EW in recently night weaned 11mo

[roimata9]

Hi everyone,
I've recently night weaned my 11mo. He was previously getting a dream feed and then waking at 1 and 4 for feeds on average. He's now mostly sleeping through, but is waking around 4:30-5:30 and I can't get him back to sleep.
By 5, he would have had 10 hours without a feed, so I'm guessing he won't go back to sleep because he's hungry. I've been trying to resettle for half an hour, and when that doesn't work I turn on the lights and feed him and we get up for the day. I don't want to feed him and put him straight back to sleep because I'm trying to avoid the feeding at night association, but I also don't think it's fair to let him cry because he's hungry.
It's only been a week and a half, will he naturally extend his waking as he gets used to not feeding at night, or am I creating an early waking habit for him? He will happily rest his head on my shoulder and seems to go back to sleep when I hold him at that time, but as soon as I put him down he cries and stands back up.
What's my best approach here? I'm actually feeling a lot better as I'm going to bed about 9 so am getting a solid 7 hours sleep most nights, but I'd much rather start the day at 7!

[Kellyjs]

I would doubt he's hungry at this age especially if he's still having milk feeds during the day and at BT .I think it actually might be routine related. Would you mind posting what your day looks like and we'll see if we can tweak something for you? EW really is yucky and this is a prime age for it  xx

[roimata9]

You don't think he'd be hungry after 10 hours without milk? It seems like a long time to me.
Our routine is all up the top with the early wakings, but here's some examples
WU 5am
Nap 1: 9-11
Nap 2: 3-4
BT 7:30

The night before last he woke at 3am because of teething (I think) I gave him nurofen which meant he needed to be fed. He went back to sleep at 4am and slept til 7
His routine that day went like this:
WU: 7:00
Nap 1: 9:30-10:30
Nap 2: 2-4 (I woke him after 2 hours)
BT: 7:30

[Kellyjs]

I think that first nap is too long and too early in the morning perpetuating the EW. Many 11mo are on 4hrs + A time around now. One option is to leave the nap where it is and perhaps cap at 30mims so so, then hope for a longer nap later. Or we look at gradually moving the nap later. All part of the 2-1 process, I'll post a link for you to have a read through.

Otherwise the second day looks good, if we can keep that wu. I would move the nap 30mims later and cap at 30mims so wu is at the same time, or else I would go for the gradual approach where we chop the nap to 45mins in this instance.

No I don't think he'll be hungry if he's eating solids well and still has milk feeds. In a month he'll no longer be reliant on milk as his main source of nutrition. Many mummas will feed at this early a wu though just to get them back off to sleep quicker, especially as they try and start extending A times, it helps having a nicer wu! If you've just recently dropped the nf though it may take him a little while to realise he needs to eat more during the day to compensate, but I'd expect that to settle within a week or so.

Nurofen is great for teething so I'd keep with that, it doesn't necessarily need to be given with a feed though so that's up to you? Xx

[roimata9]

Thanks for your reply, I never knew that about nurofen,  I thought it had to be taken with food!
He's not really eating much still, he's been pretty show to start solids, not like my eldest! So I at think he could be hungry, and I'd be very surprised if milk ceases to be his main source of nutrition at one.
I need to keep his first nap long because we are out just afternoons so he wouldn't get a long afternoon nap in his cot. He's always had a short first A time, he just falls asleep on me if I try to keep him up.
I think we're in an under / over tired loop now as today and yesterday he's had three naps, but none particularly long. Today he woke at 4.45, I got him up at 5.15, then he napped at 8.30-9.40, 12.40-1.40 and 4-4.30 all three he fell asleep in the car!

[Kellyjs]

You know best, you're there with him. If that's the case I really wouldn't worry about feeding at the 5am wu, it's not like you're doing it all night now. Any other NW's you resettle using your usual way and have that time that you're prepared to feed.

Argh that is a sucky wu. We can definitely keep the first nap the long one, I preferred it that way too. However, in order to do that we'll have to push that first nap out pretty hard and fast. I'd recommend adding 20mins on, holding for 2 days then going again. EW like that is their way of naturally extending their A times. After a short night, we can see he can comfortably go nearly 4hrs and that still gave you a shortish nap! It's a really yucky time this, the EW and their really tried and wanting to go back to sleep, but pushing the A time will help him sleep in in the morning in time ok? Xx

[roimata9]

Yesterday was better nap wise I think, he woke at 5.10, slept 8.50-10.40 then 4-4.45.
Still woke at 5.10 again this morning though!

[Kellyjs]

What time was BT? Dyt it was a little late and there was some OT at BT? If BT was at your usual 7.30pm, it could well be a shorter A to BT might work in the interim? So BT at 7? Would that work with family life?

Great first nap though! If we can sort out this EW, we'd be onto a winner with this routine!! If we can get a decent stretch overnight even if that means bringing BT earlier, we can find the right A to BT that works then looks at moving the whole day out for a later BT and wu in time?? Xx

[roimata9]

Yep it was at 7:30 and I think he was OT as DH said it took him longer to get to sleep (wasn't asleep till 7:50) and he woke after 30 minutes and needed DH to resettle him, then woke again after another 30 mins but self settled.
7pm bed time would usually work well though, so I'll give that a go tomorrow, thanks! He woke at 5:15 today and napped 9-11:15 so hopefully it will be similar today.
Thanks for all your advice!

[Kellyjs]

My pleasure. It does take some trial and error but I always found it helps to narrate the days a little for my own peace of mind and to try and spot a pattern. That definitely does sound like OT before BT, but at least we know now eh? And it's really good to know that nearly 4hrs A works well first thing to get a good nap in! Onwards and upwards... Xx

[Kellyjs]

How's it going? Was just thinking of you this morning xx