help for today-ew & set times

[jessmum46]

great minds

[Aishi]

U might be right katherine but tbh those were not normal days the longer naps were after the last two crappy nights. Nap is usually 1-3 max (she wakes herself) and sometimes its 1.5 or 1.75h but i get the same behaviour and nws/ew. Bt is usually 7/7.30 depending on nap ...

Im at a loss to figure it out

Posted same time as Hena

[Aishi]

She had nap at 1 today no messing around. Do  u still think i should cap at 1h45? the times she has an uncapped 2 h nap she settles better at bt.

Tbh i think shes still too sensitive to ot for set times to work. The only reason  i think she settles ok foe nap as oppose to bt is that am a works out to be around 6.5h a. The pm a goes to pot cos nap length varies so much.

I thought she would have settled into set times by now..

[HenaV]

If you think she better on 2hours then I would go wilt it bt I would have that as a max. R was on 2 h at this agree (moved to 1h45m not long after) and as you know she borders on HSN and is really sensitive to to OT.

Tbh, I think the trick is consisentcy - hence the reason why i and am sure Katherine too suggested letting her sleep no lateen than 3.15pm WHATEVER time she goes to sleep for her nap. You can't imd expect set naps to work if the nap times vary because she is being a monkey, does that make sense. I think its time for you to grab the bull by the horns and be a stringent with yourself and with your LO re: nap and BT. If she doesnt go to sleep straight away, thats fine. Manage that through an earlier BT. I promise you she will soon get the message. R sis and she has a will of iron, she at time gives me a run for my money and that I promise is saying something 

Come on hon, you can do this. Just stick with the plan and I promise it will come right. Consistency is key 

[Aishi]

Ok *deep breath* so this is the plan?

wu 6-7 (whenever she wakes)
Nap 1 wake by 3 no matter how long it takes to fall asleep?
bt 7 and 6.30 if nap is less than 1.5h

If she is ot by bt should i leave her to shout/ cry or go into her? and what about nws??

I have been sticking to set nap at 1 (12.45 if wu is 6) but i usually let her sleep 2+hrs only if she has had a bad night and takes ages to settle at nap time( like yesterday) . Is this where im going wrong? i figured with longer am a that longer nap and shorter pm a would compensate for it iykwim?

[HenaV]

Aboslutely, R has a long AM and short PM (only 4h to BT) but it is consistent.

So yes,

WU: Wake up no later than 7.15/30 to preserve the day
nap at 1pm (12.45 if needs be), cap at 2hours BUT wake by 3.15pm no matter what time she falls asleep
BT: 7pm unless nap is short, then sometime between 6.30 and 7pm depending on nap length

Re: the crying etc and NW, no don't leave her to cry but do use WI/WO to make her see that it is time for sleep now. It is painful, but it does work.

These are my top tips re: WI/WO, they may help. There is also a sticky on the FAQ bit of TS Board which may help if you're unsure.

WI/WO

I've always followed the following rules when I have had to do Wi/WO:

(1) BT as normal
(2)Get the 'don't go, I need you mummy' patter from R. My response: No R is time for night nights (or whatever your sleepy phrase is), lay her down and leave shutting the door behind me (she sleeps in the dark with the door closed) ... And let the games begin!!
(3)R will kick off the minute I walk away- stand back and assess. Is the cry upset/distress OR temper/frustration. If it's the latter, do not go in. Hold back. There is a difference IMO between upset and angry cries - don't jump in! If it is the former, implement (4)
(4) go in - put back into bed/ lay down and again say sssh, it time for night nights now - and again leave
(5) again stand back and assess and do not rush in. Only go in if you LO is upset not just angry / frustrated. If you need to go back in, say NOTHiNG - simply put back into bed/lay down and leave
(6) rinse and repeat (5) until he gives in - HE WILL. It may take hours the 1st time, it will take less time the 2nd time and so on until he decides it's just not worth the effort 

Top tip: make sure you have something to occupy you waiting on the landing - Phone, book, game - something that can distract you and stop you rushing in/ going in prematurely. You will be there for a while so be prepared to stay the course and I promise you will crack it - he will relent before you do.

NOW, take that deep breath - here goes. You know that you can do this. Remember, consistency, consistency, consistency is the key whether its routine, set times or WI/WO. Go get to it mama, here to hold your hand every step of the way xxxx

[Aishi]

Thanks Hena. Thats really helpful. Will implement as of tonight! Xx

[HenaV]

GL 

[jessmum46]

Yes what Hena said good luck hun x

[Aishi]

Thanks ladies. She napped 1-2.50. just pd for bt and she asked.for cuddles a few times which i did and now shes singing away...if she asks for cuddles again and is upset do i just go in and say sleepy phrase or give cuddles. And if.so do i not give cuddles at any point during wiwo? as u can tell im a bit confused!

Shes alternating btween singing and crying/ whining/ shouting for huggles. So i just ignore her even tho she really really loud and i know she will go sleep if i give her her 'huggles'.

[Aishi]

Ugh this is brutal ive been saying sleepy phrase over.two way monitor rathee than goin in but she was getting hysterical so i went in and laid her down without speaking to her. Is it ok to do wiwo like this or will it confuse her? Shes quieter now but not asleep and its 7.45...

ok another question. If im going in when shes upset, and just lying her down. Wont she still have nws expecting me to do that? what ive been doing before i posted was at bt upsets and nws i would go in give her a cuddle but not speak to her. Isnt that the same as wiwo??? If so, why is she still having nws?

[barbaraz78]

I would not give cuddles, really. Time for sleep is time for sleep, not for cuddles. The only reason he gets cuddles at night is when he is sick. So, the message is: I am here if you need me, but it is time for sleep, so if you don't really need me, just try and go to sleep. I say my phrase and I interact as less as possible, from outside door (or from my bed at night) and, only when this doesn't work, I go to him, I ask what he needs and try to fix the problem. If he wants a cuddle, I generally give him once at bt, and say this is my last one. Then no cuddles for the rest of the night, except when he is sick, as i sais.

[Aishi]

Thank you thank you thank you! it worked! i got my angel sleeper back!

i reassured dd thru the monitor and only went to lay her down when she was genuinely upset (before that she would cry but then sing two sec later!) she fell asleep by 7.50. had a brief nw at 1 where she sang for 30 sec and went back to sleep without calling for me at all! Wu was 6.15 so a short night but i was expecting that after the late bt and shes happily singing away, not screaming for me like she has been doing every morning!

so, ive been going into her thinking she needs me and the little minx has been playing me all these weeks?! i hadnt even realised my going in had become a prop!

thanks again for saving my sanity

[HenaV]

  She's sounds a kindred spirit for R, the monkey. Stick with it hon. Remember consistency is key - if your LO is anything like R, give her an inch and she'll take 10miles!!

X

[Aishi]

It took 50 minutes last night too so asleep for 7.50. wu was 5.30. i did wiwo but she didnt go back to sleep. Should i give her cuddle at ew so she goes back to sleep? if she isnt going to settle at ew wont she have ew cos of ot?

What should i do today?

wu 5.30
nap 12.45-3.15??
bt 6.30 but pd earlier so she will fall asleep by 6.30 ish and keep to 13h day??