3.5 months old- When shall we start EASY and sleep training?

[Nilsli]

Hello!

I have a 3.5 m old boy (14 weeks) and normal weight, healthy etc.

I am reading the EASY books and I cannot wait to start as I realize we are doing all those accidental parenting stuff ... At night, I breast feed him to sleep. During naps, I rock him in his "mobile cot", in stroller, or baby ergo wear... He never sleeps in his normal cot during naps and never falls asleep on his own.... He eats with 3 or 4 hours intervals.

We have a routine when he goes to bed (7-7.30 pm). I breast feed him to sleep. He gets a dream feed at 11 pm, and normally wakes up 2 or 3 am. He sleeps until 5 am and think it is morning (start to talk, laugh etc...).  Then I take him in our bed and we co-sleep until 6 or 7 (I breast feed laying down).

I am currently observing his patterns (and ours- what we do). But I wonder when to start "for real" as he is between the "3 month and 4 month" advice. PU/PD is not recommended before 4 months. It might be confusing if we start one sleep method and then switch to PU/PD.

Also, we are going to Spain next week for 2 week vacation... Shall we wait until AFTER vacation to start or should we start ASAP as the older they are, the more difficult it is to break habits? If we start now, and it gets interrupted with Spain, he might get confused?!?! Don't know.

Please advice as I am worried we are continuing our accidental parenting rituals and it gets harder and harder each day to break it....

THANK YOU!!




 Think it will be hard.

[rugbykaf]

My advice would be to enjoy your holiday and start in ernest when you get back. 4mo is still very young in my opinion. Your LO already has a good bedtime routine and his feeding schedule sounds great. I think you might be surprised at how quickly he responds to your efforts to get him to fall asleep on his own.

Enjoy your holiday

[newkidontheblock]

Hi there and welcome! Agree with PP that you should enjoy your holiday.

That being said, there are ways to gradually move towards independent sleep without causing much disturbance. Reading your post, I see that you already are doing so many things right -- He is feeding at 3-4 hour intervals, great, and he is going to bed at the perfect time and you are dreamfeeding:) Starting with the BW techniques doesn't mean that you have to abruptly change everything but slowly start incorporating some different habits to your routine.

So firstly, could you post a general outline of your daily routine in EASY format. SO..
E - 7 am
A-
S -

Also, when he wakes at 3 & 5, is it due to hunger? Have you tried feeding and laying him back in his crib? I feel that he is starting his day early because he needs a bit more activity time during the day. Once you post your routine, we can see

I think you might be surprised at how quickly he responds to your efforts to get him to fall asleep on his own.

^^ Completely agree. With DD, I nurse her before bed, then burp and sing a song and then lay her down. Till 4 months, I would hold her for a bit till her eyes started drooping but then she started asking to be PD and now she does it on her own! I also used to nurse her down for naps but started inserting a tiny activity - diaper change/ looking out of window, and so she got PD awake and drowsy. Later, we incorporated a good wind down routine for naps, so she knows what is coming. They really catch on quite quickly!

HTH

[Nilsli]

Hello
Thanks for the answers!!

Every day is somewhat different, but below is an example of our "routines" (from yesterday). I think he is hungry when he wakes up at night because he eats a lot when he wakes up. I really try to feed him more (longer) during the day, but he is a bit fussy and does not want any more.

Also, he gets tired quick during activity and I think over tired as he always fuss when being put in the stroller or sling... So I am not sure I can extend activity time. It is tricky to find the balance between not tired and over tired, so I take him when he start to show signs of being tired.

We have no real routine for naps. I put him in the stroller/ sling and he falls asleep there. Sometimes right away, sometimes it takes a while.

E: 06.00 (ate 30 min, with a nappy change in between)
A:
S: 07.20 sleep 1.30 h in baby sling

E: 09.10 (woke up at 9.00 but I changed nappy before eat). Ate 20 min.
A:
S: 10.30 in stroller (was awake 10 min within nap)

E: 12.20 (30 min)
A:
S: 1.30 h (mobile cot on balcony- rocking to sleep)

E: 15.30 (eat 35 min)
A:
S: 17:00 25 min cat nap

E: 18:00- very fussy at breast. Took a while to fall asleep (on breast ;-)
A:
S: 19:40 for night

Dream feed: 23.00
Woke up 02.15: 10 min feed. Also woke up after 20 min. for another 10 min
Woke up at 05.00 "for the morning": chatting, giggles, he made a poo and I had to change

Some mornings he is awake at 4 am and wants to play! Crazy. ;-)

All input welcome!!! Thank you!!

[Buttonbobs]

Hi there.

This can be a tricky time with BFing as LOs get more and more interested in what is going on around them. If you are struggling to keep him feeding for a good time during the day you could try feeding in a quiet, dark room to see if that makes a difference.

I hear what you are saying about it being difficult to tell what is UT and what is OT, his fussing going into the sling or stroller could be either so it is necessary to look at the routine as a whole to get a better idea, and over time it may become easier to distinguish as his behaviours for UT and OT become more different.

This is a link to the average A times for babies:

Average A times- BOOKMARK ME!

As you can see, the average A time for a baby of this age (from eyes open to eyes shut, and including feed and wind down) is 1.30-1.45ish. Some LOs are having less and some more as this is the time of the first sleep transition in the daytime and therefore some have already transitioned to 3 naps, others haven't. The fact that sometimes you are getting 4am "cot parties" occasionally indicates to me this may be the start of his needing less day sleep and having this naps a bit more spaced out.

LOs of this age can be used to having their naps at a particular time so can show signs of tiredness before they really need to go to sleep for naps. Could you try extending each A time just ten minutes extra per day. You can still do the sling/buggy naps if you like or ou could try for one nap per day in the for. This might still be maintainable while you're on holiday.

Have you read this?

Time to Transition - 3hr, 3.5hr or 4hr EASY

What do you think?

It is always easier to St a baby if they're already getting the right amount of sleep so there isn't any reason why you can't fix the routine now and then do the ST once you're home.

[Nilsli]

Hello! Thank you !!
Agree. I will try to keep him up for a little longer during activity.
Today he also woke up at 5. Pooed, and I had to change him and then he was fully awake... and me too. So we started the day... Might not be optimal.

Today he had 4 naps:
1.40 h
1.45 h
35 min
25 min

Total 4,5 h in naps.

He usually sleeps 13-15 hours in 24 hours. Mostly around 14. Is that OK? So maybe he needs less napping time if I want him to sleep 7 pm-7 am?!? Or should he sleep more total time?

Thank you!

[Nilsli]

Hello again!
Are there any more detailed 3,5 hour schedules? I cannot find any on the forum.
Shall I always plan for the feeds, rather than the Sleep?
Thank you very much again ;-))!