correcting lazy latch in 8 week old?

[becj86]

Not sure, never looked much into it, but know it can happen and is often the case when LOs drop through the charts early on. xx

[trimbler]

Ok just googled it and it looks like it's more relevant during the first few days. My DD was 75th percentile at birth and still at 2 weeks, so she has still dropped after the period where IV fluids are relevant. Interesting, though! It's hard to know how much her relatively slow weight gain is due to illness (she had a sore throat a few weeks ago and fed poorly then), distraction during feeds (especially when out, only possible if I cover her up but she still doesn't feed well), or lazy latch, which I still think may be an issue. Hard to correct when she seems to have little motivation to feed! First set of jabs last Friday, BCG tomorrow, she lost her appetite after the first set so expecting the same after tomorrow. Poos still variable, but often green and mucusy. I don't often feel engorged so not completely convinced about oversupply but still suspect she's not persevering enough with the feed to get the hind milk?

[*Ali*]

Have you tried pumping a bit to get past some of the foremilk before you put her on the breast?

[trimbler]

I haven't, do you think I should? I'm starting to doubt that it's really oversupply as I don't feel engorged, I've never had to pump. Only once when she didn't feed well from one side at night, did I have to hand express in the shower to feel comfortable again, but this is only when she really doesn't feed well. Actually she's often not fed well recently and I haven't been engorged at all afterwards. She still has fussy feeds, not all, but some where she then poos, others where I keep trying to burp her without success but she stops crying when I sit her up so she can look around! My DS started doing this around 4 months I think, he actually lost weight because he just wasn't interested in feeding, there were too many other better things to do! DD already just wants to look around, it's especially hard to feed her out so I avoid this whenever possible, I've had partial success by covering her head so she can't see anything else, but not for long! She's had very reluctant first feeds of the day recently, even when her last night feed was 4h ago, she just cries when I put her to the breast and is all smiles and looking around when I sit her up. Other times she'll just lie there, grinning up at me but with no interest in feeding, even when the last feed was 3-4 hours ago. So I'm wondering whether it's more to do with her not taking very much rather than me producing too much??? Would be interesting to do a weighed feeding, but no idea how to go about it, I guess I'd need to buy appropriate scales, or are there places where this can be done? If the latter, I'd imagine the result would be more depressing than it should be, as she doesn't feed well at all in an unfamiliar place!

[*Ali*]

Have you looked into intolerances? Does my LO have food intolerances?

What did the HV think was causing the green poop and muscousy poops?

If she isn't hungry when she wakes in the morning then I would just hold off offering the BF until she wants it. You don't have to feed on wake up if she isn't interested yet.

[trimbler]

The HV just said it was all normal and told me not to worry! But as you see I still am... I hadn't really considered intolerances as I'm not aware of anyone in our family having them. But she does often have mucus in her stools, or very watery and very frequent stools, not sure that she has reflux. She's generally a happy baby but does struggle to sleep, I just put that down to her temperament and age, nights are better than naps, she still needs help to get into deep sleep, and often doesn't manage that transition even in the sling. I've heard it said that 10-20min naps can be caused by discomfort? Then there's the fussy feeds or refusing to feed, she's also had skin issues including rough dry arms, this all came with irritation from a bio washing powder whilst we were away, plus heat, it's pretty much cleared up now although we continue with emollient for dry skin. Hmm... Wondering if it's worth getting in touch with the GP again about an elimination diet? Or is it safe to just go ahead and try for a couple of weeks anyway?

Problem with not feeding on WU is that she can't cope with very long A times so if I don't feed straight away then she just gets OT.

[*Ali*]

Hmm, I don't think the constant green and muscousy poops are normal really. I would definitely contact your gp to ask about intolerance and trialling an elimination diet. They don't have to have all the symptoms but sounds like she has a fair few so worth investigating I would think.

[trimbler]

Yes I think I do need to seek further professional help, feel like they've been a bit dismissive about my concerns but know they just don't want me to worry unnecessarily. Read an article about lactose overload, fairly sure this is it, according to the article this can be due to intolerance or inefficient feeding, she's certainly not feeding well so I know I need to do something about that at the very least, but maybe an intolerance could be part of it. Thanks, I'll let you know how it goes...

[*Ali*]

I hope you get some answers

[trimbler]

Ok so no answers yet but DH took both kids out this morning so I could make phone calls in peace! GP weighed her again, she's gained pretty well since Tue, looking at it now, above the expected gradient for her percentile, so now in the middle between 25 and 50, rather than only just above 25 as it was on Tue. So I suspect last Friday's jabs were partly to blame, but there is obviously still an underlying issue. We're getting stools tested and my friend with some training is coming to watch a feed later this afternoon, I've also phoned the national helpline, they gave suggestions for positioning and latch as we all suspect this is the main issue. Have also got in touch with the feeding specialist midwife at our local hospital so hoping she will get back to me soon. So I feel we have a plan and the weight thing isn't as scary as on Tue but the GP said I was right to be concerned and they'll continue to monitor weight. Of course with every appointment DD just ends up getting OT and then can't feed anyway but I'm hoping that we're still at the point where APOP doesn't matter quite so much, I won't have a choice about sling use anyway once I have DS to drop off and collect from preschool, until she can last long enough to feed and do the 1h round trip... And feeding takes so long at the moment as she just won't stay at it properly.

[*Ali*]

Fingers crossed the positions and asistance from your friend help

[trimbler]

Well we seem to have had some better feeding with cross cradle (not the most comfortable though!) and skin to skin, although we still get crying during feeds. I'm confused though as my friend seemed to think there was really nothing wrong except for maybe a virus, and recommended switch feeding, whereas everyone else recommended single side feeding (but not block if feeds were more than an hour apart, I guess you'd do that more for oversupply which I'm not sure is the case for me?) and are saying I should chase this up. So a little confused! But anyway I'll wait for the midwife to call back on Tuesday and see what she says, and in the meantime concentrate as much as possible on feeding, making the most of the weekend when DH is around to take care of DS. Anyway thanks so much for your advice and support, will keep you posted.

[*Ali*]

If you don't think you have over supply then I agree block feeding is out. Single sided feeding is also more relevant if you think the issue is that she is getting too much of the watery foremilk.

Switch feeding can be good because when you put LO back on the breast she had first she will be getting more of the fattier hind milk. Despite having what I now look back on and see was a generous supply if not oversupply I always did two-sided feeding after the first few weeks.

Is your friend thinking the green poops are from a virus? It's possible but seems to have been going on a couple weeks now and I wonder if that is a little long for a virus if she still has no other symptoms like a fever.

Please remember we are just mamas who are suggesting ideas for you to consider mostly based on what worked for us or for other mamas we have come across in the forum or IRL. Most of us at least are not trained LCs. So when I posted the link to the oversupply sticky for example I wasn't saying you have oversupply merely prompting you to look into it as a possibility to consider, if that makes sense.  Also it can be hard to get a good picture of what is really going on when we are at the end of the computer and not there with you and your LO in person. There is certainly no replacement for IRL help from a trained professional.

Hopefully your friend is right and there is nothing to worry about. It can't hurt to get her stools checked and your mind put to rest of it all comes back clear.

[trimbler]

Thanks Ali, I do understand you're not LCs but then neither is my friend, she's only in training and offering advice tentatively! I really appreciate your suggestions, which have been pretty consistent with some of the advice I was given from the helpline this morning (i.e. probably getting too much foremilk and not enough fatty stuff) and the GP (checking for intolerances), I don't like to take up professionals' time for non-issues, so you gave me the confidence that it's worth getting this checked out and taking that time - thanks!

[*Ali*]

Good luck