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Offline kayra

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various questions
« on: July 08, 2014, 18:23:15 pm »
As the title suggests i have variou questions regrding our easy i hope its not a problem tonhave them all in tge same post..

I guess this is mainly for ds' routine since dd seems to be in her own thing and only just beginning to have a more structured routine. I ant exactly post an easy for ds as its at different times each day, he's basically on a 3-4hr easy, hr bfsa bit and then has a bottle of about 60ml sometimes 90, awake in totsl about 1.15 or 1.30hr depending on how long it takes to settle but he's got really good at settling himself with his dummy, I almost always wake him from his naps which seem to be around 2 hrs. So he generally has 3 good naps thr catnap rarely happens so its either that he's awake a long time before bedtime-which depends on the last cycle its not set but generally somewhere between 7-9 by the time hes asleep- or its soon after the 3rd proper nap.
So i guess my question here would be should i establishba bedtime and work around that?
Should i cap the naps more to be on a stricter routine?
So i try to force the catnap? What should i be aiming for?...

He tgen has a df around 10:45, then a feed around 3, and now he's been waking around 5:30 a couple times. Yesterdy i knew he'd had a feed at 3 so was sure he couldn't be that hungry let him bf a bit and he immediately went off and slept till 7- i did the right thing didnt i? Today i thought he hadn't got upnat 3 so gave him a full feed at 5:30 onlynto find out later that my dad had indeed fed him at 3 ::) so i think the full feed at 5:30 kind of messed his understandinb of when his day started, do you think thats possible?
So i guess my question here is am i right to not do anfeed at 5:30, should i even bf or should ibtry to justbsettle?
Also i read somewhere that onr should actually try to keep baby awake a bit at the df to avoid the ew issue but i seem to remember Tracy saying that the aim is to not wake the baby..?

Thanks for coming this far :)

Dd i a bit of a madam to settle, wont settle herself, ages long holding before you're able to putnher down and even then its not a given she'll stay down.. Which makes her cycles even more variable b/c her "a" ends up being about 2hrs sometimes even more..and i shy from waking her too much after the pain of settling her and also b/c she is smaller and needs her sleep.
Am i doing the right thing?
I've only just started trying a df, she didnt takenit the first night, woke slightly and took it last night anf went straight back to sleep thankfully then fed at 2:30 fussed around 5 settled back then fed at 6. Dont reallybhave a question here :P like i said she isnt on much nofna routine mainly b/c its such an issue tonsettle her :(
Oh and in the evening they both naturally sort of cluster feed, but i read somewhere that one should stopnthat around 8 weeks, is that so, whats the plan if so? Cant remember what ds1 did..

Sorry its so long, bless you if you've made it this far and double blessings if you have answers to my questions :P ;) :)
Xxxx

Our angel Victor 06.11.10  We miss you, but look forward to the day we will see you again my love 1Cor. 15
Angel, April 2011

Offline jessmum46

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Re: various questions
« Reply #1 on: July 09, 2014, 07:32:43 am »
Hi Kayra :). Not sure I have 'the answers' (muddling along myself at the moment) but I'll try!

Firstly, wow!  DS sounds like a great sleeper :D. Fab that he is settling himself with his dummy so young too.  In terms of BT, I think a usual EASY approach would be to adjust BT based on naps, so that he goes down for the night when he's ready.  That said, I know many here actually don't do that and have more of a set BT and just cap the last nap of the day if necessary to make sure LO is ready to sleep then.  We are doing a set BT here for DS because it fits into DDs routine.  He's almost always OT ::) but I'm hoping that will improve with time.  I wouldn't restrict his naps any more than you are doing already unless you're getting issues with nights, a flexible 3-4h routine sounds great to me.  If you choose to go the set BT route, some days he may need the CN if naps are a bit shorter, and other days he may be ok without.  Don't forget just as you think you've got him figured out the 45 min naps will kick in though ;).

5.30 WUs.....yes we have those too.  I think ours are a bit gas-related but some of it seems to be he's just done with night time by then, particularly if he's asleep by 7pm.  I would say if a quick bf gets you a resettle to a 7am WU then at this age I'd probably go with it, though there is an argument for not feeding more often than you would in the daytime.  You could try the dummy instead and if he doesn't settle well assume hunger and feed?  Really I think I'm saying it's up to you! 

DF - Tracy said not to wake LO.  Other sleep 'experts' suggest to wake LO fully at that time so 7-10/11pm is more of a long nap, with 'night' happening after the late feed.  You could always try the waking option and see what happens?  Again, no hard and fast rule really.

DD sounds like a completely normal baby to me ;). In fact I think your DS sounds a bit too angelic lol!!  I would give her all the help she needs for now, you can always ST later.  And I also would let her sleep when she manages too - DS here likes to stay awake for hours too then crashes for a mammoth nap so I just let him :). If she's unsettled will she go in a sling?

Cluster feeding - when it's 'natural' cluster feeding rather than 'planned' clustering again I would just go with it, don't stop it.  If they are demanding more frequently at that hour it's probably because they need it.  In a few weeks they may just stop it naturally, that's what happened when DD was little. 

Phew!  Hope that helps a little, think you're doing an amazing job hun :-*


Offline kayra

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Re: various questions
« Reply #2 on: July 09, 2014, 08:38:10 am »
Thanks SO much katherine, i know that was a lot to plough thru!
I was worried that da might be napping too long but like you said its not messing with his nights it seems, but i'll probably keep waking him otherwise he'd easily end up in a 4+ Cycle. Last noght he had a feed at 1:30 which seemed early after his df, then woke at 4.30, but didnt want a feed just a little cuddle bless him, then slept till 7:30! Yes i know those dreaded 45min naps will be along soon enough. So definitely enjoyung this stage ;) if it were just him itd be a doddle!

Good to know dd sounds normal, shes definitely
More sensitive/touchy than ds. Last night was extra hard, looks like shes caught my cold poorthing :(
I think right now i can afford a changing bt b/c i have my parents to help but i may need to opt for a set bt when its just me and dh.
 Hope you guys are doing well :)
Xx

Our angel Victor 06.11.10  We miss you, but look forward to the day we will see you again my love 1Cor. 15
Angel, April 2011

Offline kayra

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Re: various questions
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2014, 08:06:14 am »
Help! Our nights  are getting worse instead of better!
After their 2-3am feed they are just murder to settle,  i think with dd its just her usual hard to settle-ness to be honest, it just feels worse at night, but really after a quick feed she should be drowsy and go back to sleep more easily shouldnt she? Ds  has a hard time settling at times but also keeps getting up.

I malso dont understand why he gets up so soon after the dream feed, i suppose 2ish isnt too bad but the idea of the df is to get rid of the next nf isnt it, b/c he already had stopped getting up around 10 to feed. Dd was getting up even earlier after her df so i didnt do her last night and she went till gone 2, so i dont know if the df was messing with her rythm or what..

Is it normal for them to be doing their good long stretch after 7:30? Anyway we can make them do that after midnight?

Our angel Victor 06.11.10  We miss you, but look forward to the day we will see you again my love 1Cor. 15
Angel, April 2011

Offline jessmum46

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Re: various questions
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2014, 08:15:13 am »
Do you think the unsettledness after 2/3am is gas/digestion issues?  DS is definitely more unsettled towards the early hours of the morning, wriggles/grunts a lot.  Do they burp well?  Have you tried the cot on an incline?  Seems to have helped somewhat here, though I think the unsettledness is also improving with time. 

If the DF isn't getting you a longer stretch it sounds like it may be disturbing their sleep rhythms  :-\ to be honest I've never done a DF for exactly that reason, I understand the theory but both DD and DS have done their longest stretch from BT onwards so seems a bit silly (in my mind) to disturb it.  The DF doesn't work for everyone.  Currently we're doing BT feed at 7ish then DS will go until anywhere between 1.30 & 3.30am.  I know some people have found that the DF makes LOs more gassy too.  Is it worth just not doing the DF to see if they are more settled?  I know it's more tiring to have to get up for NFs rather than a DF when you go to bed, but if it solves the unsettledness a quick NF may be preferable to being awake for an hour or two?

You could always try that then reintroduce the dream feed in a couple of weeks when their digestive systems have matured a little and see if you have more success then?

Offline kayra

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Re: various questions
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2014, 11:09:56 am »
I suppose it could be but if they dont have digestive problens in the day woukd they still have it at night?
I hadnt done df for dd last night, like you said seems to mess with the rhythm, i guess i coukd try skippingit for ds, so then ifnhe feds at 1 he'll probably want sthg at 5 as well, i treat that as a nf right, not the start of the day?

Our angel Victor 06.11.10  We miss you, but look forward to the day we will see you again my love 1Cor. 15
Angel, April 2011

Offline jessmum46

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Re: various questions
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2014, 12:13:47 pm »
Yes that's what I'd do - for example last night DS fed at 1.30am and 5.20am, then resettled until up for the day at 6.45am.  Wrt the digestive thing, I had a post myself about unsettled early mornings (the only time DS really seems gassy and uncomfortable) and it seems it's a common issue.  I've tried a few things like laid-back feeds and cot on an incline, it seems a bit better but not sure if that's just he's getting bigger too?  Consensus seemed to be they grow out of it though.  Sorry that's probably not a whole lot of help  :-\

Offline kayra

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Re: various questions
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2014, 13:38:35 pm »
So do you give a full feed at 5:20  and 6:45? Or is the 5:20 a tide over snack kind of thing? In a srnse its good to know that its common and that they grow out of it, i think its the X2 part which makes it feel worse, kind of like its one baby going on and on whereas its 2 of them and they're taking turns being unsettled. Hope they grow out of it soon, i feel like we're doing an extra 3 weeks wityh these stages b/c they werent quite full term!

Our angel Victor 06.11.10  We miss you, but look forward to the day we will see you again my love 1Cor. 15
Angel, April 2011

Offline jessmum46

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Re: various questions
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2014, 14:18:59 pm »
Hugs hun, can't imagine how much harder it is with two.  Have heard it said it's not just double trouble, it's much more!  I'm EBF so just offer what DS will take at each feed (he's single side feeding anyway).  Probably means the 5ish feed is a full one and the 7ish one more of a top-up, but he doesn't seem to need the next feed early and will happily make it 3h for his next feed.  If it ain't broke.....

Offline kayra

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Re: various questions
« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2014, 18:07:05 pm »
I guess we'll just have to see how it goes tonight without the df. I'd rather he just nursed a bit around 5 and had a full feed around 7,  but it depends on dd, if she doesnt settle after her nf i'm going to have to have her in bed witj me so who knows if i'll be able to tend to him. Tonight at bedtime he just settled nicely and she took a good hour longer nursing and cuddling..ok for now but eventually we'll need to find a different way of settling or at least shorter!

Our angel Victor 06.11.10  We miss you, but look forward to the day we will see you again my love 1Cor. 15
Angel, April 2011

Offline jessmum46

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Re: various questions
« Reply #10 on: July 14, 2014, 18:13:09 pm »
I have to keep reminding myself they'll get there in the end, they're still so tiny aren't they?  DD will self-settle when she's ready :). Hope you get a good night x

Offline kayra

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Re: various questions
« Reply #11 on: July 15, 2014, 13:10:44 pm »
Well i didnt do the df last night but they both woke at 11!! ::) she then slept till 3:40 and he 5ish, which isnt too bad, but then she woke again at 5:30 and I had her in bednwith me nursing/dosing till 7:30 when ds woke up too. So not too awful tho naps have been all over the  place today. I'm starting to loose patience with how long it takesnto settle her only for her to wake up  after being put down :(

Our angel Victor 06.11.10  We miss you, but look forward to the day we will see you again my love 1Cor. 15
Angel, April 2011

Offline jessmum46

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Re: various questions
« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2014, 13:39:12 pm »
Hugs hun, where are you doing naps?  It's all over the place here too, DS has spent today catnapping on and off in my arms or the Moby ::).  And also waking as soon as I put him down even if I wait a good 20 mins. 

Sorry about the 11pm WU last night :(. Do you think something could have disturbed them?  Or were they hungry?

Offline kayra

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Re: various questions
« Reply #13 on: July 15, 2014, 18:25:43 pm »
They took a full feed so i guess they were hungry, they're in different rooms so i dont think it was sthg disturbing them. They both sleep in travel cots, he generally settles on the cot, tho he has been abit out of sorts today. She sleeps in the cot if she cooperates, or with me if i'm going to nap too, or in the sling-its mostly too hot for that but it looks like i'll need to use it more. Tonight it 1.5hr to get her to sleep after her bath, bottle, bf..
Sorry to hear its challenging with your ds too, must be hard with a toddler in tow!
Xx

Our angel Victor 06.11.10  We miss you, but look forward to the day we will see you again my love 1Cor. 15
Angel, April 2011

Offline jessmum46

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Re: various questions
« Reply #14 on: July 16, 2014, 07:55:36 am »
How was last night? x

Offline kayra

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Re: various questions
« Reply #15 on: July 16, 2014, 10:53:10 am »
Thanks for asking :) ds settled nicely at 7:30 and woke up after 11, then slept till 4:30. I think he took too much at that feed as he was sick around 6:30,he eventually settled around 8 with me bf'ing him.
Dd settled at 9:15 altho the bedtime routine started at the same time, fed around 1 settled by 3 woke at 6 when i just nursed her in bed with me, but then it all got a bit chaotic wit ds being sick.
They are both having a glorious nap at the same time now :)

Our angel Victor 06.11.10  We miss you, but look forward to the day we will see you again my love 1Cor. 15
Angel, April 2011

Offline jessmum46

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Re: various questions
« Reply #16 on: July 16, 2014, 11:20:55 am »
Must be heavenly! :D