1yr old - does this sound OT to you?

[Martini~]

Just an idea Hon - I see periods when my DS needs longer naps/nights. Usually it's 1-2 weeks, and id driven by teething, growth spurt, getting on track after illness or wonder week. So maybe when you were capping you missed this part and that's why he became so OT. It happened to me during Xmass 2014 when I was capping DS's first to 1.5h to squeeze in another nap in the afternoon. And out of a sudden despite doing 1.5h first nap, he was ready for his afternoon nap much earlier and after sleeping 30min, he still barely managed to get till normal BT. Now with being on on uncapped nap I also see this. Weeks on 1.5 with sporadical 2h are fine, but out of a sudden he did 2 weeks of almost only 1:45-2h naps at 14.5mo. WDYT?

[Mackjack]

I'm willing to consider anything!  So are you saying that you think hes OT and that's what's causing the messing about?   So I should try longer naps?

[jessmum46]

I would x

[Mackjack]

So if I put him down at the normal time ( 12.30) how long do you think I should let him sleep? And then should i put him down for BT at the same time (18.30)?

[Martini~]

i would let uncapped and normal bt for once.

[Mackjack]

Hi. Just thought I'd tell you - yesterday he fell asleep in the car in the morning for about 30 mins and then just would not go down for his nap later (unsurprisingly). By about 3.30pm it was a fight to keep him awake.  So we put him to bed at 6 pm, he mess about/ stripped off for 10 mins but was asleep by 6.15 and bar a 2 min WU at 11pm that just required a quick cuddle, he slept all night til 6.15am. Should I/do you read anything into that? ??

[Mackjack]

Sorry to keep posting.  He's in his cot now (bt) and hes thrown his duvet out and is whinging on and off and then throwing in a few raspberries. I'm so fed up of this.  I dont know how to deal with it. If I go and give back his duvet he will just throw it out again,  if I leave him he will eventually Start crying and I will have to go in - either way it's like I'm giving in to his "game". It just makes me feel so angry and frustrated because I can't break the chain. It's every night and slightly less at nap time and I spend all day dreading BT.

[Truly Blessed]

Hi Hun, sorry I've been AWOL. I'm not up to speed, but just want to send ((HUGS)) and to say I have BTDT. IIWM right now I would be sitting sideways by his cot with no eye contact, saying nothing but 'sleepy time' every now and then, and only if you feel you need to. If he throws his blanket just leave it on the floor, the way I used to do with blankies when DS would throw them. If he actually wants it back leave it for an extra minute every time before returning it, and just be there but don't interact. Even if he cries, it's okay, don't worry, he will be fine as long as you are there, just try and break the chain by not interacting at all.

I'm so sorry you're feeling so frustrated Hun, it is so hard. Remember this too shall pass. Maybe take a cheeky glass of wine in there with you .

Many ((HUGS))

Vicki.x.

[Mackjack]

Hi Vicki. Thank you so much. It actually wasn't too bad in the end.  I let him whinge and when it started to turn into more of a cry I went in his room. I expected him to just stand there messing about like he usually does but he laid down and was snuggling into his cot. I put the duvet back over him, stroked his head a little and left the room. Then he went to sleep.

So do you think staying in the room is better than going in and out ( as I have been?). I'm at that stage where I worry that any/everything I do is going to lead to some new annoying habit!!! X

[Martini~]

If that help or reassure you Mackjack, I really like Vicky's advice and believe that could benefit for you.

[Truly Blessed]

So do you think staying in the room is better than going in and out ( as I have been?). I'm at that stage where I worry that any/everything I do is going to lead to some new annoying habit!!! X

On the face of it, it seems to me that WI/WO is winding you both up, so maybe a change of tack is needed, but it's only a suggestion. If he settling well without you there, then it could be more than needed. I think he already has created an annoying habit and what you are doing is help him break it.

I totally get that it seems like a 'game' as DS is 5 and I still feel that way, but remind myself there is always a 'reason' behind the nonsense, and once that reason is dealt with/goes away the nonsense stops. I mean, when I am tired and go to bed I wouldn't 'choose' to throw off my duvet, blow raspberries and cry  .

x.

[Mackjack]

You're right, WIWO is driving everyone involved mad but you're also right that I need to find the root of the problem.

I tried giving him an uncapped nap the other day, like someone suggested - well, I say "uncapped", I actually woke him just before the 3 hr mark. BT that night was a disaster. He took 1hr 40 to go to sleep - the usual throwing his PJs, duvet out the cot etc. So that day looked like this

WU 6.20am (he had a NW for 40mins from 3am - think this was just a hangover from where he was getting over the chicken pox)

S nodded off in the car, managed to get him in his cot and he slept from 12.40 - 15.30

BT took him up at 18.30 and he didn't go to sleep til 20.10

He woke the next morning at 6.45am

So in the meantime we've gone back to our usual routine of

WU between 5.30- just before 6
S take him to bedroom about 12.30, messes about a bit but can sometimes be asleep by about 12.45 and we wake him after 1hr 30
BT take up to bed at 18.30 - asleep between about 18.50-19.30 after he's messed around

Do you think an earlier nap might make a difference? Think someone suggested this in an earlier post. There just seems to be so many combinations of nap length/time and BT time to try that I don't know what to try first. My mum (who looks after him when I'm at work) says she sometimes thinks he looks tired between about 10.30/11am and suggested I put him down for a nap then. What do you think - try it? And if so, should I cap or not? Or would this encourage EW? It does seem a shame that when he naps he could seemingly sleep for hours but we're usually waking him at 1hr 30.

It's just odd that having a nap at 12.30 for 1hr 30 and BT at about 18.30 seemed to be working for quite a while and we were getting morning WUs of about 6.15 with that routine (which suits me fine!). But the messing about at sleep time is getting worse and the WUs are getting earlier (although they are happy WUs). I also mentioned in an earlier post that he fell asleep one morning in the car for about 30mins and then wouldn't nap. He was shattered by about 15.30 but he went to bed at 18.00, asleep by 18.15 and except for a couple of minute NW at 23.00, he slept til 6.15am. I don't know what to make of that (if anything?).

Be honest, do I just need to give up, stick with things as they are (messing about for ages at sleep time, capping nap at 1hr 30 and EWs) and hope they improve???

[Truly Blessed]

Ugh, it really is messy isn't it Hun. Please don't think that I don't know how that feels, it literally drives me loop the loop! Forgive me, as I haven't read back over the whole thread, but just reading your last post, I am wondering if his nap is too late  and could do with moving earlier, even if it's just while you try and get things back on track. My thinking is this: A long nap results in a worse BT. However, the later the nap the longer the LO needs to/will sleep. So if you aim for something like this:

WU 6.00 (if that is when he wakes naturally right now  )

Nap 11.00 to 12.30.

BT 7.00

Maybe it would work. All depending on if he will take the nap that early  It will be more restorative and if he doesn't wake naturally he will be easier to wake. It gives him a good long afternoon of 6.5 as opposed to his 5 hour morning, which would hopefully mean BT is less of  a struggle.

I have done this with DS successfully during regressions while he was still on one nap as he was always willing to nap earlier when OT.

Thoughts 

x.

[Mackjack]

Thank you,  that's exactly what I've been wondering so it's great that you've tried this with your LO and had results. Right - I'm going to give it a try!  Will report back! !

[Truly Blessed]

Good luck Hun, I'm glad we were thinking alike.x.