2-1 nap transition.... Am nap refusal

[Kfro]

Hi,

Just a quick question. LO is refusing am nap/ messing about for an hour before going to sleep when normally he goes straight down. I understand that I should start pushing his am nap back by 10/15 minutes every few days BUT if LO still takes this long to go to sleep after pushing is there any point in holding the new a time for a few days? He will obviously be getting ot by taking this long to go down so should I just keep pushing forward?

Tia

[Kellyjs]

Sometimes just putting them down 15mims later helps as they don't keep messing about up there and miss the window for sleep yk? Saying that, we had quite radical jumps in the first A time from when DD was between 8-10mo. It actually nearly tripled! As long as I pushed the first A and not the last all was good, but some do prefer the other way round.

Be interested to see your easy and see if I can help tweak it for you. How old is he now? Xx

[Kfro]

Thank you for your reply .

He is almost nine months so is on the early side for starting the 2-1. Prior to the am nap problems his easy was as follows:

Wu 6
E 630 (milk) and then 8 (solids)
A 6-940
S 940-1110
E 1110 (milk) and then 1230 (solids)
E 230 (milk)
A 1110-250
S 250-405
E 410 (solids)
E 635 (milk)
A 405-655
Bt 655

I was working on reducing his second nap but he was struggling hence the short a to bed.
Since the am nap problems I have implemented the below easy (started today so this is the ideal scenario rather than actual):

Wu 6
A 6-950
S 950-1150
A 1150-340
S 340-425
Bt 7

He has never really done more than 11 hours at night so I aim to keep day at roughly 13 hours.

[Kellyjs]

Yep, it is rather early but not unheard of at all.

I would still expect that first A will be too short hun, if he is nearing the 2-1. Many need to be pushing over 4hrs A to be considered in 2-1 territory. So very close. Fwiw we did this around your lO's age..

Wu 6.30 (normally earlier but aimed to get out of bed around then)
A 4hrs
S 10.30-12 (capped but very rarely need to cap it, if ever)
A 3.5hrs
S 3.30-4.15
A 2.75hrs
BT 7

As you can see I went with the slightly shorter day, but DD tended to take a long time to fall asleep at BT (and still does). She's always preferred a shorter A to BT too like yours. Around now it did take 20mims or so. We held this for around 3 weeks I think, then the shorter am nap came back, as with playing around at nap time so pushed straight to 4.5hrs and we held that for a month or two until we started getting pm nap refusals.

Wdyt? Fancy holding your ideal easy for a couple of days and letting me know what happens? What you're working towards looks great, but there might need to be a little movement in that first nap perhaps soon? Xx

[Kfro]

Thank you for taking a look. I agree that the first a is short for the transition, I was just worried about pushing too quickly. Every time I try to reduce his tds to less than 2.45 he seems to really struggle. He did well on the new easy today and I had to wake him from both naps so we will see what the night brings. He has just started crawling and pulling up and is completely obsessed so we did have some bt shenanigans but he was asleep within 15 minutes. Ideally I would like to bring his second nap forward slightly as I know it would help with ot if he was going down for that one ut but he fights it if he hasn't had a full a time! A fair amount of apop may be needed to get through this transition I reckon!

[Kellyjs]

Apop is key for transitions! Keep me posted as to how it goes ok? There will be lots of ups and downs, here to help you through xx

[Kfro]

He did pretty well overnight. He woke at 445 but put himself back to sleep after wriggling about for a couple of minutes but then woke for the day at 535. All In all 10.5 hour night so pretty standard for him but He woke crying so I guess there is some ot there. I plan on trying to shorten the a to bed a little tonight so we will see what difference that makes.

I appreciate the handholding.... It always helps to know someone will talk it through x

[Kfro]

Oh dear.... He has discovered that he can stand up in his cot.... This can't be good!

[Kellyjs]

Oh damn, I remember that time being really cr@p for sleep, sorry hun. Try and teach him how to get down on his own is key so he doesn't get stuck and start crying for you. All very well playing this game, but when you have to go in and put him back down, that's when OS and OT sets in. They get bored when they're doing it themselves.

I would much rather the first A be the longest as there's a chance of actually resettling an OT nap yk? I'm mor scared of UT in that respect. Too long of an A before BT here was much worse.

Hope the shorter A to BT works hun, fingers crossed for you here xx

Eta have you popped by this thread hun? I've just directed two other ladies to here who I think you'll get on with.. You're all in the same boat! Anyone want to talk about the 2-1 transition #27

[Kfro]

He seems to be dealing ok with it fingers crossed.... Stands up once and then sits himself back down without help so that's good. We are getting a weird cry out at 430 am though. He isn't stood up so it's not that.... Unless of course he stands up and then cries when he falls down maybe. 430 is 9.5 hours after he goes to sleep so seems a weird time to be ot? I can ssh him over the monitor and he goes back to sleep for just over an hour and then is up for the day at 6. Not sure if it's a discomfort thing, a regression thing to just ride out or that a routine tweak is needed?

[Kellyjs]

If he is going back to sleep, I would just ride it out and check for teeth. It's when they refuse to go back to sleep that's an issue.

I would also check the room is dark enough as in some areas it's starts to get light around then xx

[Kfro]

Fab.... That was my gut instinct too. Wasn't really sure what to do if it was ot.... He won't go down for a nap undertired and his a times are too long to allow two long naps. I think his top teeth are on the move so it could be that xx

[Kellyjs]

Could well be, teeth tend to cause havoc before we see them. We rack our brains wondering what on earth is going on then poof, we spot a tooth or two a couple of days later  xx

[Kfro]

Ugh things have got a bit ugly again here. The past few nights have been tiring... He has woken up maybe three or four times each night from about 2am onwards. He doesn't cry and seems generally happy but gets tired quickly during the day due to broken sleep. I don't have to go in or anything but I am awake from 2ish onwards checking that he goes back to sleep. I increased his first a time to four hours yesterday to see if that helped but night was pretty similar. I have also cut his second nap back to half an hour to no avail. Could this just be him mastering something that I need to ride out? Is the cn starting to interfere with night sleep?

[Kellyjs]

It could well be both hun. I'd hold that 4hrs first A with the capped CN and see if he settles into it. We don't want to change too much if it's developmental as that could make matters worse for you. However waking at 2am onwards could be a sign of UT. How long is that first nap now? Xx