dd taking an hour to fall asleep at bt

[Aishi]

That's it really. No matter what time I pd for BT she will take an hour or more of chattering to fall asleep. This wouldn't normally bother me except if she's had a short nap for whatever reason she will get ot and then have nws and ot ew...I pd early after a crap nap and same thing happens i pd later and same thing...I'm just very tired...

If its developmental still shouldnt it be over by now? She's 28 mo now. Its not molar related or if it is meds are not making a diff anymore.

Nap time is fine. After a good night (11.5h) I pd for nap after 6h a and and she is asleep within 5-10mins so total a time is usually 6h10 min. Any later and I get an ot 1.5h nap. If it helps our usual routine is

Wu 6.30/7
Nap 12.30-2/ 1-3 (I cap at 2h min-any shorter and she gets ot)
Bt 7/7.30

Lately tho with all the chattering bt gets as late as 8 regardless of nap length/ ot or ut and we can then be up from 5.45 which just gets us into an earlier start

Set times dont work as she is too sensitive to ot. What do i want? Has anyone else got a lo so sensitive to ot and HSN? How do u deal with it? Is it worth dropping the nap ct?

Thanks to anyone who has btdt or can help!

[HenaV]

Hi,

As you know R is HSN and is and is sensitive to OT. We were having the same issues at this age and it lasted quite a while. I kept the nap at 12.30, allowed a nap of 2.5h every few days to keep the OT at bay.

We also introduced a gro-clock just after her 2nd bday which worked a charm - It didn't stop the EWs but she at least stayed in bed until an accpetable WU time

Hth

[Aishi]

It has lasted ages. I think this is my third post about her sleep shenanigans! Ystrday was perfect. She sttn but only 10.5h

Wu 6
Nap 12.05-2.05 uncapped
Bt 7 (pd 6)
Sttn

Then today wu 6.10
Nap 12.15-2.15 capped
Bt 7.50!! (I pd at 6.30 hoping for a 7.15 BT after 45min chattering)

Dyt this is devopmental or I'm pd too early? The last time I pd later she still took an hour to fall asleep but the am a time and nap length weren't the same as the last few days. She's driving me crazy. I just know wu will be 6 if not earlier!!

Oh, I have night light on her monitor and she knows to wait for it to come on. She just doesn't! Either she yells and shouts or takes her nappy off and has a poo in the cot and the proceeds to yell and shout. Arggh

[HenaV]

Hon looking at your day, I think you need to push your nap out. 12 is really quite early and could be compounding the issue.

At this age, R was napping closer to 12.30/45pm I'm sure and I think at around 27m we started to cap at 1h45mins with the odd 2h nap if she was knackared.

Might be worth a shot given that much else hasn't done the trick!

[Aishi]

If I do longer than 6h am a she does a short nap of 1.5h, wakes cranky and still takes an hour to fall asleep so is even more ot by BT   

[HenaV]

Have you tried increasing the nap by 10/15m at a time? It's a long process but then only way I could extend R's A times to get rid of UT NW or ew. So increase by 15m and hold for 3-5days, extend again and hold - rinse and repeat until you are where you want to be

H

[Aishi]

Yup tried it. Little monkey is sensitive to ot even 10-15 min gives me a short nap *sigh* sorry hon I know I'm shooting down all ideas x

[HenaV]

Then maybe you have to take the short nap and EBT to manage the OT. I don't really know what else to suggest. Sorry hon 

[kaipooi]

Heya Aishi,

Jr started giving me the same problems last week too. And it is not molars anymore as all his teeth are out. I started extending his morning A time from 6hr15 to 6hr30 from last Friday and he has been giving me his 1hr45 OT naps. He was doing 2hr to 2hr15 naps at 6hr15 morning A time, but only doing 9.5-10hr nights! Since last Friday, he has definitely been more tired and even a bit OT hyperactive just before bedtime. The good part is that he has been doing 11-11.5hour nights for the past 3 nights. Oh, I put him to bed 15-30mins earlier too, depending on how he behaves after his nap...

I don't know if this is the cure or he has just been so knackered from 9.5-10hr nights the whole of last week. But for the last 3 days, it has been working well. I know this is the same thing that HenaV is telling you and you have said DD will probably only do 1.5hr OT naps, but hey, OT naps + slightly EBT seems to be working for Jr...

[jessmum46]

Just popping in, I know how frustrated you must be Aishi . ((Hugs))

I think I'd agree with Hena - try very gently pushing the morning A, even 5-10 mins at a time.  If the short nap happens so be it - use EBT.  If she doesn't fall asleep there isn't a whole lot you can do though.....if it makes you feel better J has NWs more nights than not at the moment, not long ones but they do happen.  I don't think every LO at this age sleeps perfectly through the night every night.

Do you know her sleep needs (approx) in 24h?  E.g. If you know she normally needs about 13h in 24, put her down for bed at just before 11h total A time.  Might work?  Is there any chance you could be thinking she needs more sleep than she actually does now and are getting into OT troubles from UT?

If pushing morning A doesn't work, then I don't really see what other option you have than very slowly nap capping?  10 mins off at a time, keep same BT?

Or, just thinking about it, maybe keep long nap (uncapped if you have to) and then do a really long day and late BT?  I think Naomi (Buttonbobs) LO has been doing a late 2h nap and really late BT interspersed with some NNDs and earlier BT.  Also seem to think Creations LO did very long days with a longer nap and short nights as nap capping didn't suit?

Sorry, a bit jumbled, but I think what I'm saying is the options are:
- push nap later
- push BT later
- cap nap
- set times and just accept the OT and variability (know you're not keen on this though)

Can you think of any alternatives?

[Aishi]

Lol I wish I could think of alternatives! Im leaving that to you lovely ladies . I think extending a time may be the way to go. She did 6h10 am a (only 5 min increase) and did ok

Wu 6.45
Nap 12.55-3 capped
Bt 8 (pd 7)

Singing at 5 but went back to sleep quickly... Dyt that was ut waking? Woke at 6.25 this am...thought I'd try this for a few days...6h10 am a, 2h capped nap and 5h pm a (pd 1h earlier), once I know this works I'll pd at BT later to make sure she not ut rather than taking an hr for dev reasons iykwim?

Wdyt? Thanks again ladies for your ideas xx

[Aishi]

So bt today was disastrous....I did the same routine as last few days

Wu 6.25
Am a 6h10
Nap 12.35-2.35 capped
Bt 8.05! (I pd later today at 7.20 aiming for 7.30 asleep) but she still took 50 min to sleep. So does this mean the hour she takes usually when i pd at 4h pm a is developmental

I just realised that I'm still chasing that pm a time like I was months ago before I tried set naps and increasing a times. Why can't I get this right?

[kaipooi]

Have you tried just letting her run around in the afternoon to wear her out for bedtime? I noticed that if I let Jr run and play in the park in the afternoon, he sleeps much better at night. He's an energetic extrovert though...

Oh, and I noticed that he needs a 13 hour day, at least. He took a really short nap of 1.5hours yesterday and so I gave him an EBT to make his day 12.5hours long. He was protesting to start his BT routine and only slept 10.5hours. He was obviously not tired enough. His sleep needs seem to have changed as well in the last 2 weeks. He seems to be ok with 12-12.5hours of total sleep rather than 12.5-13hours. He is almost 28 months now, so perhaps there is some developmental stuff going on and hence  dropping sleep needs at this age too? I say this because maybe DD is going through the same thing too...

[Aishi]

She was at the park yesterday afternoon. It doesn't seem to make a difference. And I aim to have a 13 h day which is why I pd 1 h earlier for BT so she can get the chattering out her system. I pd later yesterday in hope that she would be tired to fall asleep quicker but it still took an hour to fall asleep and she had a 13.75 day. I heard her at 11, 5, 6 and up at 6.50.

I don't think its a case of ut

Idk I'm out of ideas

[jessmum46]

The thing I'd come back to (sorry I know you won't be keen) is shortening her nap.  I just can't help wondering if 2h is just too much for her now to be able to keep the day to a length where she doesn't get OT?  I know with J if she did a 2h nap (pigs may fly.....) she'd need a good 5h A or more afterwards now to settle for bed regardless of am A time, which would make the day way too long = short night = OT.

Maybe just try shaving off 10 mins at a time?  2h is on the long side for a nap at this age and you may find she gets more and better overall sleep by cutting the nap slightly.  I know others have found that an extra few minutes on the nap robs much more from night sleep, and by cutting the nap by 15 mins or so they get an extra 30 mins or more of night sleep so total sleep is better.

I know she's been HSN historically but I think pp may be right that sleep needs could have decreased a bit now - they certainly have here.