Predictable Unpredictability - Please help us!

[labrodyk]

Oh Bec! I don't miss assignments at all, good luck with it all. Thank you for responding .

Today got VERY late, and as I expected she would, has taken a good 40 minutes to fall asleep (UT) now at bedtime 7.53-8.30ish). Really hoping this doesn't bring NW or EW. The laying in bed in the morning is new, as is everything she is doing since learning her thumb sucking skill....

Should I be waking from naps to conserve the day? Harry is in bed at 6/6.30 so I'd really like to conserve a 7pm bedtime if possible though might be unrealistic she needs to fit in with our current BT routines. . 

* If she only naps a little over an hour at 10, do I adjust the second nap at all?
* 3.5 hours if she pulled a 1.5hr morning nap might be too long too. Was very hard to keep her happy today, cranky from 2.5hrs.

[becj86]

This is the same question we keep asking with Audrey - is she upset because she's tired or just upset because she short naps if you PD when she's upset and takes a long nap if she has that age-appropriate A time.

You don't have to set naps, just a suggestion so you're giving her naps at consistent times and she can take the sleep she needs when its offered, yk? You could go with 10:15 and 2:45/3 if you wanted to push her to sleep later in the am. I would say if she sleeps past 2hr, you should be waking at 2:15 or so as she stirs at the sleep cycle transition (nicer way to wake up) to preserve your day so its not running too late and she's not going to bed so late it doesn't suit her body clock. She seems to cope much better with night sleep if she's asleep before 7:30, yeah?

[labrodyk]

What I might do Bec, if you think it might help is fix the first nap at 10 (10.15 shortly to try and push morning if this doesn't work...) and then base the second nap on her tired signs. Even if it's shorter, we can do an EBT. might work a bit better and we can be a bit more flexible because of kindy pickup.

I still think she's going to fall asleep in the car at 9/9.30 on the drive to and from kindy...not sure how to play it those days!

7.30 at the latest is her best nights depending on the naps!

She pulled her usual 1hr 20 minute nap this morning which is frustrating... I swear that it's OT for her.

[becj86]

Sounds like a good plan.

[labrodyk]

And what should I do if she wakes early, chats/rolls/tries to settle for an hour and then falls back to sleep? Is that counted as night sleep or her first nap and do I adjust her 10am nap?
She did the same as last week this morning - woke up at 5.57am (!!) and then sucked her thumb, chatted, tried to fall back to sleep until after 7am and she is asleep now.

[becj86]

If you're looking for consistent WU time, I'd got her up at 7 and do a nap at 10 but if you're just needing her to sleep, let her sleep and shift the nap.

[labrodyk]

Hi Bec!

How are things going?

Just wondered if you had any advice; Audrey is sleeping a lot better but is very tired and falls asleep almost instantly at 10am because she has a tendency to wake earlier than the 7am I get her out of bed. She just quietly sucks her thumb so I'm not sure when she stirs/wakes.

Her 1hr20min naps Today were replaced with longer 1x2h and 1x1hr40 min nap today. Second nap ended at 4.40 with BT at 7.30 but she's just laying awake sucking her thumb now 40 minutes later. She was showing all her tired signs too so it's hard to now work if she's UT or OT.... Last night she took a while to go to sleep and then woke after 40 minutes crying so we thought she was getting back on track today with the longer naps (she was with my mum yesterday and I don't think she napped much).
 
The 1hr20min naps she wakes happy from but is very quickly tired and today she went down at 10am and crashed - woke at 1hr20m but then closed her eyes and sucked her thumb until 11.50 although she does this in the morning but her hands are still playing with her comforter toy!

I can't work out her A's or if she I should be waking her at a certain time to get her to bed by 7/7.30?

[becj86]

I think I would say maybe don't let her sleep past 4:15 for 7/7:30 BT.

I can see by her age, she'd be reasonably likely to need one nap capped sometime soon, so might be worth doing something like restricting day sleep to 3hr (so capping nap 2 at 1hr if she naps 2hr the first nap and letting her sleep 2x1.5 if she does that). That might help with the UT at BT.

[labrodyk]

Thanks Bec!!

I got caught up in the garden tonight and didn't wake her until 4.25! Oops. Bed at 7.15 but still awake 30 minutes later so UT again. Might have to be an hour max for that second nap now - gosh I can't believe I'm capping at 8mo!

[becj86]

Its pretty common to be capping around this age.

[labrodyk]

ok! I'll see how we get on.

I think we've got some sickness and/or teething today because she was screaming from 9am - not happy awake, not happy with me, not happy outside and certainly not happy going down to sleep. I couldn't keep her up more than 9.45 and she only slept a little over an hour but whilst she tried to resettle and fell back asleep it was only for a few minutes so I think discomfort might be on the cards today. I dosed with panadol but perhaps didn't give it enough time to kick in. I'll try and do a full 3hr A before 2nd nap but might have to play today by ear and offer a 3rd nap or EBT.

Thanks for your help again Bec

[becj86]

Poor poppet FX she's feeling better soon.

[labrodyk]

Evening Bec!! Hope you're well. How did your assessments go?

The kindy days are really messing us up. We leave at 8.30am; 30 minutes to get there, do drop off then back in the car. She's either asleep when we get there (even if she wakes at 7, so falls asleep at 8.45!) or once we leave. Can't transfer her, won't take a full nap. Same thing at 2.30 except she's usually only had a short nap so she doesn't last much longer than 2hr30/45 A so I have to wake her by 2.30

Today must have been a catch up nap from terrible naps Thurs-Saturday.

WU: ?, not quite sure..
OOB: 7.00
Nap 1: 9.50; 10.00-12.25
Nap 2: 3.25; ? - 4.15 at the latest. (i think 45ish minutes maybe)
BT: Shortly after 7, 7.10pm? asleep around 7.30 but keeps waking herself every few minutes!

She did the same on Saturday night except after 45minutes she started crying and wouldn't settle. I went in and rested my hand on her tummy until she was quiet and then left the room and she managed to fall asleep herself. I remember Harry starting to take longer to settle at night (20-30 minutes) around this age which is when I started bringing BT back a bit to include the wind down in bed especially as he (and Audrey too) doesn't appear to tack on to the morning.

First A is a better nap if shorter, second nap I try to get to 3 hours but it's very hard work. After such a great nap this morning she was yawning, continuous eye rubbing and every tired sign after 2.5hrs. We changed activity, we offered a bottle and played a bit more to extend her.

[becj86]

Hi, exams all went ok, I think, thanks.

How many days per week do you have kindy? What's the longest the kindy-related nap goes for? She's obviously not quite ready for the short/long combination. It should be reasonably ok once she is, though.

[labrodyk]

That's good to hear! Fx for great results

so she took 30 minutes of quietly laying sucking her thumb/looking around at BT tonight with the super long am nap and short pm. Of course this is not a regular thing...

Kindy days at BEST look like the below; completely blows our 10am ish set nap out of the water and she spends most of the weekend and the rest of the week getting back on track I have to leave at 8.30am and 2.30pm. The afternoon nap I try to pull a bit earlier so she might sleep a little longer (and she usually does which is getting confusing with the 3hr A where she wakes after 1hr20 and is still tired shortly after getting up).

WU: anytime between 6-7
Nap 1: 9/9.30 for anywhere from 20-40 minutes. This usually ends when I pull up at home and sit in the car with the radio or her white noise on...
Nap 2: 12.30/1 - 1.40-.2.20
BT: 6.00 which she's usually exhausted

If nap 2 only goes until the 1.30 end then I try and fit in a late nap at 4.30-5.00 and BT at 7.30 but that quite often backfires and she's awake for quite some time at BT either resulting in a short night or OT and I need to help her settle.

And yet, regardless of BT, first morning A time, she won't push that wakeup past 6am which is really making it hard to do a Set nap at 10 because she's so tired by then. Plus the fact she just lays in bed sucking her thumb, in reality I wouldn't have a clue when she wakes if I wasn't already awake So 'mostly her nights are 10.5hrs long maybe a little more but she's awake well before 7am. When we've tried later bedtime the nights are even shorter which is why I try to keep BT early so she gets the most sleep she can...