Nap before proper sleep at night- wakes after 20-60 mins.

[Marie36]

Hi. This is my first post on here. Our Son is nearly 25 weeks old. His sleep has really improved but there are still issues. He's gone from not sleeping until midnight to much earlier. I have been unable to follow EASY as he feeds to sleep. This happened unintentionally and now I'm going to try gentle removal to try and break the habit. I want to avoid crying! The issue at the moment is that after bedtime routine, which involves nappy free time followed by bath, feed, sleep, he has a short sleep, from 20 mins to an hour. He falls asleep half way through a feed. He then wakes and won't settle without feeding. I feed him then he sleeps from 4-6 hours before waking for another feed. We had a few weeks of a 6-7 hour stretch of sleep but that stopped around 4 months when he had a cold. I would really like to stop this nap before proper sleep. Tonight he also woke a second time, just 15 mins after falling asleep. He was really upset and the only way I could settle him was to feed him again. Any advice please?

[lauradj]

I think you will find if you stick to the order of EASY that the problem will likely fix itself.  It can be difficult to keep LO's awake for feeds when they're newborn but by this stage you should be able to wake your LO from a feed either by gentle holding him upright, or walking your fingers up and down his arms and legs, something to stimulate him.  Once he's awake, keep him busy for his A time, which should be around 2-2.5hrs.  Go for a walk, play on the activity mat, sing songs,anything to get him stimulated. 
As well, make sure you're following a good 4S for the bedtime routine.  It should be very clear for him when it's time for sleep. 

[Marie36]

Thank you for your reply. The difficulty with following easy is not that I can't keep him awake after feeds, but that he relies on feeding when he wants to fall asleep, so now thinks he can only sleep when fed to sleep. Putting him down drowsy but awake, ssh/ pat etc don't work for this reason. He settles himself sometimes during the night, and can also be settled with help in the night sometimes to get him back to sleep if he doesn't need a feed. Our routine would look more like ESAEAESAEA. The 4s bedtime routine - I used to swaddle him but he was getting frustrated trying to find his hands to hold his comforter, so we stopped swaddling and he sleeps in a sleeping bag now.

[lauradj]

Have you tried PU/PD?  Some babies respond better to that, especially as they get older.  Tracy recommends starting as young as 3 months so you should be good to go. 
When do I use PU/PD?
How long will it take for PU/PD success?
How to PU/PD (inc age adaptations)

[Marie36]

Thank you for your reply and for the helpful links. I really would like to try a no cry method, as I struggle to let him cry. I was planning on trying Pantleys gentle removal plan, so have started trying to take him off the breast before he's asleep.
 Last night he woke 3 times after his initial 50 min sleep from 8pm He then slept for 31/2 hours, then 3 hours, then 1 hour. I tried to settle home without feeding after the 1 hour sleep but he got so upset after 20 minutes I gave in and fed him. I sort of tried pu/pd but he didn't settle at all in the whole 20 mins and cried harder when I put him down. Each time he fed in the night he seemed to be hungry and was gulping it down. Do you think it could be due to a growth spurt or wonder week coming up?
I was also wondering if the nap when he first goes to sleep could be due to bring OT so should try bed a bit earlier? Do you think this could be the case? What do you think of Pantleys gentle removal plan? Sorry, lots of questions! I really appreciate your help though.

[lauradj]

I can definitely understand your desire to avoid any crying.  We are at BW are strong advocates against CIO or CC in any form.  However, it's also important (for both you and baby), to remember that crying is the only form babies have of communicating with you.  While doing sleep training, your baby may cry because you're changing his routine, and very few people enjoy that experience.  The key with BW is that your baby is never left to cry alone.  You are there to comfort them, support them and reassure them that they are ok.  It's also important that you can distinguish between his mantra cry and his 'I need you!' cry, because responding too quickly can undo his hard work to fall back to sleep on his own.  The gentle removal plan has worked well for many parents so if you like what you see, go for it!
I just noticed that you're LO is going to bed at 8pm.  That may be too late, thus resulting in poor sleep.  If you want to post your EASY, there may be some trouble shooting we can do during the day time that would also help eliminate the NW's. 

[Marie36]

Sorry for the very late reply. I just don't feel like I've had the chance to sit down and do it! We've had a couple of terrible nights- waking every 1 1/2-2 hours after an initial 3 hour sleep. I was able to settle him without feeding at a few wake ups and fed him twice between 12 and 7am. This has improved over the last 2 nights, with 2 wake ups after midnight. I think you could be right about going to bed too late so we're working on that. We're aiming for 7.30 at the moment and will do it tomorrow night. We don't really have an EASY that I can show you. Feeding is all over the place at the moment. I'm aiming for roughly 4 hourly feeds during the day, with a mini feed at nap time ( while he still feeds to sleep) Although I'm more guided by when he seems hungry than the clock. I'm finding that he is getting really distracted when feeding so there are times when I've tried, he's not wanted it, then been hungry a bit later. 
He usually has short naps, 20mins to 40 mins. Sometimes I've been able to extend them - we had 2 1hr 15min naps this week, but not often. The first nap of the day is around 2 hours after waking, and the others he tends to show signs (getting grizzly and rubbing his eyes) 21/2-3 hours after waking.
I wrote the above yesterday. Last night was another difficult one. He fed 4 times after midnight. I tried to settle him without feeding but he ended up inconsolable so I fed him. I'm still thinking that this disruption could be due to wonder week and growth spurt. Although would you expect the increased feeding during the day as well as at night? He does seem to be developing new skills all of the time at the moment too. Sorry for the long disjointed reply! We managed bed last night at 7.45 so will try to bring it forward to 7.30. 

[lauradj]

I'm sorry to hear things haven't really improved, that's so frustrating as a parent!  From what I can see, you may have two issues going on.  If you're doing a top up feed before each nap, DS is getting used to snacking as opposed to having a good solid feed when it's offered.  The other issue is that he's not getting a ton of sleep during the day, and good day sleep begets good nights. 
I think if you can really focus on feeding DS and then getting him out and about to do things for the rest of his A time, you will have an easier go of things.  If he falls asleep while feeding, wake him.  Take him outside and show him his world, play with blocks, take him swimming, have a friend and their child over.  Whatever you need to do to break the feed to sleep association.  When he has been awake for 2.5-3 hrs (eyes awake to eyes shut), then he can nap.  If he wakes during his day time naps, use whichever method you're comfortable with to try and help him get back to sleep.  That can be Shh-Pat, PU/PD, GW whatever you choose.  If you can get longer day time naps and really focus on achieving a 7/7:30pm bed time, that will hopefully work together to give your baby better sleep. 

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