1-0 no idea need help

[Buttonbobs]

Hi sweetie, I do agree with Jacqueline (kaipool) tht you can't say
For certain after one day that a certain time and length of no will always lead to a particular length of night. So that being said what we need to do is to come up with a plan that you're happy with in theory, and then stick to it for at least a week.

It seems to me that you're fairly early on in the 1-0 transition. I don't feel this is a transition you can take at a rush, dropping the nap completely at the first sign of shortening nights. But also, it isn't something we can ignore and hope it'll go away. There will be a certain amount of OT along the way, but we are here to support you and you will get through it. Like Katherine said, we found this to be the easiest transition too, once we got to grips with what E needed to manage.

So, a couple of questions. When he wakes at 4.30, what are you doing? Are you getting up and starting the day or are you treating it as a NW and continuing to do whatever you would normally do as sleep training?

Is he teething at all at the moment? Or showing signs of being under the weather?

Assuming he's not in any discomfort we've got a situation of early waking and a BT ideal of 7pmish I think. So overall I think you have two options:

Keep him in bed in the mornings using whatever ST method you'd normally use until an agreed "morning". Have you got a gro-clock or similar. Then start your day from that point. If he can't make it to BT from that time, you can do a nap:

1. Either at the time you are currently doing in nap - but cutting it shorter like some above have suggested. This should be a bit like a CN and will help you get through to BT at a reasonable time: or

2. Make the nap later and keep it at full length, and make BT later. You can make this shift slowly or quickly, as some have suggested.

Personally given that you are dealing with early wakings, I would want to go for option two, as keeping the nap at the earlier time is likely to perpetuate EWs. I would always rather deal with a later BT than an earlier morning, but that's just me - so you need to work out which will work for you.

I know you're scared that he'll get OT, but reading into the situation you've described above it doesn't sound all that great right now anyway, so what do you have to lose. We're here to hold your hand honey.

Which one do you think will work for you? Pick one and we'll support you stick to it for at least a week to see what happens.

((Hugs))

[Straffles]

Thank you so much.

Will have to get back to you later as we are going for ebt. Advised by becj86. 45 min nap at normal time then 6pm bt as he's ot and this may help him sleep longer night she says.

He's terribly ot and his behaviour v hard to handle right now. Cdnt even make a dinner. Hitting me. Everything.

I know he can't poss sleep a 12hr night off a nap but bec says he's ot and it's my only option.

Btw I treat 4.30 wu as nw and try my best to keep him resting til 6.30

[Straffles]

And yes I want you guys to help me come up with a plan and hold my hand as I am danger of losing my s**t

If I can get him to sleep tonight I will get on my computer and answer all the wuestikns ckearly.

No teething no illness btw.

[creations]

I can change it up to the extent you're all suggesting to go from a nap at 1.45 to a nap at 3pm. 15 min changes usually reek him weeks to settle into. If be too scared, really it seems wrong??

I'd suggest a nap at 2pm.
Whilst not letting him nap until 3pm might sound horrendous, I think Aishi was just giving an example of how a routine *might* look. I don't think we had your current nap time (until now) to work on so advice is coming to support you on limited information.

Honey I know this is really hard for you and the advice may appear confusing. When advice appears confusing it's because different things work for different kids and only YOU are there with your LO.  The confusion and stress surrounding this may feel overwhelming and may feel like it over-rides your Mummy instinct, but your Mummy instinct is still there. Try to let that voice be heard 

You have said there is no way he will do a 12 hr night, going on my experience I would agree there are LOs who do not do a 12 hr night with a nap. I feel it is not vital to get a 12hr night, only that you find a routine that works for you and your LO. (like I said, for my LO this was a 2hr nap and a 10 hr night, with some 9hr too. It wouldn't suit all LOs but it doesn't have to, you only need to find what works for *your* LO.)

(I see you have chosen a 45 min nap for today. I personally think it is early to be capping nap so short but I wish you success and holding your hand) x

[Straffles]

Capping to 45 mins because 1hr nap was causing such short nights and late bts??

[Straffles]

Predictably he won't go to sleep at 6.

A different nap length every day for over a week so we really are lost now. I am going to need some help, seriously.

I will post our last two weeks times if that will be of use?

I will have to wait for him to go to sleep. I can't see this being in less than an hour or two. It's 6.30

[Straffles]

I guess my main question right now is, whatever advised route I choose, how do I get there given I've been changing nap length every day and have nothing to go on?

[kaipooi]

Do bear in mind that late bedtime and short nights can be caused by OT as well. Not just too long naps. If the former is the case, then nap capping will only make it worse.

If you have tried earlier and capping naps and it isn't working, why not try pushing out naps and let him sleep as long as he wants to catch up. Then short afternoon and BT. If he is really horrendously OT, he will go down with a short afternoon A time.

[jessmum46]

Just going to add hugs for now, there are lots of people here to advise but you must bear in mind we have all gone through the 1-0 in very different ways so none of us will be able to tell you exactly what will suit Benji.  I know it's hard but don't read our advice as conflicting, just see it as various options, each of which you would have to try for a week at a minimum to be able to say whether or not it will work for you

In terms of how do you get to whatever plan you've chosen?  Well, you just start with the morning and do it, sorry if that sounds silly  but if (for example) you choose to do a 45 mins nap at 1.45pm and then 6pm bt, you put him down at 1.45pm, wake him after 45 mins, then put him down for bed at 6pm.  And leave him to go to sleep when he's ready if he's happy messing about, or use WIWO (or whatever you'd normally do) if he needs you.  And you do the same every single day for at least a week.  You need to expect that you will encounter resistance, OT and some long days or EWs.  But changing things on a daily basis will not help at this point.  You should be able to see after a week or so if things need to be changed xx

[Straffles]

KTherine that's what I've done today yes.

1.45pm for 45 mins with 6pm bt.

I thought this was a one off to catch up the ot overnight as bec advised.

I can't see how I wd continue with a 6pm bt that wd be madness!

Will get on computer ASAP so I can reply properly x

[Aishi]

((Hugs)) straffles. Yes i was only providing a scenario of what worked for us wrt times i posted. Agree with pps advice about choosing a plan to suit you and sticking with it for a week to see if a pattern emerges.

Why would what you did today so 45 min nap and 6pm bt not be suitable? Lots of los have 6/ 6.30 bts...once youve tried it for a weekyou can then assess whether it works or not as that will give benji time to settle into the routine so yes there may be ew but the week will give him time to adjust and perhaps lengthen nights. If it doesnt work then we can go back to the drawing board knowing that this method didnt suit benjis needs yk?

Hope that makes sense!

[Straffles]

Hello and thank you to all my wonderful online handholders.

This is where we are: I totally understand you shouldn't mess with things on a daily basis. Never have. I've always waited two weeks when I've made a change. That's all changed the last two weeks

So today I went with nap 1.45-2.30, BT 6pm (From a 4.30 WU/6.20 get up). Benji fell asleep at 7pm btw. If I follow your advice, Katherine, I should really stay with this for a week. But that worries me because we only did the 6pm (7pm!) BT as a one off because he's so OT after that 8hr 45 minute night. Should I really stick with this? Or stick with the nap from 1.45-2.30 but a normal BT (I normally put him to bed at 6.45 for a 7.30 asleep if all things are working normally).

This is what it all looks like written out. I hope this gives people the info they've been askiong for to be able to help me decide how to proceed tomorrow....

PS I;m really worried it IS possible I capped too early to the 1hr nap, and that those shorter nights meant OT not UT. At the same time, he'd been sleeping1hr 15 nap for almost 2 months and every few days did a 9 hour night.

Tues 28th October
Wu 6.37 - Sleep 1.48-3.05; 1hr17 - Bt 7.40 - NWs 4.50 -
Night length 9hr10

Wednesday 29th October
Wu 6.15 - Sleep 1.53-3.05; 1hr12 - Bt 7.23 - Nws 3.30; 4.30
Night length 10hr45

Thursday 30th October
Wu 6.15 - Sleep 1.54-3.05 - Bt 7.50 - Nws 4.30
Night length 10hr10

CAP NAP
Friday 31st October
Wu 6.20 - Sleep 1.56-2.56; 1hr - Bt 7.30 - NWs 11.46; 1.05; multiple wakings with ss; 4.45- awake til 5.40
Night length 11hr20

Saturday 1st November
Wu 6.50 - Sleep 1.55-2.55; 1hr - Bt 7.10 - Nws 1.30; 2.30; 5.30
Night length 11hrs

Sunday 2nd November
Wu 6.10 - Sleep 1.54-2.54; 1hr - Bt 7.22 - Nws 10.30; 12; 5.50 Night length 10hr30/10hr55

Monday 3rd November
Wu 6.30 - Sleep 1.56?-2.56; 1hr - Bt 7.37 - NWs 5.05 very upset, fell asleep by 5.30
Night length 10hr 57

Tuesday 4th November
Wu 6.35 - Sleep 1.50-3.50 - Bt 7.24 - Nws 3.30 -
Night length 11hr12

Weds 5th November
Wu 6.36 - Sleep 1.51-2.51 - Bt 7.20 - Nws 4.15
Night length 11hrs03

Thursday 6th November
Wu 6.35 - Sleep 1.51-2.51 - Bt 7.24 - Nws 2.30; 4.30
Night length 11hrs 06

Friday 7th November
Wu 6.35 - Sleep 1.58-2.57 - Bt 7.30 - Nws x4 awful
Night length 11hrs+

Saturday 8th November
Wu 6.30 - Sleep 1.55-2.55 - Bt 8.15 - Nws 2; 4.30
Night length 10hr10

Sunday 9th November
Wu 6.37 - Sleep 1.55-3.55 - Bt 7.20 - Nws 9.15; 5.05, awake 5.15
Night length 9hrs 55

Monday 10th November
Wu
Sleep 1hr
Bt 9.07!
Nws 2.30; 3.30; 5.15
Night length 10hrs 26

Tuesday 11th November
Wu 7.40 - No nap day - Bt 6.00! - Nws 4.20
Night length 12hrs 30

Wednesday 12th November
Wu 6.37? - Sleep 1.52-3.13; 1hr20 - Bt 7.45 - Nws 5am couldn't resettle
Night length 9hr15

Thursday 13th November
Wu 6.20? - Sleep 1.53-2.38 45 mins - Bt 8.07
Nws 12; 5-took ages to get back to sleep at ew
Night length 11hr10

Friday 14th November
Wu 7.22 - No nap - Bt 6.05/25 kept waking ot - Nws 11.30; 5.05 awake
Night length 10.5hrs

Saturday 15th November
Wu 6.22 - Sleep 1.52-3.17; 1hr25 uncapped - Bt 7.30ish though prob earlier
Nws 2.10; 5.00
Night length 10hr50

Sunday 16th November
Wu 6.30 - Sleep 1.52-1.47 55 mins (woke himself), tantrumed - Bt 7.52 - Nws 12; 4.30 AWAKE
Night length 8HR 45

Mon 17th November
Wu 6.22 -Sleep 1.46-2.31; 45mins; BT 7.00; nws?


BTw, someone just said that late BT plus EW can also mean OT. This is my struggle. You try something and leave it to see what happens. Late BT and EW. You still don't know if it's OT or UT and so what to do becomes unknowable as a result.

If I capped down to an hour too early, which is possible, then we need a week of longer naps to find out. Or not.

I can't tell you all how much I appreciate your help. My mind is addled. I haven't had a night's sleep in almost three years. I did have a 4 hour stretch a few times. So please do forgive me if I am not properly fgrateful or not properly able to take in what you say.

Tomorrow I guess I shoudl do a 45 min nap from any WU at 1.45pm. But BT? ALso, I haven't mentioned that 90% of the time on waking from a 1hr nap, Benji has tantrumed/cried for anything from 10 mins to 30 mins. Today most of the afternoon. Was happier by 5pm.

Suzy X

[Straffles]

Thanks Aishi you replied while I was replying

I get what you say. It makes sense.

The reason I say I cdn't do 6pm BT is because he's had a 7.30pm BT for like EVER. It's a sudden change. Bec told me it's just a one off because he's so OT you see.

Oh and also because of the state he was in today after the nap and how hard it was to get him to bed, I guess.

The other point is this, and this one really worries me: I wait for a week and see what happens, right? Well I don't know what to make of what happens. Ever! So how do I then know how to act? How bad can it get?

XXXX

[Straffles]

My partner says no way to a 6pm BT for a week.

He says go back to our normal BT and stick with that for a week. That's 6.45 pd for a 7.30ish settle.

We've been doing that for months.

WDYT? Do I need to fight him?

[kaipooi]

Oh big hugs to you sweetheart