LSN baby making life impossible!

[morvayc]

Really really really need advice from other mothers of LSN babies, as I will NEVER get a 12hr night, and LO NEVER tacks on!!
LO is a few days shy of 15 months, and is currently doing a combo of 1 and 2 nap days.  The major problem lies in the fact that regardless of which I do, I am ALWAYS getting EWs.  I haven't had a WU of 6am in months....and even then, they were rare.  I'm pretty convinced at this point, that at most, I am going to get a 10.5hr night.  If this is the case, my BT needs to be shifted to 8pm at least, but how do you do this when LO is currently waking at about 5am every day?

A typical 2 nap day:
WU-5/530
A-4hrs
S-15min
A-3hrs
S-1.5hrs
A-4.5/5hrs
S-645 ish

As you can see, a two nap day winds up being very long....sometimes over 14hrs, sometimes with 12 hrs total A.  I have to think that this must be contributing to OT, but I really don't know.  My LO is always happy and never looks tired.....basically I'm just guessing at the A times.

A typical 1 nap day:
WU-530
A-5.5hrs
S-2hrs-2hrs10min
A-5-6hrs
S-630-700

With doing 1nap days, I thought her nights would lengthen, but they really haven't....just eliminated the NWs that I seem to get with 2 nap days.  I'm wondering if I should just do away with 2 naps days, and stretch her morning out even more.  Like I said, my LO never looks tired, I'm just following what other mothers seem to do, which is 5-5.5hrs A before first nap.  Is there anyone out there who had A times of 6hrs when first transitioning, or whose LO is 15 months?

[MasynSpencerElliotte]

Hi there...I have a lsn lo who is 20 months old but we have been on one nap for over a year now! I would say if your lo is still having ew it is probably time to phase out the two nap days really. I really think the nights wont have a chance to lengthen unless you give it a good go on one nap. Tbh I am not sure what our A times were at 15 months but it seems.like we have had a 12:30/1 pm nap for ages and that is with a 6:30/7 am wake up. Bedtime has always been 8 pm for DD3 since she was a newborn.

[Martini~]

Hi Hon and welcome again! I'm so sorry that you are still having EWU:(.

And yes, some mothers can do even 8h of A first thing in the morning so with 6 WU nap at 2pm but still most of them do that because of EWU and short nap. As you want to push WU time I would say you need to push BT. I would do that in small 15min increments every 2 days let say. And yes, definitely i would stick to one nap day. What is the reason you are doing two naps?

[LovelyLilyandJack]

I agree with Heidi. We were on one nap at 10 months and my lo is also prone to 10.5hr nights. You might find she has to be on one nap days for quite a while before nights lengthen.

From what I remember, at 15 months we were doing something like this :

WU: 5.30 - 6.15
Nap: 12.30 - 1.30 or 2ish
BT : 7

Our nights are rarely over 11hrs too. In fact, we had a nnd yesterday and my lo has just woken from a 11.5hr night and that's pretty much a record here!  I go on 13-13.5 hr days instead of the standard 12hr days  - even after we dropped to one nap I tried to work on as close to a 13hr day as I could. A SEBT never worked for us cos my LO never tacked on reliably beyond 11hrs either.

Oops, posted with Martii. We had a phase of pushing BT back too, and that helped my sanity for a while when we were getting lots of EWs. But you may find a later nap and still a long A to bed helps lengthen nights slightly too.

[morvayc]

Thanks, ladies!

So what I'm gathering is that I should just stick to 1 nap, no matter what? I've never stretched her over 5.5hrs pre-nap, but I will go with 6hrs A today, for an 1130 nap.  On 1 nap days, she has generally been giving me about 2 hrs, but she always seems to wake a few times.  I never need to go in and resettle, but it always makes me second guess myself, thinking that she is OT....since this seems to be a new thing since starting 1 nap.  If she does a 2 hr nap until 130, what BT should I do? Martii, the reason for the 2 naps was because of the EWs.  I didn't think I should stretch her so far in the morning when just starting on 1 nap.....especially if OT was the actual reason for the EWs

[TB9]

DD2 is lsn and was on one nap well before 15mo as well.  I think around 15months her schedule was something like LL&Js LOs (but shifted by an hour to give her 8pm bedtime).  I know for sure by 17mo I was having to cut the nap to 1hr to get 11-12hrs night sleep!  So definitely ditch the second nap

I dont think it is absolutely necessary to have longer than 5.5hrs A before nap, as long as you are getting an ok nap (for a lsn LO I wouldnt expect more than 1.5hrs nap tbh  )  After a decent nap I would do 6hrs A before bed with dd2 usually, if she was fighting bed or waking through the night then I knew I had to cut her nap shorter.  If she didnt have a decent nap then I might do 5.5hrs A before bed, but would really try to get her to her normal bedtime.  Other than that I think its a matter of shifting bedtime by 15min every few days until you have a later bedtime and later wakeup

[okinawamama]

No advice, but I wanted to let you know that we too had 10.5hr max nights for DS, and found that they persisted until we went to one nap consistently. I (with the help of the ladies on the board) made the decision one day, we never went back, and after about a month, things got better. I think his body just realized that there wouldn't be random 2 nap days to catch up. It wasn't a pleasant transition, and I questioned the decision many times over as I watched him get pretty OT, but somehow, he began to tack on at night, and began sleeping more cumulative hours on 1 nap, than he did on 2 naps. Good luck! I hope your LO gives you some later WU's!

[morvayc]

Thank you soooo much for the support, ladies! She gave me a 2.5hr nap today, although I had to resettle at the 30min mark, and then I heard her wake a few more times.  I'm going for a 6hr A to BT, which would put us at 715pm.  I'll let you know how the night goes!

[Mackjack]

Hi. Cant stay long but just wanted to say I've been experiencing the same as you - DS is  15 months and went to one nap at 12 months.  He was EWing at around 5.15 - 5.45 for ages. I tried everything and what *seems* to have worked is cutting his nap to 1hr30. He now usually wakes after 6am with a BT of around 18.45. His A time before the nap is around 6 - 6.5 hrs.

Have a look at this thread that i started when he was 12 months - some stuff in there that might not be relevant bit some that ishttp://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=274133.msg3012046#msg3012046

[morvayc]

Mackjack, since your LO is around the same age as mine, are you surprised that he/she is doing 6-6.5hrs A time? I swear that I've read about a million posts on here, and I haven't found a single one that had A times as high, especially when first transitioning to 1 nap.  This is why I'm ALWAYS second guessing myself, and telling myself that my LO MUST be tired, because she's been up for 5 hrs.  Do you just know the correct A times based on the length of your nap, or the quality of night's sleep, or WU time?? It's all really really confusing to me, and I never know if EWs are due to OT or UT, or just having a crazy baby!

[TB9]

My dd1 was also lsn and on one nap at 8.5mo!  She was doing 6hrs A after her nap when she first transitioned...when you have a lsn baby all bets are off 

[morvayc]

So, yesterday went something like this:

WU-530
A-5hrs15min
S-2hrs30min (had to settle at 30min, and then woke a few other times, so the nap itself wasn't 2hrs30min)
A-5hrs55min
S-710

3 NWs between 1030 and 130, then awake at 430, 440, and 455.  I then gave a little milk and meds(just in case).
S-6-640

So, basically a little over 10hrs night sleep.  Where are these 12 and 13 hr nights that these other mothers get when first transitioning? God, I hate this!

[TB9]

Where are these 12 and 13 hr nights that these other mothers get when first transitioning?

Well, you *might* get longer nights as you stick with the one nap.  But, and I hate to be the one to say it, you may have missed the window to get long nights...it is very possible with a lsn LO that with a 2.5hr nap, a 10hr night is going to be all you get    What was her mood like before bed?  Was she happy when she woke in the morning?

[morvayc]

Tinkerbell,

Honest to God, I would sometimes rather have a moodier child, that way I would have some sense of how she may be feeling.  She is just happy happy happy all of the time, and shows zero tired signs (like last night).  When she woke this morning, she cried initially, but then it turned to just babbling.  After giving milk and meds, I stayed in the room and she was restless for an hour, but not crying, until she fell back asleep for 40minutes. I never know when to put her down after mornings like this, nor do I know how to set BT.  To I go by when she initially woke, or when she finally woke?  As for the 2.5hr nap, she never does this.  With the combination of having to settle after 30 minutes, and the few other wake ups, she probably only slept about 2hrs.

[Martini~]

Honey maybe the problem of her NWs lies in the fact the she is used to a thought that you will be next to her. How you generally address those NWs? 15mo can be going through ww, teething and will always be waking at night - the case is how to help them to go back to sleep without your assistance.