Help with A times - almost 9 mo old

[1sttimemamma]

Hey all! I'm looking for a bit of help with my DS who turns 9 months in about 10 days.

We are getting horrible night wake ups - like the past two nights after he's fallen asleep, he's woken up around 10 times in a couple hours. He also cries before bedtime.

Yesterday was:
WU 7:30
Nap 10:30 to 12 (I woke him up)
Nap 3 to 3:45
BT - I believe my husband started at 6:45 - he cried with patt/shh until 7 30ish?

Today
WU 7am
Nap 10:30 (I put him down at 10:15, but he played around until 10:30) - he's still sleeping and it's 11:35am

Previously, I was getting 2 naps of 1 hr 20 min and a fairly decent bedtime. We've always had night wakes - usually once al night to feed.

I feel the timing of bedtime is wrong - that's why he's crying so much and then waking so much in the beginning.

I aim for 3 hours awake time - but I push it by 15 min sometimes.

[jessmum46]

I'd suggest probably you need to push the A times a bit and either go for two long naps and a longer day, 12.5/13h, or one long (up to 2h) and one shorter nap.  Up to 4h A time isn't uncommon at this age so 3h may be a bit on the short side now.  What do you think?

[1sttimemamma]

I agree! However, I'm unclear how to do it because the bedtime could be much later right? Or am I not thinking clearly??

Today - he woke up at 7:30am. I put him down for a nap at 10:40ish?? I played around and didn't fall asleep until close to 11. I assume it will be short - just cause I feel like it will be.
But if he woke at 7:30am and I put him down at 11am and he sleeps until 12:30. Then another nap at 4?? until 5:30 and then bedtime at 9:30pm?? I just don't understand how to fit it all in. I know when he goes down for 1 nap it's a better bedtime, but 9:30 seems awfully late right?

[jessmum46]

No usually when the A times lengthen, you do one long and one shorter nap, and a shorter A time after the shorter nap.  So could be something like:

WU 7.30
Nap 11-12.30
Nap 4pm for 45 mins-1h
BT 7.30

[1sttimemamma]

So you wake them up?
If the AM nap is short, then the PM nap should be long - is that ok?

I put him down 3.5 hours after WU and he's still in his crib talking/ playing. So does that mean I need longer A time? He seemed very tired to me - rubbing his eyes, etc. As soon as I stick him in, he starts standing and playing and talking...

[Florena49]

Though id share what we are doing in the last couple of days ( still get two night wakings though)

7.20wu
11.21nap-12.32.            4A
4.32-4.52.                       4A
7.35BT.                           2.40A

I let him sleep for the first nap, he does two sleep cycles- 1.20min and i wake him from his second nap after 20 minutes. He isnt a happy bunny if i wake him, but if i dont and let him sleep 40 min he will do 3.30-3.45 A time, which makes for a late BT. It was very much trial and error really and still trying to figure out how to eliminate the two night wakings.

[jessmum46]

Playing around was generally a sign of UT here.  I'd push it to 3h45 and see if he settles better.  It's fine to do short am and long pm naps of that's what you'd prefer

[1sttimemamma]

Thanks all! It's pretty clear that he can do pretty close to a 4 hour A time before his first nap. But it gets a little tricky after that. Today he did
WU 7:45am
Nap 11:30 to 1pm
Nap 4:25 - ?? (I will wake him at 5??)

So then bedtime will be?? 8?

[1sttimemamma]

to continue
I woke him at 5:20
He was clearly not tired for a long time. I started bf him at 8:30 and he finally got drowsy at 9pm. He fell asleep at 9:05pm.

This is a late night...is this what we deal with until he gets to one nap?

[Florena49]

bT does get later, Is he LSN? I think that was too long A time after a short nap.

Just my experience, i find that Os doesnt get drowsy before bedtime unless he is just so so tired (overtired) so it is a bit of a guessing game here, as no he is crawling he can literally go on forever. The other night he was in a brill mood, but he fell asleep for a second sitting up.... i would say that after a 30-40 min nap 3.30A time would work. This is just out experience you will know your LO much better.

[1sttimemamma]

What is LSN?

Well, after going to sleep at 9, he's up now starting around 1am crying off and on. It's pretty rough.

Does a 3.30 A time mean 3 hours and 30 min? Or less?

[Florena49]

Sorry low sleep needs and yes around 3 hours and 30 minutes.

Also u might find that u will have to shorten the second nap to 20 minutes to keep a reasonable BT and after 20 minutes he will need a shorter A time too.

I know night wakings are rough we have suffered here too, Oskar has never slept through, the best he has done is sleep from BT to 3am.....hang in there.

Im going back to work soon, so this is what we started doing now to keep some sanity.
I started waking him at 7 so we start the day at the same time, first nap is 4 hours later then another 4 hours until second nap. second nap is still trial and error, but generally after 20 min nap he can do 2hours 30min and after 30-40 min nap he will do 3hours 30 mins.

[jessmum46]

I'd do a much shorter A time after a CN.  We were on 3h45-4h for our first 2 A times at that age, but only 2h15-30 after a CN x

[1sttimemamma]

is 1 hour considered a cat nap?

[Florena49]

I think one sleep cycle or less, so less than 45minutes is a catnap.correct me if im wrong someone. For us 1hour is ok and Os would be able to do pretty much his normal A time.