2-4 NW a night, need help

[Kellyjs]

Sorry hun, what did you do in the end?

I'm thinking a couple of night of EBT might work wonders, wdyt? X

[adkillip]

I trie EBT, started at 6:50 after BF he was crying and squirming it took an 1 he to get him to sleep. I mostly rocked and patted since he already fed. So he didn't fall asleep til8:05. Nw at 11 and 2. Awake this am at 6. Today we will work on our A time

[Kellyjs]

Oh dear, sorry it didn't go well 

Good luck with the A times.. Keep me posted ok? X

[adkillip]

Extending his A times this weekend wasn't too bad..he was a little cranky at the 2.5 hr mark, but I just took him outside where he is always happy. Here is how our weekend went:
Sat-
W:6am
E:6 BF, 6:30 Breakfast
A: 3 hrs
S:9-10:30 (fell asleep with gentle removal of BF after 10 min)
E:11:30 BF, 12:00 L
A: 3.5 hrs
S: 2-3:40 (fell asleep with gentle removal of BF after 10 min)
E: 4:15 BF, 5:15 D
A: 3 hr 50 min
S: 7:30 (fell asleep with gentle removal of BF after 15 min)
NW: 10:30 and 1:45 (I did BF both times for 15 min)

Sunday:
W: 5:00, BF for 20 min attempted to put back down but was wide awake
E:6:30 Breakfast
A: 3 hrs
S: 8-9:30 (fell asleep with gentle removal of BF after 10 min)
E: 10:15 BF, 11:30 Lunch
A: 4 hrs (little longer than i planned but lost track of time outside)
S: 1:20-1:45(fell asleep with gentle removal of BF after 15 min),  rocked back to sleep 1:55-3:15
E: 4:30 BF, 6:00 Dinner
A: 4 hrs
S: 7:15 (fell asleep with gentle removal of BF after 15 min)
NW: 11:30 BF 15 min, 1:00 no BF, 2:15 BF 15 min, 3:45 no BF
W: 5:45

-I didn't push the gentle removal much past where we were, I was trying to figure out his eating with the new schedule. He has never been able to go much past 3hr without BF.
-So we had one decent night and one bad night, but he did sleep well for his naps.
-What suggestions would you have? next weekend will be a 3 day weekend so we will have more days to work on it.

[Kellyjs]

Tbh this is looking much better hun, dyt? Or do you feel you're still pulling your hair out? 

I wouldn't push the E times much more either. Many LO's can't do more than 3hrs when BF, so you go with your gut.

I would keep to your plan with the NW's during the week. It's just unfortunate we can't hold this for another week with the daycare probs. oh well. Is there any way at all you could cap that last CN he has in the car or is the commute just too long?

Keep me updated as to how the week goes with daycare and I think we'll just try this exact same thing again next weekend. Wdyt? X

[adkillip]

It was nice to see him nap so long and get a good nap in.

During the week our commute is 45 min. some days he is out as soon as the car starts moving others he plays for a bit and might only take a 20-30 min catnap. Should I keep his BT at the later time of 8pm if he takes a CN no matter the length and 7:30 if he goes without a CN?

I'll keep you updated with the weeks schedule and go over my plan as the weekend approaches.

I will try to keep to only feeding him 2x a night. Hopefully he wont have too many bad nights, that is when I breakdown due to tiredness and go ahead a BF even though he shouldn't need to on the extra NW.

Thank you so much for the support and encouragement it is extremely helpful.

[Kellyjs]

I'd try and see if you can cap the CN to the 30mi s if at all possible. I know that's hard to do. Problem is the day is rather long with an 8pm BT but I'd like to try and see? It *might move wu slightly later or it might backfire and he'll wake earlier. I would just like to see if it makes a difference to the NW's. All trial and error eh? I'd only do this if he takes his full 2hrs at daycare though or else there's a very strong chance he'll get OT. If the nap is rubbish at dc, perhaps see if he'll do an earlier BT of 7pm?

Does that make sense? X

[adkillip]

That makes sense. Yesterday his schedule at Daycare was wonky, not sure if he was getting used to morning nap from this weekend?
W: 5:30 BF 10 min tried to get back to sleep, but couldn't spend a lot of time, I had to get ready for work
E: 8:30 bottle and Breakfast
S: 9:15-10:15 took a nap for them!
E: 11:30 bottle and Lunch
S: 1pm 20 min, stirred and resettled on own for another 20 min
E: 3:00 bottle
S: CN 5-5:35 in car
E: 6pm BF, 7pm Dinner
S: was wide awake so BT wasn't until 8pm, BF 15miin
NW: 9 no feed, 11:45 10 min BF, 1am no feed, 4am (15min)
W: 6am

-His NW was a different cry, they might have been due to gas pain or possibly teething. He went back to sleep fairly easy on his no feeds with a couple min of rocking and patting
- He pulled himself off during his BT and NW feeds and then cuddled for a couple min to sleep before I put him in crib (Progress?)

With his Daycare schedule suddenly changing, not sure what to do?

[Kellyjs]

Massive progress!! Woo hoo!

Excellent he took a nap for them! Problem looks like the second nap was an UT one  . Any chance they can make that one a bit later, or are the times set in stone?

It really does help us see what he's capable of. He definitely needs more A time before that second nap, but not sure if they can do that if he does nap for them in the morning. Closer to 2pm would be ideal???  Just like you did at home the other day... X

[adkillip]

That was my thought as well with afternoon nap, not sure if they are able to have him nap later. I thought I would see what he does today for them. If he am naps again, I'm going to suggest a longer A time in afternoon and see what they say.

[Kellyjs]

Excellent, I mean 2hrs 45mims A is far too short for an 8mo, they must know that eh? Hopefully they can be accommodating. Hope today goes well x

[adkillip]

Here were the last 3 days to get an idea how daycare is going:
W: 6am
E: 8- bottle, breakfast
S:9:15-9:30
E: 12- bottle and lunch
S: 1-2:15
E:3pm - bottle
S: 5-5:30
E: 6-BF, 7-dinner
S: 12 min BF, 8:30- relatives in town
NW: 11:15 (15m), 2:45 (8m)

W: 6am
E: 8:15- bottle and breakfast
S: 9-9:30
E: 12- bottle and lunch
S: 1-2:45
E: 3-bottle and snack
E: 5:30 BF, 7 dinner
S: 8:20, 10 BF- relatives in town
NW: 11:30 (10m), 2:45 (10m)

W:6am
E: 8:30- bottle and breakfast
S: 9-9:45
E: bottle and lunch
S: 1:30-3
E: 3- bottle
S: 4:50-5:20
E: BF 5:45 (10), 6:30 dinner
S: 10m BF, 7:55
NW: 11:30(10), 3((10m)
W:5:40, 15 m BF, still awake

[Kellyjs]

You know what hun? This isn't bad really.

It is showing the longer the CN in the morning is affecting his afternoon nap doesn't it? I think I'd ask them to keep the shorter nap as obviously they like him going down at that time, as it produces a nicer longer nap in the afternoon.

I,probably won't be around much tomorrow as it's DD's bday, but keep me posted ok? I'll be back Sunday x
 

[adkillip]

I hope DD had a great Birthday!! Our weekend schedule wasn't too bad other than Saturday night. He had a bad teething night and was inconsolable screaming for almost 3 hrs. But by morning he had 2 teeth break thru skin!
Friday-
W: 5:40
E: BF 10m, tried to resettle
E: 7am Breakfast
A: 3 hrs
S: 8:40-10:30
E: 10:35 BF 25m, 12:30 Lunch
A: 3 hrs 35 min
S: 12m BF, 2:05-2:38
E: 4:55 BF 12m
S: 5:10-5:47 CN
E: 7:00 Dinner
A:
S: 15m BF, 8:20
NW: 11:30 (10m), 2:10 (12m)

Sat-
EW: 5:25, 15m BF back to sleep
W: 7:05
E: 8:00 BF 10m, 8:30 Breakfast
A: 2 hrs 55 min
S: 10-11:15
E: 11:30 BF 10m, 12:30 Lunch
E: 2:20 BF 10m
A: 3 hrs 45 min
S: 3-3:50
E; 5:30 Dinner, 6:30 BF 10m
A: 4 hrs 10m
S: BF 15m, 8pm--woke up as soon as put in crib
-10:30 finally fell asleep
NW: 11:30, 12:30, 2, 3:15, 4:30 (dang Teeth!)

Sunday-
W: 6:20
E: 6:30 BF 15m, 8:15 Breakfast
A: 2 hrs 55 min
S: BF 15m, 9:15-10:40
E: 12 Lunch, 1:00 BF 10m
A: 3 hrs 10 min
S: 1:50-3:25
E: 4:00 BF 10m, 5:30 Dinner
A: 4 hrs 15 min
S: BF 15m, 7:40
NW: 11:40 (10m), 2:55 (15m)
W: 5:20, BF 10m wide awake

Correct me if I'm wrong but it appears that he does well on weekends with morning A time 3 hrs, afternoon 3.5, and evening 4hrs.
I've also noticed he tends to sleep at night for 10-11 hrs, even when I try to get him resettled in morning if we had an earlier BT. So BT of 8 would give us a wake time of 6-6:30 which I can deal with (Not 7, but oh well)

[Kellyjs]

We had a lovely time, thanks.

You're totally spot on, that does look good for him! Great the teeth are through too, it's always worse when they're just about to break through.

I might bring the A to BT back ever so slightly, so ideally be asleep by 4hrs A if at all possible. It's not unheard of for lO's to prefer a shorter first A, then increase throughout the day. Mine was the exact opposite! She would happily do 4hrs+ in the am! but that was awful for our night time.

I don't suppose there's anyway daycare would do this for you is there? I mean he has a 9am nap there anyway doesn't he? It would just mean moving the afternoon nap back closer to 2pm than 1pm? Then hopefully you'd have a chance of keeping him awake in the car on the way home.. Maybe a book or toy or sing songs then to keep him awake? I still do that now with DD when I don't want her to nap on the way home from a day out.. We sing songs like happy and you know it, so she has to interact! Or twinkle, twinkle if he knows it? X

P.s fwiw I tried everything to get DD on a 7am wu from birth actually, but nope, always a 6-6.30am max here too. It's just her body clock. I given up trying to fight it. We even had the latest night ever the other day, BT at 10.30pm.. And guess what? Wide awake at 6.32am  xx