Author Topic: Quit on 9th Night  (Read 601 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline LeonaO

  • New & Learning The Ropes!
  • *
  • Showing Appreciation 0
  • Posts: 9
  • Location:
Quit on 9th Night
« on: April 21, 2014, 11:09:30 am »
Last night, our 9th night, I pulled our 8.5 mo son back in bed with me.  We have seen SUCH LITTLE progress, and he was screaming so badly that I couldn't take it anymore.  This morning he had a fever, so I am glad he slept next to me for comfort while not feeling well.  However, we are left with deciding--again--on when to transition him to his own bed. 

In 3 weeks, we will be moving.  Do you think we should wait until we move to try the transition again?  If he transitions successfully right now, will we have to do it over when we move?

We quickly gave up on nap times because he screamed for all 2 hours and looked awful from fatigue.  Some have suggested tackling only nights initially, while others have said that's too confusing for babies.  Is there a consensus?  Does it depend on the baby?

I have been trying to do 2 dream feeds since he has been used to eating 5-10 times/night, even if just for a suckle.  When I'm successful, he sleeps great!  But he often wakes before the dream feed.  Should I just cut out the feeds completely to avoid confusing him?

Is this unusual to see such little progress after 9 days of commitment?  Should we be considering other methods?

He is a angel/typical baby with a faint streak of touchy.  He gets the appropriate amount of active and sleep time during the day (as long as he sleeps on us for naps).  Thanks.

Offline Layla

  • Resident BW Chatterbox!
  • *****
  • Showing Appreciation 362
  • Gender: Female
  • Posts: 8785
  • Tiramisu - my favourite cake
  • Location: Australia
Re: Quit on 9th Night
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2014, 17:57:01 pm »
Could you post your easy routine please...or what last 2-3 days looked like?



20/06/2012 - my angel baby

Offline *Ali*

  • Breast Feeding & Pregnancy/Childbirth
  • Forum Moderator
  • Resident BW Chatterbox!
  • *****
  • Showing Appreciation 373
  • Gender: Female
  • Posts: 22301
  • Caught in the act!
  • Location: London uk
Re: Quit on 9th Night
« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2014, 22:07:55 pm »
I wouldn't do PUPD for 2hrs straight for naps. If you reach 45 mins and he is not settling then I would get him up and have a very short, low key A time, feed him if he is hungry but don't let him fall asleep and then try to resettle him in the cot again for another 45 mins. Rinse and repeat.

Is he pulling up yet? I actually found PUPD much easier when he was pulling up as you just lay him back down again and don't have to bother with all the asking if he wants picking up. What version of PUPD were you using?

You could try gradual withdrawal instead of PUPD if you think it is too over stimulating for him. What about starting with shush pat in your arms and then putting him the bed a little more awake and continuing with that as necessary? He may prefer a rub or whisper to the shush and the pat but you'll have to experiment to find his preference probably.

I'd try a mattress on the floor in his room rather than taking him into your bed. That will be easier to wean.

I would probably wait until he is better and you have moved and then start sleeping with him in his new room and work on getting out the door from there.
Cadan Dec 2009 and Colby Aug 2011


Offline LeonaO

  • New & Learning The Ropes!
  • *
  • Showing Appreciation 0
  • Posts: 9
  • Location:
Re: Quit on 9th Night
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2014, 11:25:22 am »
Thanks for the responses!

The book talks about doing PU/PD for the entire nap time, but clearly that hasn't worked for him.  At night should we also not let him go longer than 45 minutes?  I'm afraid that, if I feed him after 45 minutes of crying, he'll just learn to cry for 45 minutes SO THAT he can eat.

He's not pulling up yet.  And he's usually so worked up that he's not able to respond to us asking if he wants to be picked up.  He always calms in our arms or on the breast.  However, putting him back down riles him up quite a bit.  So we've been trying (and by we, I mean my husband) to keep a hand on him in the crib and say soothing things.  If he enters sleep, my husband leaves.  Sometimes our LO sleeps for two hours, sometimes for 5 minutes, sometimes for 20 minutes before waking and screaming again.  What do you mean by "gradual withdrawal?"

A typical day:

6ish wake
6ish breastfeed
730 solids
830 breastfeed
930ish nap
11 wake
12 breastfeed
1230 solids
3 breastfeed and nap
5 wake
6 solids
730 breast feed and sleep
throughout night, struggle!

Putting him down at the start of the night had improved, but the rest of the night had not. 

Any consensus on tackling both naps and nights at once versus one at a time?

Offline Skadiver13

  • General Sleep
  • Resident BW Chatterbox!
  • *****
  • Showing Appreciation 44
  • Posts: 2770
  • Location: New York
Re: Quit on 9th Night
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2014, 11:44:08 am »
I'm afraid that, if I feed him after 45 minutes of crying, he'll just learn to cry for 45 minutes SO THAT he can eat.

Hi hun, no in the middle of the night you'll only feed when they are hungry.  You don't want to start a prop for sure.

But honestly if you are moving then I would just wait until you move and he is feeling better and work on gradual withdrawal from there. My lo never took to pupd and would just scream and scream. It works for many lo's but certainly not all.

Here is the info for gradual withdrawal
The Gradual Withdrawal Method

The key to Gradual Withdrawal is to take tiny steps and make the changes very small at first so the child barely notices them.  Create a plan, broken into small steps of how you will reduce the parental dependence and work towards independence.  For example, patting on the back becomes lighter and lighter until the hand barely brushes the child's back, but is poised just above it.

To implement, follow your bedtime routine being certain that your child has sufficiently wound down from the day.  When wind down is completed, lay your child down, tuck them in and use a phrase they can associate with it's sleep time such as "time to go night-night you can find your blankie/pacifier/suck your thumb/etc. to help you fall asleep." Settle your child in their crib/bed and comfort as you normally would, then implement the first step in your plan.  Depending upon your child's temperament, you may be able to tackle more in less nights, or need to do less over the course of more nights.

The Gradual Withdrawal Method is intended for children that are reliant upon a parent's presence to calm them and help them settle for sleep. Examples are: sitting in the room, holding a child's hand, laying down with a child, patting to sleep, among others.  The idea is to simply reduce the reliance on parental presence gradually and in very small increments so the child continues to settle well and gains confidence in their ability to fall asleep independently.  The parent is there to assist the child in sleeping, but slowly reduces the dependence.  Examples might be: moving a chair closer and closer to the door until out of the room over the course of a few weeks, moving out a child's bed to an air mattress on the floor, then slowly move farther and farther towards the door over time, reducing the length of time patting though still staying with the child - then slowly working closer and closer towards the door.



My dreamed for Angel Baby DD (other than dreaded 40min naps) Born 4/30/16
Reflux, MSPI, Love my Spirited,textbook little munchkin DS Born 5/17/2012



**Siobhan**

Offline *Ali*

  • Breast Feeding & Pregnancy/Childbirth
  • Forum Moderator
  • Resident BW Chatterbox!
  • *****
  • Showing Appreciation 373
  • Gender: Female
  • Posts: 22301
  • Caught in the act!
  • Location: London uk
Re: Quit on 9th Night
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2014, 14:07:04 pm »
Oh no I only meant limit the PUPD to 45 mins for naps. At night you'd just keep going if you have decided he isn't hungry. Check out this link where Tracy talks about having a break after 45 mins. A Special Sleep Interview with Tracy Hogg

I would probably do naps to start with and then you might find the NWs reduce by themselves and you can just tackle the ones that remain. Tackling everything in one go will probably be quicker but if you think you guys would find that too much then I'd just concentrate on teaching independent sleep in the day and at BT.

Sounds like you would find the gradual withdrawal less stressful too.
Cadan Dec 2009 and Colby Aug 2011


Offline LeonaO

  • New & Learning The Ropes!
  • *
  • Showing Appreciation 0
  • Posts: 9
  • Location:
Re: Quit on 9th Night
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2014, 15:02:03 pm »
This is helpful, thank you for your responses! I think we'll come up with a plan for gradual withdrawal since the all-at-once method wrecked all three of us. ;) Thanks, ladies!!