Lost my way with 6 mo old EASY

[JennVanessa1083]

Update: DS does not want to nap!!! He was still wide awake after 3:20 A. He was rolling, talking to himself, and trying to move all over the crib. I aimed for a 3 hr A but he's been in that crib since 2.75A. He wasn't crying just doing what I mentioned.  I just say there then when he dissed a bit I patted him easily to sleep. He had all the tired signs at 2.5 but I figure let me stretch it since I can't rely on cues. Could it be OT? He did a 2 hour am nap (resettled at 32 minutes) so could he be UT?

This is frustrating. I just want my baby who would just roll over and sleep when it was time  I feel like I can't read my baby.

[creations]

Oh dear. I know it's frustrating but I think we've all had times when we've felt we can't read out baby any more. I know I have.

I would aim for 3hr 15 and not begin the wind down too early.
He likely has a lot of developmental stuff going on too.  They never help us by just doing one thing at a time these LOs!

[JennVanessa1083]

Lol you are so right! It's always 20 things going on.

I can aim for 3:15 A for both as he pushed his own second A again.

Im assuming I am aiming for

WU
A 3.25
S
A 3.25
S
A 2.5-2.75?
S

He learned to sit up on his own from crawling position when he was supposed to be sleeping smh so he ended up hitting his head on the crib. I had to help him go to sleep since he was headed towards a 3.5 A. 

So is a half hour wind down too much then? I used to do 20 minutes but thought maybe he needed more but I could be wrong since he's so active fighting his sleep in the crib.

Also at what point do I start capping naps? I'm noticing the last two days that my am nap (once resettled) has gone over 1.5 which is great but I have had to cap the pm at an hour because bedtime would have been really late.

[creations]

How are things now?

[JennVanessa1083]

Hi creations!

Well the no more long NW! Still at 3-4 however teeth are still growing in so could be that. I would say they are about 1/3 out. Slowly growing 

Naps are a different story. I know he can transition because he used to do it all the time but he wakes up between 35-39 minutes into the nap fussy. This is what has happened:

NW 9:46, 12:17, 3:56, 7:20

Total ~10.25

WU 8:32 am
E 8:35 am
A
E 10 am (solids and BM)
A
S 11:45- 1:11 pm (A 3:13; self settle; about 7-10 minutes; woke up at 26 minutes;unclear if UT or OT bc dozed off a bit between 8:30-9 am )
E 1:34 pm
A
E 3:15 pm
A
S 4:16- 5:41 pm(A 3:05; self settle; woke up at 38 fussy)
E 5:50 pm
A
E 8:32 pm
S 8:41 pm (A 3 hrs; nursed)

Today:

NW 11:02, 3:17, 6, 7:10 am

Total ~11.5

WU 8:55 am
E
A
E 11 am
A
S 12:07-1:27 pm (A 3:12; self settle; woke up at 38 crying)
E 1:35
A
E 3 pm (solids)
A
S 4:32- 5:40 (A 3:02 (shortened since last nap was about 1:20; extra fussy shh patted; woke up at 35 fussy; woke him up to preserve a decent BT

Some nights he has gotten 10 hrs and some nights around 11. Do A times change because of the different hours of total night sleep?

I'm still giving him some homeopathic stuff before naps but I'm not even sure if its that or A times need tweaking.

So overall some successes and some room for improvement 

[creations]

Have you tried some paracetamol before a nap?  I would be tempted to try it once or twice to see if it helps with the interrupted sleep, whilst it might be routine related it can also be pain which brings them fully awake rather than transitioning between cycles.

[JennVanessa1083]

I can see if that may help

I as wondering if I should cap any naps to preserve bedtime?

Also is it typical for a 7month old to still wake up 3 timeshare I might to feed?

[creations]

If you're BF it isn't at all uncommon to have 2 feeds per night, I think you have a thread on the BF board for this, where you will get better advice than from me as I was unable to BF so my experience is extremely lacking.

If BT is getting late it's ok to reduce the last nap, perhaps just get him up when he wakes rather than trying to resettle, in that case I might reduce his A time slightly before the nap (if he will accept) and have a shorter A to bed, although I think you're aiming for a shorter A to bed anyway.  I wouldn't have thought naps needed capping just yet but possibly.  Just as guidance, a LO with a full 3hr A time and a 1.5 hr nap can still get through a day on 2 full naps and have a 12hr night (see example below), a LO might need a longer nap (2hr) or shorter A time in places, or have a shorter night.  I would be cautious to cap a nap unless you really need to otherwise you can end up with a very long A time to bed or trying to get longer than 12hrs over night.

WU 7
A 3
S 10 - 11.30
A 3
S 2.30-4
A 3
BT 7

[JennVanessa1083]

That is helpful. I ended up capping the last night two nights in a row and shortening the last A to get a reasonable BT. Surprisingly, I barely resettled and he slept pretty well both nights.

I do have a great update though 

Yesterday, he actually took a nice 1.5 restorative nap after 2:50A. I thought it was a longshot especially since he slept 11.5 hours. However, I aimed for 3 hrs A and he put himself to sleep within 2 minutes and did n't need any resettling!!!!! The next nap was slightly UT which he put himself to sleep for within minutes at 2:55 A (I'm thinking he needed a touch of a longer A?). Last night he went to bed OT due to me putting him down too early then him becoming OT playing around in his crib (lesson learned). However, I only needed to resettle once then he slept for the rest of the night with 2 brief NW to feed! Much better than he has had in weeks!

Here is my routine from yesterday:

NW 10:08-11:06 (showered and DH took over), 1:59, 5:09 am 
Total: ~11.25 hrs 
WU: 8:42 (woke him up)
E 8:50 am
A
E 10:56 am
A
S 11:32- 12:59 pm (A 2:50; self settle; took 3-4 minutes)
E 1:05 pm
A
E 2:55 pm
A
S 3:53-5:21 pm (A 2:54; self settle; took 8-9 minutes. May have been too early to put him down (2.75A); woke up at 40. Might be slightly UT)
E 5:27 pm
A
E 7:50
S 8:42 pm (A 3:19; put him down 2:36 aiming for 2.75A and wasn't tired enough ended up OT. Tried shh pat for a half hour and was hysterical. Should have put him down closer to 2.75 or 2:50 to aim for about 3 hours A. Ended up rocking him)

NW 9:23 pm, 12am, 4:15 am

Not too shabby 

He woke up around 7 am this morning which gave hi 10 hours of sleep not including NW so I'm hoping today will go somewhat smoothly. I am happy because we can finally go back to an earlier routine 

So I guess I am wondering if it is possible that I misread him needing a 3:15A thinking he was UT but in actuality he was OT the entire time. I guess I will see what happens for the next few days with a routine that you posted.

WU 7
A 3
S 10 - 11.30
A 3
S 2.30-4
A 3
BT 7

[creations]

So I guess I am wondering if it is possible that I misread him needing a 3:15A thinking he was UT but in actuality he was OT the entire time.

I don't think so, it's just been really hard to know with him insisting on growing teeth and developing
You did try under 3hr and on 3hr for a good enough time really. Some times LOs also go back to a previous routine more readily after refusing or being reluctant for a while. Mine has done that several times in the past, almost like he was trying himself out on nap refusal, working out he actually did still need a nap and being very agreeable to it again.

It's good to hear good news
FX you have another good night and day x

[JennVanessa1083]

Ok you might be right since I got two broken naps lol My DS sure knows how to keep me upright!

So do I just jump back to 3.25 A for the first two then 2.75-3hr A until bed tomorrow? What would a sample look like?

WU 7 am
A 3.25
S 10:15-11:45 am
A 3.25
S 3-4:30 pm
A 2.75-3 hrs
S 7:15-7:30 pm

Would this be ok? Or do I cap a nap to make it a 12 hour day? 

[creations]

Would this be ok? Or do I cap a nap to make it a 12 hour day? 

Could be either really, it really does depend on what your LO likes, there is not set rule. Some LOs are better with the proper nap and a slightly shorter night, some are better with a capped nap and full night.

[JennVanessa1083]

Hmmmmm I guess it will be trial and error. I did learn that if my DS passes 3 hours of day sleep, he has frequent and long NW.

[JennVanessa1083]

Hi!

So I wanted give you an update on today's routine. Yesterday was a mess as he was out all day and had a horrible OT meltdown at bedtime.

Anyways today I went back to 3.25 A since he slept for 11.5 hours last night. So the first nap he went down in about 5/7 minutes (self settled yay!!) and woke up at the 55 minute mark (he never does this) I resettled and he slept for two hours where I had to wake him. Second A he did not settle at all until 3.5A. I put him down at 3:05 since it usually takes him at most 10minutes to settle. If I put him down before that he just plays until he gets fussy or he puts himself to sleep only to Give me a short nap. Today, he played for more than 20 minutes and started getting fussy so I had to do shh pat. He was crying (probably because I had to holds him down because he kept rolling over and crawling while giggling and chatting it up. So now this nap is very late as he woke up late already ugh...I will have to wake him up to at least get him in bed at a somewhat decent hour (9pm smh). I plan to get him bak up to his normal wakeup time tomorrow.

He is about 7.5 months so I'm wondering if he's trying to extend his A? Or it may be residual OT from yesterday? (Yesterday he only got 11.5 hours total whereas he usually averages around 14 give or take 1/2hr)

Should I hold for 3.25 for another day or so and see?

Update: DS woke up from second nap after 30 minutes so I got him up and carried on. I tried putting him in the crib at 2:15 A and struggled with him for a half hour then he fell asleep then 5 minutes late screaming from what I imagine OT. I had to rock him. It is now 10 pm and he's finally asleep. Should I have cut his A shorter? I aimed for 2.5 since he normally has 2.5 A to BT after an hour nap. Maybe I should have aimed for 2 hours? I'm wondering in case he short naps again for the second nap.

[creations]

Sorry honey, I'm not sure - you said he had 11 hr 30 min over night so you gave a full A of 3hr 15 min but then you said that he had 11hr 30 min total sleep the day before so might have been carrying over some OT.  Did he not nap at all the day before?  It's very hard to suggest anything when I'm not sure of what happened previously.

He might have been a bit UT for the second nap which is why he played around for too long and made himself too tired.  So perhaps put down a touch later if he's had a very good 2hr nap.

I think if you are wanting an earlier routine it would be wise to wake him at a set time each morning.