Should we drop the nap? (3.25yrs)

[lilamom2]

Hello wise parents!

We're pretty deep into 1-0 transition territory at 3.25 years and I could use some advice. Here's what our schedule is

7:30am: I wake her up (almost 90% of the time)
1:15pm: down for nap (talks/plays for an HOUR first this week, then sleeps)
3:15pm: I wake up, if she's not awake
8pm: down for bed (for the past week talks/plays for an hour first).

For a while I've been waking her up at 7:30am and 3:15pm (if needed for the nap) and she's always mucked around happily some before falling asleep, but taking an HOUR for both nap and bed COMBINED with having to wake her almost every morning, is making me wonder if we'd be better off ditching the nap and doing a longer night.

I'm not very good at "play it by ear" and like to have each day the same, so I'd prefer to get rid of the nap (mostly) for good rather than trying to alternate days or trying to get her to nap EVERY day and having it be such an ordeal.

She's also been acting a bit tired lately, and I'm wondering if it's because her nights are too short. She seemed tired when I woke her this morning (after 10.5 night sleep. She has typically done 10.5-11 hour nights).

Thoughts??

[clazzat]

I think I agree - taking so long for nap and bedtime does suggest that perhaps she doesn't need it. What we did with both my girls (ds is not quite at that point yet) when the nap wasn't neccesarily needed, was to put them in bed with stories on a cd so they could lie in the dark and listen to it. Sometimes they slept, sometimes they didn't, but it gave them an hour of quiet time and it was easy to keep the days consistent that way - I was never able to deal with the idea of alternating nap/no nap either. In your situation I would put her down at about 1.30/1.45 and then get her up around 2.45 - even if she does sleep during that time, your a time to bed is a bit longer.

[Truly Blessed]

Hi Hun,

Having gone through sheer hell with DS and the 1-0 with nights as short as 9 hours for weeks on end, and no naps, it really can get a loss worse than this, and I see many threads to that effect too, which makes me nervous that you take the leap at this point when things aren't at crisis point yet YK  I wonder if as an alternative to Clazzat's suggestion (which was also one of my thoughts of getting her up after an hour (after no nap I would be tempted to bring BT forward) you could try this:

WU 7.30 (always)

PD for nap at 2 and wake at 3 regardless.

BT 8.30.

This might mean, she goes over quicker for the nap due to the longer morning and then long am over rides short pm, but the day is 13 hours and not 12.5. You could still leave her with audio stories at 8 pm, so that you get as much 'grown up' time. Or, it could have the same result as putting her down sooner.

You might gain some consistency back this way  Of course she may be one of the LO's who adapt beautifully, and of obviously you don't know until you try, it's tricky when a LO doesn't refuse the nap, as it isn't a choice which is taken out of your hands  .

I recently started audio stories for Sam to deal with BT nonsense, and he loves them, I think  he does find it very relaxing

Just bear in mind, the 1-0 isn't just about the overall sleep in any 24 hour period, it's about how the sleep is spread, and each LO is different, which is why I would just be a little cautious about going cold turkey  .

What do you think ladies  Whatever you decide, good luck Hun! Posting this in case you haven't seen it:

The 1-0 transition...Advice and Tips to help you through.

x.

[lilamom2]

Thank you so much, clazzat and Vicki!

I think she would definitely nap if we did 2-3pm. However, it seems that her mucking time before bed (increased to 1 hour!) is the same regardless of nap length.  Earlier this week she had a 30 min nap and still took about 45 mins to fall asleep, if I recall correctly.  That's one of the main reasons I'm thinking of dropping the nap altogether.  Just guessing based on "mommy instinct" I don't think that being up an extra hour of the day is going to affect what time she falls asleep all that much-- she's pretty active in her bed before she sleeps.

Thoughts???

Thanks again!

[jessmum46]

I guess just another perspective......DD was done napping totally by 2y5m and it was messing about for either nap or bedtime (or both) that were the tell-tale signs for us of it needing to go.  We managed the transition as others have suggested, offering a nap each day for a while and just bringing BT 30 mins earlier if she didn't nap (got her up after 45-1h if she was just playing) Then when we had more refusals than naps we just went for 'quiet time' so similar set-up but room not quite as darkened and gave her a few books/quiet toys.  I found she would still nap occasionally if really needed.  But as NNDs got more we would just whizz out in the car for 20 mins around 3pm if she was struggling - any more she was awful to wake - but that would take the edge off enough for BT.

My feeling was that transitions can be over-tweaked and actually in setting some simple rules the 1-0 was actually the easiest for us.  We may just have got lucky though!!

[theu.s.lees]

With M we had a similar problem at about the same time. He would be up forever in his bed if he actually napped. We had to do a few things. I started with still reading and getting him set up for nap but I woule leave his curtain open a bit so he could play with his cars or read for quiet time. Some days he'd fall asleep and others not. Now he rarely falls asleep (usually only after a really reqlly busy morning or a bad nights sleep). At first we brought BT earlier to make up for no naps as he needed it. But now (he's 4 this weekend) he typically doesn't need it. So his days start between 7:30-8 and he goes to bed around 7:45-8. Then he still does quiet time for 30-60 minutes when S sleeps so mommy has a little break. Maybe try just having quiet time so you both have a rest time even if it's not a nap. Quiet time doesn't affect his bT sleep since he's not sleeping.

[clazzat]

This is definitely the time to introduce the concept of quiet time - even now, at 8 and 6, my girls disappear for an hour in the middle of the day to give everyone a break. They haven't slept for a while, but taking some time out tends to help the rest of the day run more smoothly. It also means that I still have time to get some things done.

[Truly Blessed]

Just guessing based on "mommy instinct" I don't think that being up an extra hour of the day is going to affect what time she falls asleep all that much-- she's pretty active in her bed before she sleeps.

Thoughts???

Simply put, if that's your 'Mother's Instinct' go with it and I wish you all the luck in the world 

My feeling was that transitions can be over-tweaked and actually in setting some simple rules the 1-0 was actually the easiest for us.  We may just have got lucky though!!

Yup, very lucky!!!  Or:

even now, at 8 and 6, my girls disappear for an hour in the middle of the day to give everyone a break.

You don't have Daughter's, you have angels masquerading as children 

x.

[lilamom2]

Thanks so much, everyone!  Today she totally shocked me and went right to sleep for nap and had to be woken.  I think I'll give her a couple more days to see if she goes back to "normal" before trying something new.

Thanks for all the wisdom, though!!  It will be helpful when the time comes!

[lilamom2]

Okay, so the last two days have been CRAZY!!

Monday
7:30am: woke up
3-3:30pm: nap (went down at 1:15 and fell asleep right as I was going to get her)
8:30ish: asleep

Tuesday
6:45am: awake (VERY out of character)
2-3:15pm: nap (went down at 1:15pm)
9:20pm: asleep (went down at 8pm)

Wednesday
4:15-5:15am: happy NW
7:30am: woken up

The great thing is she is a really, really happy kid (for now! ), whether in bed or out.  However, it really seems like the nap is majorly messing with her sleep.  Should I...

(a) try for a later, 30  min nap?
(b) cut the nap altogether?

We *definitely* plan to institute a "quiet time" when the nap is totally gone, but just not sure how to manage these last days when she will still snooze late enough in the day.

[clazzat]

That looks to me like even a short nap is robbing from her night sleep, tbh.  I suspect that you might need to cut the nap altogether so that she sleeps more overall.  If you are aiming to do quiet time then I think that putting her down earlier and leaving her for an hour is probably your best bet, as it looks like she won't fall asleep in that time but will get her break.

[Truly Blessed]

If you go for the 30 min capped nap, maybe do it at the later time we discussed previously to ensure she goes right over, and then keep the day at 13 hours. You'd have to stick with it for a few days though Hun, to know where you are. It is hard, I agree it does look like day is robbing night but with her being happy, it's such a tricky call because when she drops the nap that might change . Some LO's have successfully kept a nap of 15/20 minutes in order to keep them at their best, trial and error. Good luck Hun.

x.

[lilamom2]

Well, today she was in crib from 1:15-2:45pm and never napped (but was quite happy for the most part!).

Went right to sleep at 8pm, and so far no night terrors, which we had had before when she skipped nap.

I'm considering not waking her in the morning and see how she handles two no nap days in a row. But I guess we'll see how the night goes and what time she wakes in the AM and go from there.

Thanks so much for the input, ladies!  I'm also wondering if a quite late, short catnap might be necessary... I think I'd prefer to just cut the nap, but if she seems to not handle that well, we may try for the catnap.

[Truly Blessed]

I'm considering not waking her in the morning and see how she handles two no nap days in a row. But I guess we'll see how the night goes and what time she wakes in the AM and go from there.

Yes, often a good place to start Hun, it may be that she is fine, but then you can clearly see she needs a CU nap on day 3, then you assess where to go from there, depending on the night.

I'm also wondering if a quite late, short catnap might be necessary... I think I'd prefer to just cut the nap, but if she seems to not handle that well, we may try for the catnap.

Again, works for some, we did this for a short time successfully, just 15 minutes, but not for long as things were constantly shifting 

x.

[lilamom2]

Thanks, Vicki!!

So yesterday she napped 1.25 hours then took 1 hour 20 min to fall asleep again! I was hoping that it was a fluke when it happened earlier in the week, but apparently not.

Going to reassess over the weekend with DH, who usually has good thoughts about her sleep. Thanks for all the advice!