I'm forgetting best methods for reducing NFs (6 mo)

[~*Nicole*~]

DD has been waking very often at night and wants to nurse to get back to sleep. It was a 4 month growth spurt, sleep regression thing to start and now it's a sleep association/habit with a mix of needing to actually eat and take in calories. One thing is that I truly don't get much time to pump during the day and I am so tired and so don't pump during the night that I can't keep up a big supply for my mom when I am at work. So she nurses in the morning with me, takes two bottles of about 5 oz each of pumped milk during the day while I am at work, nurses whenever I get home and again at bedtime and then is up at least 3 times overnight wanting to nurse. She had also become a distracted daytime nurser and was taking less during nursing sessions and then taking more at night when she was sleepy.

All of this to say...I am tired. I want to reduce the night feeds and I am really not sure how I should best go about it. If I don't offer to feed her and get rid of them all together, I will have to up her calories during the day and I don't know that I can get more breastmilk into her during the day with how often I can find time to pump (usually once at work and MAYBE once again at home if I am lucky).

I feel like I need to go down to only 1 or 2 NFs but I do not know how to do that without it seeming confusing to her and her wanting to nurse to get back to sleep other times.

I thought about offering water in a bottle at night to see if I could dissuade her from wanting to wake up and nurse back to sleep but then I am still filling her with no calories and will have to add in more calories during the day. I would offer milk in a bottle but then I'd have to pump more and with work and the two other LOs I don't think I can realistically do that.

We've also started to introduce some foods but she's so far an inconsistent eater. It's a mix of baby led weaning and purees and baby oatmeal (ped recommended cereal for possible reflux).

Just looking for ideas.

[michaeljacknnugg]

Throw me out if this is way off - would you consider her having a bit of formula now she's 6 months? Seems you are doing so much with working and feeding, and with other kids to care for too. Is formula out of bounds? Not as a main supply but to help you with some of the bits you're struggling with right now...

[~*Nicole*~]

I had considered formula actually even though it wasn't my top preference. But I'm dairy free for her and I'm afraid of the formula causing issues. Doctor can't prescribe elemental formula until we've tried the others first and I'm super nervous .

[Erin M]

Is it out of the question for dh to go in there at one waking?  Realistically, she could be down to 5/6 feeds now on a textbook EASY (7, 11, 3, 7,dreamfeed, night feed) and it sounds like she's getting about 8.  If she nurses when you get home and again at bed, how about a dreamfeed, then try to settle between that and whenever you get up?  I think two 5 oz feeds wouldn't be that far off from 2 nursing sessions at that age, and maybe the extra late afternoon and the df would give her enough calories? 

[~*Nicole*~]

She's actually in our room right now. Haven't rushed to move her. Can you tell she's our last baby??

She was on approximately 4-5 daytime feeds and only 2 night feeds around 2.5 to 3 months actually and was doing really great. But I wasn't back at work yet then. Never did a dream feed as she did well without and now she tends to wake up before I get to a time when I thought one world be appropriate.

DH does actually help settle her for me at times but she's usually up not long after again anyway looking for food. He washes up for work earlier than me so I don't ask for too much help but he's happy to jump in.

[~*Nicole*~]

Sigh. After going to bed early last night around 5:30/6 ish, she was up at 8, 10 something, 12 something, 1 something (I think but can't even remember anymore), 4 something and then up for the day at about 6/6:15.

I am too tired to remember the times and too tired to have written it down. I'm also sick so I'm plodding along in a daze. But it's been like this for awhile now.

I groggily fed her at that 6am wake up hoping she'd sleep longer since I'm so tired but she was up and didn't actually want to nurse which makes sense considering she went to bed early. She did then eat around 7:30. She's been napping from about 8:40 to now which is 10:26.

She's got a cold and also had 6 month vaccines Thursday But other than taking long naps Thursday she's basically doing the same thing as when she's not under the weather.

[Scottishmummy]

I started weaning DS off his night feeds at around 9 months.  I did one feed at a time, paid attention to a digital clock to see how long he fed for (hard when tired but worth the effort) then gradually reduced the length of his feed by minute every couple of days by taking him off gently off. 
By the time we got down to 2-3 min feeds he dropped them himself & then if he did wake again at that time I'd resettle him without feeding. It took 1-2 weeks per feed (& effort to concentrate on timing) but was a very effective, no tears approach.

It would only work if she is getting enough in the day & if she isn't dependant on nursing to go back to sleep (I.e. She needs to be able to self-settle). Do you think she's waking from hunger, habit or because she can't get back to sleep without nursing?

[~*Nicole*~]

That sounds like something I can try to do as she gets older and starts eating more food during the day. Then if I can eliminate some night feeds I can actually pump at night and up her daytime bottle amounts.

I think she started waking from hunger and is now continuing because she likes to go to sleep on a full belly. I switch her to her paci at the end of the feed and then lay her down and she goes to sleep. She is very sleepy but she is not all the way asleep because she often rolls over once I lay her down and gets comfy and then falls fully back to sleep. During the day when she is with my mom she does not get a bottle right before going for a nap and DH can put her up for a nap and she will lay down with her paci, roll over, and self settle to sleep. So I know she CAN go to sleep without nursing but I do think she is becoming very accustomed to needing a full belly to get to sleep. That will make it tougher to wean those night feeds I think.

[Ellie-Leo]

Watching with interest, we are in almost exactly the same boat with ds3, same initially good sleep now terrible, can self settle in day but feeing way too much  at night... Toying with starting to wean to formula to buy back a bit  of myself for the other boys but concerns re possible diary intolerance.also virtually every morning after a terrible night ds3 wakes around 5-6 and I keep hum asleep by brining into bed with me and feeding on and off for as long as possible. No idea how we would cope with that without breastfeeding. So hard to know how on earth to tackle it and I have no idea what to do , especially as dis 3 has had poor weight gain, reflux etc. Hugs Nicole,&; you find the answer let me know. I am In awe of anyone going to work after these awful disturbed nights. My other boys were down to one night feed by now (they also didn't have dummies which I think also helped in some respects)...

[~*Nicole*~]

Hi Ellie-Leo! Glad to have you join me on this journey!

[~*Nicole*~]

UGH....So now, instead of just having frequent NWs to eat, we've gotten our routine all off track. We should be down to two naps, but it wasn't happening consistently because of various things (DD's walk to the bus stop in the morning, colds/teething, my forgetting my lunch and breastpump the other day and my mom having to drive it to me at work with DD in the car!). So first we had a too late catnap which started to shorten our nights and cause a bit of early waking. I figured I'd push the A time out in the morning and try to get two good naps and then not need a catnap and it would get sorted out. Of course several issues caused short morning naps after the early wake up OR a pretty early nap because she was really tired and cranky and keeping her awake would lead to OT and she'd fight a nap and probably short nap. SOOOOOO, now I have a baby who woke up around 5:30 this morning and is napping now at 7:45 (has been down for about 15 minutes already) and I'll never make it to bedtime without having too many naps and then the cycle will repeat.

So our day is happening at the wrong times plus we're still up all night eating. What a mess I've made.

How are you getting on over there?

[Antie66]

You know that there is dairy free formula (if you did want to go down this route)? The HV or we have a feeding clinic, can prescribe it I think. My friend uses it and she says it stinks, but baby loves it.

[~*Nicole*~]

You know that there is dairy free formula (if you did want to go down this route)? The HV or we have a feeding clinic, can prescribe it I think. My friend uses it and she says it stinks, but baby loves it.

Yes, DS was prescribed it actually. Unfortunately, the pediatrician said if I wanted it, I would have to trial the formula with broken down proteins first before being able to prescribe the dairy free formulas. I just can't stomach the idea of putting DD through the torture of trialing something that may cause her pain and discomfort and lots of crying in order to get a script for the dairy free stuff. Although now that you've brought it to my attention again, I wonder if I could bypass the pediatrician and go straight for an appointment with the pediatric GI and see their opinion.

[~*Nicole*~]

Still waking lots at night. Eating more solids during the day now and usually takes a morning BF and 1-2 bottles during the day, then cluster nurses with me once I get home. So I think she's getting enough calories through the daytime.

Decided last night to try giving a bottle upon wake up instead of nursing and figured if I could switch her to that and then slowly decrease the amount and/or dilute it then maybe she'd be less likely to wake up because there'd be no real calories. Thought I could do so very gradually. She did not want the bottle and basically was awake and unsettled for ages until I nursed her.

I'm just so sleepy.

[michaeljacknnugg]

Argh!! She is still very little and is away from you a lot...maybe she's looking for comfort as well as calories?

[~*Nicole*~]

Which is actually a very lovely thought. I hate to make her think I'm pushing her away. We'll keep plodding along. Maybe we'll get to a place where she'll only wake 1 or 2 times.

[ENMS]

How many NF's is she having still?

My DD2 is 8 months now and we are just (this week) starting to see her doing some longer stretches at night (knock on wood it continues!).  She's still at 2 NF's but they are spacing out more and more. Last night was her best night ever, NF at 1AM, and then 6:15 (which was a NF since she went back to sleep but as far as I'm concerned at that point it is morning!).

She has been eating 3 meals a day for a few weeks now but the quantities have gotten bigger this week.

[~*Nicole*~]

She was down to 2 NFs of her own accord between 2 and 3 months. Ever since her 4 month growth spurt/my return to work, she's back to at least 3 if not 4 or 5 NFs. DH will try to rock her and settle her without me for a bit first, but we haven't been successful yet.

[ENMS]

Oh you must be so tired Nicole!!

Sorry this is not getting better for you.

Could you set a time before which you don't feed her and do PUPD instead? Say midnight maybe, or a 4-hour stretch maybe? It may be really hard for 1-2 nights but then she would catch on? You must be so exhausted!

[ENMS]

And also, I know it's contrary to all the 'theory' out there but my DD will settle much more easily at night if I go to her instead of DH - even if I just feed her. Maybe something to try? I know it will not help with you getting more sleep in the short term but it may work? In our case, seeing DH just really es her off in the MOTN so then she gets worked up even more

[michaeljacknnugg]

You must be so tired

Cosleeping and feeding lying down is the answer for me right now (maybe if wanting you for comfort, cosleeping might help?) but I don't know how you feel about that.