her in her room to get her back to sleep, to get her out the habit of being in our room. She'd wake up, & I'd lay next to her cot on the floor - it worked for a bit, but then even putting her down at night or for naps during the day, I'd have to stay with her till she was asleep. Then the wakings at random times stopped but the early rising started...she would wake for the day sometimes 5.30, sometimes 6, but it always got earlier & earlier...till eventually since beginning December, 2 or 3 times at night again. She has had colds on and off, and beginning December seemed to have a cold virus, which kinda explained the waking up, but it hasn't stopped.

She'd wake up & I'd try the stay with her till she fell asleep thing, but then would wake up again & I'm not there, so start screaming again, and as soon as I went in, she'd lay down and go back to sleep. I got so tired of getting up and going through, I just set up spare mattress so I could at least try sleep inbetween the wakings...

But she still wakes up and goes mental if you don't get her out her cot now....like going mental & harming herself in the cot even if I'm there in the room with her. Also if I'm not.

I've been to the docs soooo many times (at least 15!!!!) cos I just find it really hard to believe that there can't be something wrong with her, the way she goes off sometimes (mothers intuition?), but they cannot find a thing wrong with her, other than a cold. I can tell when she's in pain, and maybe when it's not so much bad pain, but something niggling her.

That's why, my only conclusion is that she just cannot deal with pain, she doesn't have the temperament others do, and that I have become her sleep aid, in trying to do the training with her?

Interested to hear what you think....

I really feel like I'm being held hostage too, and I don't want you to think bad of me for saying this, but it's making me really 'hate' her (obviously I love my baby deeply, but the way she is is making me feel really bitter and angry about the situation - it's very hard to be loving and understanding when you gave this never ending crap to deal with every freaking night.

The weird thing is, I know she can self settle! Most nights (99%) I put her to bed awake and let her go to sleep, which she does just fine. Other nights she'll have a bee in her bonnet and kick off and only go to sleep if I'm there."





Offline anna*

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2014, 22:33:29 pm »
I remember not long ago helping out a mum on here whose daughter would pull out her hair when she was distressed - she actually just had to ride it out - a few days of hair pulling, but then she was less distressed going to sleep, so she'd pull out her hair less etc. But that's not the same as walking around with a great big bruise on her head! :(





Offline amayzie

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2014, 09:18:25 am »
Hmm- it does seem to have a pain component doesn't it.. I am wondering though if it she could try something to help 'ride it out' just in case it is a behavoural thing- can she get something like pool noodles or similar around the cot bars? So that she can't hurt her head if she tries banging?

I'm also wondering if there might be some sort of separation anxiety issue... can she try something like co-sleeping, or moving the cot in with them for a little while if possible? This might help to get her out of the pattern? Are there other strategies to deal with separation anxiety- something like getting a pillow that your friend has slept with for a period so it smells like her?
Katy, Mummy to Hamish!


Offline anna*

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2014, 09:55:02 am »
Even with M sleeping on the floor in the same room, E still starts bashing her head if M doesn't get her out of the cot right away. I will check with M but pretty sure they are scared of co-sleeping, because they feel like they'll never get her out of the room once she's in!





Offline HenaV

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2014, 10:22:10 am »
Hi!

M says that this started in the summer - so would her LO have been around 18m? Could it have been the 18Sr that kicked things off and they never properly got back on track? I know for me the 18SR was a huge learning curve - lots of AP inadvertently as I didn't have a clue what was 'wrong' with R and thought something was REALLY wrong so had to spend alit if time fixing things which we did to then be hit by the 2y developmental leap.

I don't know but just some food for thought really - accumalative developmental fall out that needs to be straightened out?

Hena x

Offline anna*

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2014, 10:47:13 am »
Hi Hena. I don't think it's the 18 mo sleep regression because Erin only turned 1 in May so would have been 18 months in November...





Offline HenaV

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2014, 12:50:21 pm »
Sorry I Mis-read your post. I thoughtbutbwas she was 2. Having re-read it I can see you put she will be 2 in May. My appologies x

Offline Stephlx

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #7 on: February 04, 2014, 13:17:37 pm »
I am having pretty much the same situation with my son who also turns 2 in May -- Hena what is the 18mth sr?? my son started with his bad sleeping around Nov time which would have put him at 18mths -- can you see my thread that I started and reply on that??
21 MONTH OLD -- Wakes all night every hour from 11pm
many thanks Steph
« Last Edit: February 04, 2014, 13:19:08 pm by Stephlx »

Offline anna*

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2014, 15:08:58 pm »
I've suggested the pool noodle, intriguing idea, you could use big cable ties to hold it in. I THINK the head banging is sort of reflexive, although if she will just find another way to hurt herself then it's not a complete solution. But definitely one to try. M thinks they are already effectively co-sleeping as they're sleeping in with her right now. I suggested PROPERLY co-sleeping, having her in their bed after the first waking... until she's used to getting a full night's sleep and maybe (?) forgotten about the head-banging - but then the question is, how and when can they get her out again!?





Offline malenka

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2014, 15:38:39 pm »
So many (((((hugs))))) for your friend! That sounds really hard.

You mentioned pain as maybe being a factor - teeth? Has she tried meds at all? Or a teething remedy?

If they try co-sleeping for a bit to break the cycle, then hopefully they'd be able to get her back into her bed with a gradual withdrawl? Your friend could start out by sleeping on the mattress in her room, maybe?
Meredith - Mommy to




Offline anna*

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2014, 15:47:23 pm »
Yah they give pain meds. I've suggested trying pain meds at 2am so as at least to see if that's what's waking her at 4.30am. They're sleeping in her room currently, so I'm not sure what benefit co-sleeping is going to have for E (although for the parents at least they might all get some sleep). The worry is, if co-sleeping (in their bed) DOESN"T work, then they've got a head-banging little spitfire in there who thinks now she sleeps in mama and papas bed, and with no way of getting her OUT!





Offline malenka

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2014, 15:59:06 pm »
Has your friend tried having her sleep on the mattress on the floor? Maybe if they take away the bars of the crib, she won't try banging her head on something else?

What if they cut her naps? Does she do better at night?
Meredith - Mommy to




Offline anna*

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2014, 16:05:51 pm »
Naps are often short and nights very short so M is going to try putting her to bed at 5.30 tonight. I've loaned them our Groclock. E is only 21 months but I think it could work if they can be consistent. E is much less harming when Dad goes in to her than mum, but they are going to try to stay out as much as possible (this is not an independent sleep issue, E goes to sleep by herself at bedtime and for her nap).





Offline *foxy*

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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2014, 16:34:30 pm »
My LO used to bang her head against the cot at night and BT. It was distressing to watch. She must have been 18mo - 2yo at the time. I think we ended up taking the cot sides off. She wanted to be taken out of the cot too. Sorry not much help, my memory is foggy due to sleep deprivation! Just to say that we had the same problem and for us I think it was frustration. She loved the sides being taken off


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Re: Help for a friend?
« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2014, 10:28:44 am »
Fingers crossed it seems to be working! Hopefully, maybe...