Author Topic: 6 month waking at 4am to play  (Read 1876 times)

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Offline Kellyjs

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2015, 12:51:46 pm »
S you may know hun controlled crying is really not supported on is site as Tracy believed it broke the bonds of trust between a LO and its caregiver. Crying is his way of communicating with you and must be listened to to know how to move forward. Trust me, it will only make matters worse int  he long term. I'll post a link for you to have a read through.

It does sound like OT has built up there doesn't it? That and teething might be at play. What it does look like from the days you have posted is that the NW's are worse when he's had more DT sleep. Can you see that? For example Monday was only 2hrs total DT sleep and there were no NW's. Wednesday was definitely the worst for NW's and he had 3hrs 25mims of DT sleep. Then by Friday I think the OT has built up and teething is starting.

Typical Amounts of Day and Night Sleep
Cry it out (CIO): 10 reasons why it is not for us
« Last Edit: March 16, 2015, 12:54:49 pm by Kellyjs »



Offline chuckmum

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2015, 15:41:11 pm »
I know and I don't think I could actually go through with CC. I just feel desperate in the middle of the night when nothing will settle him back down and he's been up for 2 hours  :'(

Do we continue with pupd but without the pu part?

So the ideal solution (for now!) is that he has 2-2.5 hrs of daytime sleep with about 2-2.5 hours between last nap and bedtime and then sleeps for 12 hours. That's what was happening early last week but I don't understand how it went wrong so quickly. How do I prevent him becoming OT which then leads to long NW, poor naps and accumulating OT?

I extended his morning nap today with pupd and the APop and despite that he was really tired after 3 hours A time and he has been asleep for 1h 15 now. I'm hoping this gets him over the OT but now I'm worried that he'll have had to much daytime sleep and will be up again tonight.

Thank you for you help xx




Offline Kellyjs

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #17 on: March 17, 2015, 06:50:37 am »
Don't worry sweetie, it's hard in the middle of the night. Just keep repeating to yourself that it's just a phase. Yep, I'd continue as you have been with the pd, just be as consistent as you can. Use your words and your night time phrase over and over.

OT can happen at anytime hun even if he's on a routine that works for him. This can be because of teething or because he's learning a new skill. We just have to roll with it until it passes.

I'd just try and see if we can keep to no longer than 1.5hrs per nap for now and see if that helps initially. With that the CN will go if we're around the 3hrs A time anyway. That'll be around 3hrs DT sleep and offering 12hrs at night which is around average. If we hold that for a while we can see where we need to go from there x



Offline chuckmum

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #18 on: March 18, 2015, 06:32:48 am »
I'm so confused  :'( We had a rubbish night last night. He was up from 2-4am then woke at 5.25am and I haven't been able to settle him back down.
Do you think this is OT or UT?
Our day yesterday was:
WU- 5.40
S - 8.35 - 10.20
S - 1.30 - 2.30  (Crying when trying to settle, woke coughing after 30 mins but settled easily. Woke for class)
S - 4.10-4.30 in carrier
BT - tried to settle at 6.20 but took until 6.50
NW - 9, 2-4, 5.25

So he had a 13hr 10 day ( we were aiming for a 12.5 hr day but he wouldn't settle) with 3 hours of daytime sleep. I let him sleep a little longer in the morning as I knew I would need to wake him early in the afternoon.

I don't know if I should be trying to cap his daytime sleep at 2.5hr or if he's actually OT and that will make everything worse.

Offline *Liz*

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #19 on: March 18, 2015, 09:25:22 am »
What is he doing when he is awake in the night?? Does it always escalate to an 'I need you' cry?

I think it is partly developmental and partly that the last CN needs to go. Sleep that late in the day is likely leading to interrupted nights.

So mainly just a getting older/ things changing thing. The CN sometimes gives the decent night after a bit of OT creeps in I guess.

I do think sleep can just get very unsettled when things are in transition.

Offline chuckmum

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #20 on: March 18, 2015, 10:33:12 am »
He wakes up crying. When we go to him and try and settle him down he'll lie still for a few minutes with your hand on him but then wants to wriggle around his cot and pull himself up on the bars. We have never not gone into him as we don't think he'll settle himself (it's not a mantra cry). If you try to leave to let him play in his cot on his own he cries instantly and doesn't stop until you go back in. Usually what happens is after about 1.5 hours of wriggling/standing/trying to be settled he's tired enough and eventually a hand on his back will settle him.

Yesterday I forced the catnap in the carrier as he had been up since 2.30pm and we've proven that he can't do long activity times to bed so even a 5.30 bedtime was going to be too long.

This morning he went down 3hr 10 after waking (at 8.40) and slept for an hour but woke up really upset. I tried really hard to settle him but he just screamed until I gave him some milk. He seems grumbly and tired now but his next nap is due at 1pm so we are going to end up in the same situation as yesterday with a long activity time even to an early bedtime. It's so hard!!!

Offline jessmum46

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #21 on: March 18, 2015, 14:24:21 pm »
Hugs, doesn't sound like fun :(. Just a few observations - here 1h naps (and 1h45 for some reason...) tend to happen when LO is overtired.  He had a broken less than 11h night which can't be very restful....what was his mood like before that nap?  Was it a stretch to do the A time? 

I agree with Liz the catnap almost certainly has to go though.  I would actually abandon it entirely even if it's a long A time to bed, and instead do a super-early bedtime if needs be.  The only exception perhaps being only two super-short naps in the day.  So yesterday I would have gone for a 5.30/6 bedtime.  Yes I know he can't handle long A times before bed but by giving the catnap of 20 mins he potentially lost an hour or more's night sleep at the beginning of the night, and some more overnight from the long NW.  An early bedtime at least gives the chance that if he wakes after say 10h it's well before his body thinks it is time to get up for the day so you are more likely to get him back down.

Unfortunately there's no quick fix for any sleep silliness - I keep trying to find one so I do sympathise!  But I would maybe stick with two naps and just hang in there for a while xx
***Katherine***







Offline chuckmum

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #22 on: March 20, 2015, 19:08:33 pm »
Thanks all for your replies.
We've dropped the catnap and have been doing bedtime at 5.30. Unfortunately we've been having a lot of night wakings (about every hour or two throughout the night) but he has been slightly easier to settle. He's been waking up between 5.25 and 5.50 and it's been impossible to settle him then but I figure he's probably getting hungry by then. Hopefully when the clocks change it will move us to more sociable times!
I'll continue to log our EASY and NW and let you know how we get on.
Thanks x

Offline Kellyjs

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #23 on: March 21, 2015, 06:39:34 am »
Glad they're easier to settle hun, that's so much better than long-drawn out ones x



Offline chuckmum

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #24 on: March 21, 2015, 06:58:13 am »
Help please! I'm trying to stay positive and hope that things get better soon but we seem to be going the wrong way  :'(
Last night we was up nearly every 1.5 hours from about 9pm. He woke at 5am and despite rocking, cuddling, singing and milk my husband and I could not get him back down. He was calm and looked asleep in my arms at about 6am after some milk but the second I put him down he was head up, smiling and blowing raspberries.
Here is our EASY for the past few days (for my own calculations I've added total daytime sleep (TDS) and length of day (LD). I haven't includes his milk and meals but he's having about 5-7oz of formula at about 6.30, 10.30, 1.30 (depending on afternoon nap) and then 12-14oz before bed and three blw meals a day)

Wed 18th
WU - 5.25
S - 8.35- 9.40
S - 1- 2.20
BT - 5.30

NW - 6.30, 7.30, 9, 10.30, 11.30, 2-2.45

TDS - 2hr 25
LD. - 12h

Thur 19th
WU - 5.50
S - 9-10.30
S - 1.35 - 2.20
BT - 5.30 (settled by 5.45)
NW -  8-9 (lots of wake ups), 12.20-12.50, 2-2.30, 3

TDS - 2h 15
LD - 12h

Fri 20th
WU - 5.40
S- 9 - 10.20
S - 1.50 - 3
BT - 5.50
NW - 8.30, 10.20, 10.45, 11.30 (self settled), 2-2.30. 3.45, 5 (given milk and tried to resettle but unable)

TDS - 2h 30
LD - 12h 10

Sat 21st
WU - 5 (up at 6.30)

He's having such broken nights that I wonder if he's accumulating OT but it's so hard to tell with him and earlier in the week and last week I was trying to catch him up on sleep and we were having long NW were he wanted to play.

What do you think we should do?
Thanks xx

Offline chuckmum

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #25 on: March 21, 2015, 09:46:13 am »
Just to add... I have no idea how to get him to even a 5.30 bedtime today  :'(
He woke at 5am and I put him down after 3 hours as he'd had such a broken night, hoping for a long nap. He slept for 1h 15 min so now he's been awake since 9.15. I tried to resettle but he screamed and screamed and now seems quite happy. He does a maximum of 3h 15 - 30 activity time and usually naps for 1hr to 1hr 15min.

Xx

Offline jessmum46

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #26 on: March 21, 2015, 14:47:56 pm »
Hugs, it may have to be a three nap day today, that happens.  Just do your best to get through and start again tomorrow morning xx
***Katherine***







Offline chuckmum

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #27 on: March 22, 2015, 06:26:51 am »
I'm sorry to keep posting but we are really struggling and I don't know whether to preserve or if we are making the problem worse.
We have continued with no catnap and 5.30pm bedtimes but he has woken at 5am the past 2 mornings after waking pretty much every 1.5 hrs throughout the night.
We have tried everything to try and settle him back down at 5am to give us a better chance of getting into a normal routine but he is wide awake.
I don't know whether to keep pushing his activity times or if he's actually OT from lots of short interrupted nights. Yesterday I pushed him up to 3.5 hours and he seemed ok and only gets a bit grumbly at the end of his activity period although he did wake from his afternoon nap after 30 mins so was probably overtired then.
Do you think his frequent NW and EMW is from OT or U?
Thanks xx


Offline Kellyjs

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Re: 6 month waking at 4am to play
« Reply #28 on: March 23, 2015, 07:25:33 am »
Waking so often throughout the night is usually from teething in this house hun. Is there any signs of that going on? Could try medicating with ibuprofen to see if that makes a difference? ((Hugs)) I know NW's are hard work, we've all been there xx