Up almost every 1-2hrs, help!

[BeeGuiles]

Sorry, my first reply was rushed and I forgot some things. Right now it depends on how his naps are on how many he has. But he has been having 4 naps I think. The first two have been crappy, the third is usually okay when it is in my arms nursing, the fourth the same and then BT.

See even with two crappy naps for a couple of days he must have got OT by the end of the day and fought the last catnap and fought BT massively and it ended up with me a wreck and my husband and I snapping at one another until eventually we put the baby in the swing for like the millionth time and he finally settled down to the music and drifted off to sleep (bc he was so tired from all the screaming prior to falling asleep) I tried nursing him to sleep like normal and he even would not nurse to sleep last night so he must have been very OT to refuse that and refuse to go to sleep altogether. That is why I am so scared of him being OT bc he really fights and fights hard and I can't seem to stay calm at all which I know makes it worse. But idk if I am going thru depression or something but I just can't seem to handle it and I get angry and anxious and I take it out on my hubby when he takes the baby to give me a break, I criticize him for everything he is doing to try and get him to sleep bc he just lays him in the swing and lets him cry while he sits next to him..and I can't do that, I have to pick him up and at least try to comfort him even if he is still screaming in my arms, at east I know i am doing something to try to comfort him rather than leaving him to scream. My hubby also tried the cot last night (which I got mad at him for bc I knew he would scream in there) but my hubby thought well he is screaming anyways, might as well put him in there. but he did scream and did not stop and just kept getting louder.

Honestly I am at a loss. I know I am part of the problem and maybe I have taught him how to fight it so hard but he is only 4 months old...it's not like he is a year old so I didn't think it would be this hard to try and get him to sleep without the swing or the breast. I am here home alone with him all day and I am afraid I can not handle trying to put him down for all the naps in his cot without nursing him..That is why I have been nursing him to drowsy and then putting him down, otherwise he screams and moves around so much that I can't even pat his back in there. So I pick him up to calm him but he doesn't calm for that either. Just nursing, unless he is OT, then nothing calms him.

I am at a loss, idk what to do, I feel like my hands are tied and I just have to sit with him napping and nursing on me

[BeeGuiles]

Here is my EASY for yesterday also:

6.00 wake up
He then took a car ride with dad so I could sleep and they went to get coffee and things, he fell asleep from 6.30-7.30 hubby said (prlly would have been part of his night sleep if I got up and nursed him back to sleep again)

E 7.55
A 7.40 - 9.25
S 9.28  - 9.48 (in the cot, again had to nurse to drowsy to even get him to sleep in there)
E 10.33
A 9.48 - 11.30
S 11.30- 11.56 in the cot (same as above) then I nursed him back to sleep and held him so he could get some more sleep, would not settle or sleep in the cot again, slept from 11.56 - 12.50
E 1.15
A12.50 -2.35
E/S 2.35  - 3.15
A 3.15-5.20
S He would not settle and take a last catnap before bed, he didnt even want to nurse to sleep so hubby took him for a car ride and he slept 5.20-6.00
A 6.00-9.15 (at the 1.5 mark or before that rather I tried to settle him down for bed, did bath and bedtime routine etc but he just was not going to bed. He would not nurse to sleep, not patting, not shushing, not swinging, nothing....he just screamed until we brought him downstairs and then he would be happy and cooing, laughing for a bit then get very very grumpy bc of OT... finally hubby brought him upstairs and put him in the swing and he screamed and screamed, hubby had the swing music on and was singing (praying, lol) and he finally stopped crying and drifted off to sleep) he slept for a couple hours I think before waking, maybe only 1 hour, I dont rememeber now and didnt write it down and then aftr that he kept stirring to wake up every hour all night long. I would gently put him hands on top of his and he would stop stirring and go back to sleep, except twice he woke up fully and I think he was hungry around 12 and around 6 he woke up for the day at 6.30 and again I was so tired, hubby took him for a ride and he slept some more from 6.40 - 8sh.

Last night before bed was so awful and this is what those darn short catnaps get us is an OT baby who by the end of the day is a screaming mess and won't even nurse to sleep. I am 100% shattered. Today I just held and nursed him to sleep for his first nap and prlly the rest of them too bc I can not handle another night like last night for BT again .I just cant..

[Kellyjs]

I'm wondering if we should just ditch the last CN and do BT then instead? WDYT?

Katherine has hit the nail on the head there about you being scared of OT. Tbh, i didn't realise you felt *that scared of it, I'm sorry if any of my posts about pushing the A time were inconsiderate in anyway  . That being said, it my experience UT causes us far, far more issues than OT ever did. To be fair, I hate OT before BT because i hate the unsettled nights and the ages getting to sleep at BT as that's when we have the least patience isn't it? But, the rest of the time UT naps are a nightmare as they are just impossible to get them back off to sleep. Do remember that he'll be able to cope with a little more OT better than he ever used to when he was a very little bubba ok? This is why I'm always in favour of pushing the first two A times, so any OT happens then. We have more patience (ish  ) in getting them off to sleep and they are more likely to get back off to sleep if they wake early from the nap. With UT, no chance. Same first issue of not going to sleep, then no chance of resettling.

It's totally up you what ou want to do. We can only advise, you are there living it. Do you want to take a break fr a few days then try again with the rip off plaster plan Katherine mentioned? I love consistency and I know LO's do too, so how about next time we approach it, we do it all in one go? I mean it can't get much worse can it? He will cry, but you will be there with him, not giving in. We tend to see a better result day 3 or so, a slight regression on day 4 ish (they check to make sure you're completely sure this is the new way of going to sleep), then it gets better from then on. Let me know what you'd like to do, we'll support you whatever you choose ((hugs)) xx

[BeeGuiles]

I have also tried to cut out the last CN and treat it as bedtime, did the bath and bedtime routine and put to sleep but he wakes up 30 mins later as if it was just a nap, but he does that same thing also at BT too, waking up between 30-60 mins after being put down. Why is this, is that from UT or OT?

So you think I should push him to more A time even if it makes him OT thinking it will help him to take longer or better naps? I'm a little confused I think. My LO doesn't seem to fall asleep very well at all when he gets OT is why I am so scared of it. If he gets OT by the time BT rolls around he goes nuts and will not go to sleep, like what happened with last night. I really don't think he is UT when I get him to take a nap. For example, I was just vacuuming and had him in the swing, I was going to vacuum to kill some time before putting him down for a nap, I had about 15 mins till it was an hour and 45 mins. Well when I was vacuuming he fell asleep in the swing at an hour and 35 mins. He started to drift off at 1h30 min I noticed and took him about 5 mins of head rolling back and forth then he fell asleep. I guess if he wakes up in 30 mins and I can't get him back to sleep he was UT? I thought if he falls asleep like that then he must be at the right level of tired. If he is rubbing eyes, yawning, being really fussy, doesn't that mean he is ready for sleep or should I push him to longer A time and then he will potentially become OT and really fight it?

I think I will have to take a break bc tomorrow he has a doc appt for his 4 month check up and idk if that will interfere with naps or not, depends when he wakes up etc. And tbh I am very frustrated, he takes better naps on me and goes to sleep easier at night from taking better naps on me (most of the time) Idk how I feel at this point. I see so many posts on here of babies who are a lot older than mine and they still are having the same issues that they have been working on for months which leads me to think that maybe this is all developmental and maybe we expect too much from younger babies or babies in general. Ik people have success too but it seems they have success after a long time of working on it and then by then their baby is older so maybe they are then ready to sleep better?

I really do appreciate you guys being patient with me. I am very very emotional right now and struggling with being a new mom more than I thought I was going to, getting too overwhelmed too easily it seems. I keep going around in circles, trying to sleep train and then going back to what is easier. Sometimes I feel like I am going out of my mind bc I go back and forth bc idk what is the right thing to do..

[Kellyjs]

I might still consider OT before BT there. What we can do is learn more and more about him every day. It is a process and he in one sense is dictating what he needs. Sometimes we have to be a bit proactive and help them to learn the new way of sleeping. In either case, I think i'd rather vacuum and have him fall asleep on his own than spend hours trying to get him to sleep  . Know that won't work forever though  .

Oh course he falls asleep better on you, that's what he's done most of his life. It's totally up to you how you'd like to approach it. Tracy believed we all need Y time and I feel like that's why you're struggling atm because you're not getting any.

I would pay attention to his sleepy cues, but not take them as gospel at this age. If he's rubbing his eyes after ony an hour A time, I definitely wouldn't try for a nap. That's why we have one eye on the clock also.

How about you take a couple of days and just watch his cues. Take a note what happens and when. And how the naps go just watching him. I think the time away from me telling you what to do and for you to reconnect with your mummy instinct will make you feel better also.

I struggled massively too. We all do to some degree. I thought it was going to be so much easier. Babies should sleep if they're tired, I didn't realise how much effort it takes. FWIW i remember a week when DD was 4mo I think and she just went on nap strike. No naps whatsoever. I spent that week in tears and feeling so isolated. I wish I had found this forums then.

You will see millions of posts about LO's on here and their sleep, as that's what we do! It's not very often people post on here telling us their babies are sleeping well so what do they do?!  There are sleep regressions, teething issues, prop issues, LO's being OT or UT for their naps, going through nap transitions early or late and need help there too.

One thing I will have to say that if you do decide to sleep train, as Katherine said you have to be 100% committed. There's absolutely no point in allowing a LO to cry and cry for ages (with you there of course) for him to finally get what he wants and be BF to sleep. That's just teach him that he has to cry for longer and harder to get what he wants and really actually not fair on him. If you change the goalposts, you have to be consistent above all things. It will take a bit of time, but if you have the right mind set andhe will feel it from you, it will be so much easier. If you doubt yourself and what you are doing is for the best, you'll automatically revert back to your old way of doing things and that will just confuse him. It's no bad thing to sleep train. Crying is horrible but if you remember that is his only way of communicating with you it does help. If he were an adult, he would just shout at you saying 'this is NOT the way we do things mum', to which you'll reply ' i know, but this is the new way of doing things from now on, ok? I know it's hard as we are changing the goal posts, but this will be so much better for you int he long run and you and I will feel more rested and able to go about our day'. This is why we firmly believe we are with our LO's whilst they are crying. We are communicating back to them. Have a think hun, anything you want to chat through, we are here for you. But please give what I said some thought, speak to your DH and have what YOU believe to be for the best firmly in your mind whatever that may be. Good luck with the 4mo check today xx