6 month old waking at 5!

[Kmckee999]

Hi
In desperate need of some help please, not really sure where to start..

My lo has always slept well during the day and until 3/4 months slept well at night. She began sleeping  7-7 which was great.
I've always followed the easy plan and she was a happy breast fed baby until 5 months and then moved onto a bottle.
She goes to bed around 7 but is now waking at 5am chatting to herself quite happily in her cot. I've tried leaving her but her talking gets louder and I worry she will wake my 4 yr old who I've also had recent sleep issues with!! I've given her a dummy which on occasions drops her off for another half hour but generally she takes it out and starts talking again. We've shh pat but isn't working now at this time. By 6am I'm having to get her up.
We have started solids but I'm 100% sure she isn't waking hungry. She never finishes her 7oz bottle during the day and even at 6/630 am isn't that interested, this morning has left 2oz?! Last weigh in was 18'8 always been a chunky monkey 
She generally has 2-2 1/2 hours of activity but looks tired and gets grumpy as if ready for sleep early in the mornings. I sure she wouldn't if she went till 7am. Her cues have always been easy to read and she's always gone to sleep by herself for naps.

Do I shorten her day time naps but I fear she will be more unhappier, I never let her have more than 3 hours a day. Try the wake to sleep method? Or feed her at 5 (although I'm convinced she isn't hungry) and put her straight back down?
I know 6 months a grow spurt may be occurring but the has been like this for at least 2 months. She doesn't appear to be teething although very dribbly but always has been.
Thanks for any advice

[*Ali*]

Can you post her EASY with times please?  I'm having trouble working out how 3 hrs of naps and A times of just 2.5hrs would fit into a 14 hr day. Thanks.

[Kmckee999]

Hi
Well over the last month things have been more difficult depending whether I can get her back to sleep.
She was:
E -7am
A -730am
S -930am
Y -1030

E -11
A -1130
S -130/2
Y -3

E -330
A -4
S -430
Y -5

E- bit of rice/fruit
A - bath
S - feed then bed for 7pm
Awake at 5

But now mornings are thrown by not knowing what to do. Of late she's been up at 6 so the plan is an hour before but generally she wants to go down for her first nap by 730am. Today I've kept her up till 830 but she wasn't happy?

She has breakfast now as well but that is given at different times. I was giving at 7am before bottle but due to being up so early I didn't want to get into that habit of her having breakfast at 6am is I've been giving her milk then and breakfast between 7-8am?

Thank you

[*Ali*]

Ok so she has 3 naps if 1hr each? In that case I would aim to push her A time closer to 3hrs and try for 2 long naps of around 1.5hrs. I think you are right to push her first nap later as a early nap can encourage early waking.

If she is just talking to herself I would leave her to it and only get her up once she starts crying for you. You could also try wake to sleep at 4 am.

Yes generally we recommend giving solids 1hr after milk. Milk (breast or formula)  is still their main source of nutrition until 12mo.

[Kmckee999]

Thank you yes I have read the 3-2 transition pages today and decided to give that a go. Not sure how she'l cope with not having the 3rd nap esp when awake so early but will try my best.
Thanks again

[*Ali*]

You don't need to jump straight to 2 naps overnight. You would probably be better off increasing each A time gradually so she doesn't get OT.

[Kmckee999]

Ah ok we have had a poorly household for last couple days so didn't see the last reply until now 

Being that she has a rotten cold hasn't helped as the first night she was awake every hour. Now I wasn't sure if that was the cold or the fact she was OT from only having one early morning nap, as she wouldn't settle for the second nap. The last 2 days have been better although she isn't having much longer than an hour for her second nap around 1pm and I'm finding that by 6pm she is having to go to bed. I read you can bring bedtime earlier whilst doing this transition but for how long? I don't want her normal bed time to be 6pm.
On the plus side this morning she woke at about 4am I gave her a dummy and she went back off till about 645!

Thank you

[*Ali*]

I'd just do early BT when you feel she needs it. She is obviously making up the lost sleep at night since you got a 12hr45 night so that sounds like it works for her.

[Kmckee999]

Thank you I will do that. I think if she had the full 1.5 hr naps during the day BD could get back to 7.

Last night she woke around 1130 which is not like her at all but could be the cold. The dummy sent her straight off again. But she still woke again at 5am having her cot party and it took a good 30 minutes of ssh pat to send her off until 7.
Please tell me we won't have to do this every morning at 5am 

[*Ali*]

No you won't always have to do this.

You could also try wake to sleep at 4am.
How do I address habitual wakings? (wake-to-sleep and other methods)

[Kmckee999]

Not a good night... Think we're both so tired

Her naps yesterday we're short as she was waking up coughing I managed to ssh pat her back in the afternoon but she seems OT and full of this cold. As am I and my Boy of 4!

She went down at 7 last night but was unsettled snuffling around. Woke at 3 for about an hour unable to breath managed to send her off again about 4 but she was awake again as normal at 515!

Should I let this cold run its course and start again next week with wake to sleep?
Thank you

[*Ali*]

Yes it does sound like the cold is disturbing things.

[Kmckee999]

Things seem to have gone from bad to worse...
Her cold is better now and she seems happy during the day but is getting more tired. I'm not sure the 2 naps is helping or not tbh. She is so tired come 6 pm but trying to keep her awake till 645/7, she is now falling asleep on her bedtime feed and not winding well. Could wind be waking her now?

Last night she woke at 2.10am chatting away for about 45 mins dropped off until 5.15 chatting again when given the dummy she snuggles into her blanket like she's still tired and after half hour or so drops off again till 7.10
Last night we were fortunate that I was able to leave her chatting as my 4 yr old stayed out but I can't leave her chatting so loud as I'm in fear of her waking him up!
Beside sound proofing his room I don't know what to do 

Is habitual waking, waking the exact same time every night because lately she's been all over the place but normally is within half hour or so around 4.30-5.15?

Thank you for advice

[*Ali*]

It's really common for babies to wake in the early hours, chat to themselves send then fall back to sleep. There isn't much you can do.  Has it ever actually woken your DS? I think you may be surprised what he will sleep through. Mine share a room and almost never wake each other in the middle of the night even when one has had a screaming night terror. And even if something does wake them i just tuck them in and they go back to sleep as they are still so tired.

[Kmckee999]

She never use to wake in the middle of the night before, but when she is chatting so loud at 5am by about 530 is has woken, and then he's awake. He would normally sleep till 7!
I've just got him back on track for being jealous of his new sisiter, he was getting up hourly a few months ago and has just settled again hence the anxiety about him being woken again.

But I spoke to him today about it and said if you hear her in the night to just try and ignore her and go back to sleep. As u say I can't see what else i can do.
Between my kids I'm destined never to have a decent nights sleep... Ha