9,5 months old early wakings need some help please

[Libelula]

Hi,
My 9 and a half months old daughter is an independent sleeper again( there is a bit if sa but she is ok now) goes down for her first nap well but the second takes her ages to settle, she would be playing in her cot or sitting down and doing a little bit of mantra, can take up to 30 mins to fall asleep. Her daytime sleep is about 2 hours and 15 mins which I thought would be right for her age but she starts waking up around 05:30 for the day... Here is our normal routine when she doesnt wake up earlty:

06:30 wake and bf
07:30 solids
10:30 S 1,5h
12:00 wake and bf
13:00 solids
15:30-16:00 S 45 mins
16:15-16:45 wake and bf
17:30 solids
19:00 or 19:30 bt

The first A time would be around 4 hours, the second 3/3.30 and the last 2.45 as she only naps for 45 mins.
Yesterday the second nap didnt happen, she was trying to fall asleep but couldnt ( decided to try after 4 hours of A time as she is not ready to sleep after 3 h)so eventually did cat nap in a carrier and went to bed 2 hours later with no problem. Could that be beginning if 2:1 transision? Just want to add my daughter is very alert, crawls for last 3 nonths and starts crusising now.
I ll  apreciate any comments!
Thank u😀

[Kellyjs]

Oh yes this does sound like the 2-1 hun. Tbh you've been on it for a while with that routine and the capped second nap. Brilliant routine btw, I had that one too 

2 options hun, you could continue to try and apop a CN if that makes life easier for you? It is hard work I know. But if the A time is later at around 3hrs 45mins the nap will have to be cut shorter anyway to achieve a decent BT like you did today. Or you try for a 45mins CN after 4hrs A and accept a later BT?

She is on the early side to jump straight to one nap, however some like mine were mostly on one nap by 10-10.5mo, others can't cope with it until much later. So, with this in mind I think we should try and keep the CN for as long as you can. Even an extra 2 weeks might help.

I'll post a link in a minute, let me know what you think xx

From 2 to 1 nap transition (10-12m and older)

[Libelula]

Thank u so much Kellyjs for your answer!
Last night was great, she woke up for the day at 06:30 after having only 1,5 of daytime sleep😀 the morning nap was a weird one, she woke up after half hour( overtired?) but managed to resettle for another half hour. She would normally sleep great for the first nap so dont know why suddenly she was overtired... Went to sleep as always at 10.30 after 4 hours awake time. Today same story, woke up after 40 mins but couldnt resettle any more... Cried for 20 mins, i stayed with her and kept my hand in the cot but didnt help. What could that be?😳
She is just into her wonder week now...

[Kellyjs]

Could well be ww related hun. I'd also suspect a need for the A times to be bumped too as that usually coincides with a ww

How about you increase the first A by 15mins and see if that helps. The ideas with the 2-1 is to preserve your one good nap at all costs, so I think that might work. Then you could shave off 15mins off the CN and then hopefully your day should keep to the same length for now. Wdyt? Xx

[Kellyjs]

Hi, just checking in to see how things are going now? Do pop back if you need to hun xx

[Libelula]

Thanks again for your concern!
So we are pushing the first A time , she went to sleep yesterday at 10:50, asleep in 5 without any fuss at all. Slept 1,45 min. Tried for a cat nap after 4 hours in a carrier, she didnt go down... Dont have a car so cant take her for a ride...here in ireland is already winter and dark at 5 so having a walk with her at this time its gonna become difficult. Last night fell asleep at 19:00 , took her 20 mins of mantra, woke up at 4am , fed her and slept till 7am. Dont know if woke up due to the hunger, ww or overtiredness...Today put her down for a nap a bit to late i guess cause she took 30mins to fall asleep( placed her in cot at 11:00), woke up after an hour, fed her and put back in cot awake and slept for another hour. So quite a good nap I believe. There was no time for a cat nap so bed at 7pm today. She was a very happy girl today, no sign of being tired but thats always difficult to notice with her.
We will see how the night goes.
Do u think i should do my best for her to cn in the late afternoon?
Thank u😀

[Kellyjs]

It is such a tricky time where you're at atm hun.

Sounds like you're doing brilliantly though. What time is she waking up atm?

I would re check the feeding times atm too as you don't want her waking from hunger from her nap. It's a difficult time as it is early to go to one nap and you have to fit in the feeds too. Doing a top up bottle 15-20mims before the nap was what I did. It did mean it was earlier than the usual but at lest then I could rule out hunger for her waking early from the nap.

Until the nap gets closer to midday ish, I would always offer a CN. Even just 15-20mims down time in bed (even if she doesn't sleep), really helped get through to a decent BT for us. This is where it's tricky. 1hr45mins nap is a decent length so you don't want to put down for BT too early as she will naturally wake early after having enough sleep. However, not putting down early enough can lead to OT NW's in the early part of the night or difficulty settling like you experienced the other day. So it's a case of finding the right time for the nap to be. This took me around a month or two to get right.

If she does take a short nap like an hour, I would again offer the CN. If that's a bust I would actually try for a BT earlier than 7pm if you can hun. You need to give her the opportunity to catch up on missed sleep. I would've gone with the aim to have asleep at 6.30pm latest on those days. Perhaps even earlier depending on the wu atm.

Look forward to hearing from you, sounds like you're close to one nap and we'll get there soon xx

[Libelula]

Last night was a bit of a nightmare she went down at 19:10 after 30 mins of mantra and sitting down in her cot. I could hear her couple of times in the early hours of bedtime which I understand is overtiredness... Then she woke up at 01:15 which she never does crying hard, tried to settle her in cot but no luck so fed her and put back down drowsy. Then slept till 05:30...DP went to her but she didnt go back to sleep. Not even after feeding... So I played for her In the night garden in bed so I could snooze for few more minutes... If she was overtired why did she not go down after feed?
I put her for her nap at 10:35 and she was asleep after 5 mins, no crying. Then woke up after 45 min( hungry or undertired? ) and then slept for another 35mins ( that was 12pm)but she was in very light sleep.
So im gonna go for a cat nap in cot at 3pm and i ll see how i get on... If she wont go for it I should probably do the bedtime at 6pm?
Thanks for your help!😃

[Kellyjs]

Sometimes we just have to wing it on those off days. It sucks I know.

I'm presuming OT, that can contribute to EW. Yep I'd try for a CN at 3 today, perhaps even 3.30pm might be better?

Later on down the transition when DD wouldn't take an afternoon nap at all (which seems to be where you are), and we got EW, I'd apop a car nap at 9am ish for 15mins and that used to see her to her then nap time of 12pm. It also helped get back to a reasonable BT. I think we had to do this about once or twice every 10days or so if I remember rightly? It took me a while to realise dD didn't like the long A to BT, so until I could stretch that first A well past midday (for us it was 12.30pm) we had the odd EW and always OT NW's in the early part of the night. I'm afraid it's just part of the transition until we get it in the right space for her.

Do you think the apop'd early CN like I did could be doable here and there with your family life? I know you don't have a car but is there any other way she responds to apop? Or just try for a super short nap in her bed? With it being so short and not very often it shouldn't encourage any EW from that xx

[Libelula]

I could maybe nurse her in dark and see if she falls asleep? Could take her for a walk in a carrier also but not sure if she goes down as never really sleeps at this time. I ll try tomorrow and will keep u updated!😀

[Libelula]

So I've tried for a nap at 3.20pm and she screamed for 20 mins so nursed her to sleep. Woke her up after 45 min and will aim for bedtime after 2 hours 45 mins. We ll se how the night goes😉

[Kellyjs]

Honestly a bit of apop here and there won't hurt a bit as long as you're not doing it for every nap and BT. Sometimes we have to do what we can do! At least you've got that in the bag, much better than cold, winter buggy rides I say 

I'm hoping with that little bit of extra sleep, albeit broken will help her tonight and get a decent wu. Everything crossed for you here. Let me know xx

[Libelula]

So the other night she slept till 7am but woke up at 4am and seemed hungry. Last night woke up at 00:30 and wanted a feed. I wonder if this is growth spurt, ww or the naps transition. She was sttn already so really wanna get this back...
Yesterday slept only 1,5 the whole day and no wakings in the first 3 hours of the night, does it mean she wasnt overtired? Slept 45 min in the morning( must have put her down too early) and another 45min in the carrier in the afternoon. Then in bed after 2,5 hours went down with no fuss at all... But woke up at 00:30 - fed her and at 6am for the day. Im trying to give her an extra bottle during the day but not intersted, certainly eats more solids than before though...
Today put her down at 11am and slept for 1,40 h, will try this for another two days and then will be adding another 15 mins and so on.
Thanks again for your help!😀

[Kellyjs]

11am could definitely be the way to go for the next few days hun. If she keeps kicking up a fuss about the CN, I'd look at moving the first nap again after 3 days or so by another 15mins as you said. Will make the CN harder in the long run, but if you could apop a capped 15mins nap, that'll get her through to BT.

Are you offering milk before solids? You did say she's eating more solids but we want to make sure that's not impacting her milk intake. Milk is much more calorie dense than any solids and will sustain her longer.

I think the problem may have been with last night that two UT naps play havoc with the NT sleep sometimes especially in the latter part of the night. We had this too. It does show that 2hrs 45mins to BT is working well as she's not OT by BT and not NW in the early part of the night. It may also be silly ww stuff mixed in there 

You're in the trickiest part of the transition. Where the nap gets late enough to kind of do a one nap day, but then she prefers a shorter A to BT so she needs a CN still. We just have to keep plodding on. If the CN doesn't happen, do a EBT, but prepare for OT NW's. Then if she wakes early the next day, hopefully you can do two naps as she'll be more tired. As I said, yucky and inconsistent part of the transition. We just have to wing it and do the best we can. Keep me posted xx

[Libelula]

Hi again!
I always offer milk before solids but I think I was making her dinner to close to the bedtime so she wasnt hungry enough to have her milk. The last three days she ate her dinner a bit earlier and had her milk about 1,5- 2 hours later and didnt wake up at night for a feed. So thats an improvement.
But we have some bedtime issues here...Twice this week she screamed for 20 minutes before I picked her up and actually fed to sleep. There was nothing I could do to calm her down. Have just noticed that both times she went to bed exactly after 1hour 45 mins of an A time when the catnap was only 27 minutes( same both evenings) . Now Im wondering if she was undertired or overtired? I know she loves short last A time....but maybe thats too short?😖 Yesterday her catnap was almost 50mins and put her down after 2,5h and she fell asleep after 10 mins , no fuss at all... Or maybe thats just a WW is messing a bit?😩
Thank u for all your help! 😀

[Kellyjs]

It could well be that last A was a bit too short hun. Mine used to do a 45mins nap and do BT 2.5 hrs later. Even after a 30mins CN I'm thinking at least 2hrs A might suffice wdyt? It really is a guessing game as to what works, but if she did the same thing both times I think we can adjust it a bit for her.

Is there room in your day to have a 45mins CN then 2.5hrs to BT?

Wrt solids, it does get really tricky fitting it all in. I moved dinner to 4pm for a while after advice from here as DD wasn't taking much of her BT bottle xx

[Libelula]

I d love her to do 45 min cat nap and there is time for it but I only try now in a carrier( taking her for a walk) and she only sleeps 30 mins in it. On very rare ocasion she would sleep longer( the other day she slept for almost 50). Dont know why but she almost always wakes up after half an hour. I stopped trying for a cat nap in her cot as there is no chance for it, she just wont go down.
I am at work tonight so I tell my DP to put her down a bit later if she only nap for 30min.
It is quite tricky to fit all the meals in. I would normally go for a walk with her around 4:15 pm so her dinner is at 5-5:30, then bottle just before bed. There isnt a big gap between but dont know how to do it differently...
She certainly still needs her second nap, even 20-30 mins makes a big difference so i ll push for it as long as I can.
Thank u😀