Author Topic: I need some help figuring out DS2, please  (Read 5353 times)

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Offline michaeljacknnugg

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #30 on: January 13, 2016, 07:19:47 am »
Maybe, once I get an evening back. At present he is cluster feeding most of the evening and then snuggled in bed with me overnight (which is lovely, but I dread to think where it may get me! And what Tracy would have said).

The last couple of mornings I've been able to prop him on his side with some pillows and potter about getting dressed while he's asleep. That's a start, and a help.
My 'little man' - kind-hearted Spirited whirlwind, 2008
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Offline 4isstillnighttime

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #31 on: January 13, 2016, 20:50:18 pm »
My little brother slept in my parents ' bed til he was about 3 (there are lots of us, and I think it was the only time he got any undivided cuddles!!). He doesnt any more!!. If cosleeping is right for you guys now, then embrace it!! nothing is forever and if it stops working out for you you can change it.

Offline *Liz*

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #32 on: January 13, 2016, 22:16:08 pm »
As a bottle fed babe, Thomas didn't cluster feed (he just puked if I tried  ::)), but he spent many many nights asleep in my arms, or next to me. I think I've said before - but I never really had any issue easing him into being more independent.

Offline michaeljacknnugg

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #33 on: January 15, 2016, 20:42:23 pm »
How did you do it, Liz?

A couple more things have jumped out at me today:
- If you take the time to help him, he does eventually go down into a deeper level of sleep and doesn't need you there. It took me just over an hour of sitting with him, letting him suck my finger and patting him to be able to walk away. A long job! But then he slept for another twenty or so minutes on his own.

- My private midwife came yesterday to discharge me and we had a good long chat about sleep. He was getting tired so we tried a few things. Conclusion is that I'm not rushing in at all, but that he just really wants to be with someone and is making that clear.

- ...which leads me on to the awfulness that is car journeys right now. Fussing nearly as soon as we start, leading up to full on screaming whether we're moving or not. I've tried him at all different stages, fed changed slept etc, I've taken the insert out of the seat...nothing. It's breaking my heart. So today I put the radio on between stations and turned up the white noise for him and he stopped! I'd tried it previously and thought it made no difference, but the stuff on our baby monitor has gaps and it should likely be continuous. White noise app downloaded for home, for a trial.

Hope it's ok to keep writing this stuff down, if anything leaps out at you please let me know!
My 'little man' - kind-hearted Spirited whirlwind, 2008
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Offline 4isstillnighttime

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #34 on: January 15, 2016, 20:52:10 pm »
Sprout hates the car. It's pretty much the only time he cries, which makes it particularly awful. He is much better if the twins are there and he can see them so maybe he is lonely? Have you tried one of those mirrors that are meant to let you see him? Could you angle it so he can see himself?

I don't know if babies as small as yours have those feelings, but if he is a bit of a cuddle monster maybe that would be the next best thing? Give him an extra snuggle from me, I love a baby cuddle!!

Offline michaeljacknnugg

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #35 on: January 16, 2016, 07:31:15 am »
I did wonder that but on thurs he screamed the place down even with DS1 desperately trying to entertain him/keep him happy. And he loves his big bro.

He's sending you a snuggle!
My 'little man' - kind-hearted Spirited whirlwind, 2008
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Offline *Liz*

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #36 on: January 16, 2016, 22:11:28 pm »
Yk, life is such chaos with 3 kids that I can hardly remember   ::).

Thomas was a super sleepy NB - until about 8 weeks I think - but he was prem and poorly so I guess that is why. Once he started waking up the usual chaos started. Only asleep in arms and short naps etc.

What did I do? Path of least resistance  ;). Walk and rock him to sleep, then put him down (he side slept in a sleepyhead with white noise on - but AP'd to sleep first). Once a day I would either wear him, or sit and hold him for the whole nap. I always put him down for a short nap in the am as I needed to get the big kids ready for school, and by the afternoon he would take a long nap in arms. AT night I would get him to sleep in arms, and then he would end up in bed with me as the night wore on.

He did the usual really. At about 4/5 months the AP got harder. He would only short nap in the sling or arms by then, but the cot naps started to lengthen. Still put down asleep. He started to self soothe running his face into his muslin cloth, so if sleepy enough, he would nod off.

By 8 months he was sleeping in his own room out of the sleepyhead, I think I still bottle fed him to sleep at night at that point, but naps would have been independent. Routine is always the same - look tired - put in sleeping bag and throw in bed with a muslin cloth in his hands - put white noise on and leave  :). And honestly this boy was in arms as a babe. He was def as independent as that by 8 months as that is when I went back to work and he was easy by then as Mum and Dad have him, and one of the 'deals' was that he has nice cot naps by then  ;).

I think if you AP to establish the pattern it makes it much easier to sort it slowly, as their body clock is already set for sleep.

It is a very similar pattern to Jacob as well. He was independent from 6 months, but walked to sleep until then.

Megan hated the car. Screamed until she was purple every time. Even as a toddler she was fussy, and now as a kid never.stops.talking. Even at age 5.5 she still never sleeps. I guess the car is just not that relaxing for some kids.

I use an app on my phone for white noise. My Mum has a continuous CD. Thomas owns the iPad overnight as well. I used to use wit at night wakings when he slept with me if he was struggling to settle as well, and I would nod off as well.

I never had the patience to pat until a deep sleep etc. I would rather just hold them. I honestly believe that they just need us when they are young, and the rest can come later.

Thomas is still perfectly capable of screaming in the car, even with Jacob trying to look after him.

Offline becj86

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #37 on: January 16, 2016, 23:29:22 pm »
I think if you AP to establish the pattern it makes it much easier to sort it slowly, as their body clock is already set for sleep
This here is the key, I reckon.

L screamed in the car for many reasons, initially because he couldn't see anything much, happier once turned around, but only for about 2 weeks before he refused to be restrained. Luckily I never really had to drive more than about 5-10min to get anywhere regularly and timed any longer drives to coincide with naps.

Offline michaeljacknnugg

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #38 on: January 17, 2016, 07:44:54 am »
Yep I am APing like mad!

I think we have discovered that the evenings where he just can't settle are major OT. So getting day sleep into him is crucial.

I revisited a couple of things and yesterday he slept in a new bouncy chair (different angle, vibrates, can be rocked as well) with white noise on next to him. Which is a big step forward - except that he clearly didn't get enough sleep (3x40mins ish) and was a monster in the evening. DH is convinced that we need to do less to get him to sleep so it's just me getting him to sleep now :( as he won't give him enough help to go off.

Anyway, car hell - there's no way round it really, he's in the car for school runs and trips to the yard. I can minimise trips, but nothing else.
My 'little man' - kind-hearted Spirited whirlwind, 2008
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Offline 4isstillnighttime

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #39 on: January 19, 2016, 13:55:38 pm »
I guess you have to just ride it out (sorry for the pun!!). He sounds very attached to you which is so lovely! I only started putting this baby down to nap at 4 months I think (I prob wrote a thread about it!!) and he can self settle for nap and bedtime now (with his dummy, but that's another issue!!).

And all too soon he won't want to be held to sleep any more!! My big twin has been poorly again and fell asleep on DHs chest.....and I was SOOOOOOO jealous!!!

Offline 4isstillnighttime

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #40 on: January 19, 2016, 13:56:36 pm »
Ps DHs are sometimes so unhelpful, aren't they?!?  ;D my sleep training is constantly sabotaged!!

Offline michaeljacknnugg

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #41 on: January 20, 2016, 15:04:33 pm »
Yes! DH is away right now and it's so nice to be able to follow my own plan. Which today seems to consist of feeding to sleep, but that's another story.

How do I work out how much sleep he needs? He only ended up with 9hrs max last night, had a couple of hours this morning (one in sling, roughly one at home after feeding) and then was grinning and chatting to me over two hours later. Seems to not need much sleep, but get ot quickly - how do I find the tipping point????
My 'little man' - kind-hearted Spirited whirlwind, 2008
My love, my everything - BabyTwo, Nov 2015

Offline 4isstillnighttime

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #42 on: January 20, 2016, 15:21:24 pm »
Oh my, if I knew the answer to that I'd market it and be a millionaire!!! In my (limited) experience it's trial and error. When mine were tiny I would provide opportunities to sleep based on A times (usually buggy, sling, bouncy chair) and just see if they took it. Then once they are in more of a pattern you can ask people here about the tweaking! ;D at your DH - between yours and mine we would have a balanced babywhisperer!!! I complained one time that i had spent the whole night sitting up with a twin latched on each breast, and he asked me if it was a problem!!!!!!

Offline trimbler

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #43 on: January 20, 2016, 21:55:57 pm »
Just following along - I did lots of AP (specifically, sling) with DD, I did try for one cot nap a day plus settling in cot at BT, which was reeeeaally hard work but I think it paid off when at 4.5mo she was able to stretch her A times enough to get two cot naps in between preschool runs, and then the ST started for real. But I felt I knew roughly what to aim for by then, as she'd had her sling naps and I'd been able to work out approximate A times for her without worrying so much about OT/UT, as she was so much easier to resettle in the sling :)



Offline michaeljacknnugg

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Re: I need some help figuring out DS2, please
« Reply #44 on: January 21, 2016, 12:12:00 pm »
It seems that things are so variable right now that it's hard to work out what he needs  :-\. Today we've had 1hr45 and 1hr15, both in the sling so his choice.  The day before yesterday he went 3pm-6pm without a nap despite multiple opportunities, yesterday he slept off and on from 2-5pm.

Just keep watching him?
My 'little man' - kind-hearted Spirited whirlwind, 2008
My love, my everything - BabyTwo, Nov 2015