Thanks for that info, that's really useful. I think the last couple of days he seems to be telling you what I'd have said from the previous routine you posted above - that he needs to be awake longer first thing, in order to settle for a longer nap. How long was he up, that day when he slept for an hour in the morning? I'd expect anywhere between 2.5-3h at this age, to get a decent nap, some will do longer. Actually many will do 3h by 6mo but mine were always on the shorter end of things! So anyway, he's been sleeping 10:30-11:30 and then again 3-3:45ish? It would be really useful to see this new routine, as the naps would be a little on the short side for most LOs but we may be able to extend those with just a few tweaks in the routine, so that he can get to BT without being so OT...
The other potential issue with getting longer naps is the feeding to sleep prop. It may be that he's just stirring in the transitions between sleep cycles (which typically last around 45mins in babies) but then he can't get himself back off to sleep again without the circumstances in which he initially got to sleep being recreated - in his case, your feeding him to sleep. I've heard it explained as like if our pillow mysteriously disappeared during the night, we'd probably wake up at some point between sleep cycles and be unable to get back to sleep without first finding the pillow.
Now, I really understand that it's so hard to hear him cry
![Kiss :-*](https://smiley.babywhispererforums.com/Smileys/classic/kiss.gif)
however most of the methods we recommend here do involve some crying, it's just that we never advocate leaving a LO alone to figure it out themselves, we will always give them the comfort they need. The crying is usually about showing frustration as they've been used to going to sleep one way and suddenly we change the rules on them. They can't tell us this in words yet, so they cry. Sometimes, especially when LOs are OT, the crying is actually the only way they can shut out the world so that they can finally switch off and go to sleep. I personally found that wearing earplugs helped a lot during sleep training - please understand this was not to block out the cries completely, they were certainly loud enough that I could still hear them, it's just that I didn't get a headache in the process. Which may sound really uncaring, but actually I knew that by staying with them and helping them learn how to go to sleep themselves, maintaining physical contact (practically lying in the cot at times!), staying consistent, they would eventually learn how to self settle and consequently to be able to get the sleep they needed, most of the time
![Tongue :P](https://smiley.babywhispererforums.com/Smileys/classic/tongue.gif)
Actually the gradual withdrawal method does involve some crying usually, it's just that the steps are smaller, so for example at first you may try to get her to sleep by holding her in your arms but not feeding; next by laying down next to her; then by just placing a hand on her or holding her hand, etc, etc. but each time you make a change she may well protest by crying
![Undecided :-\](https://smiley.babywhispererforums.com/Smileys/classic/undecided.gif)
For a method that's advertised as 'no-cry', you could look at Pantley's gentle removal:
Gentle Removal PlanWe do support this here but fewer of us have had experience of it, and many find that it's hard to keep the momentum going, due to the fear of baby crying. So I suggest you have a think about how important not crying is to you, and why you're afraid of LO crying, and what your goals are long term? If you decide that you can live with some crying, knowing that it will be temporary and will eventually lead to LO sleeping better, then we can work on gradual withdrawal or PUPD. If on the other hand you feel strongly that whatever happens, you want as little crying as possible, then have a go at Pantley's method. Let me know what you decide
![Kiss :-*](https://smiley.babywhispererforums.com/Smileys/classic/kiss.gif)
But bear in mind that all the rocking, walking and moving around may end up being counterproductive, especially if he's OT, as it could overstimulate him and make it even harder for him to switch off. Sometimes, less is more, but I understand, when baby is crying you want to do anything you can to make it stop
![Kiss :-*](https://smiley.babywhispererforums.com/Smileys/classic/kiss.gif)
If you decide to go down the Pantley route, it may be slow going at night but it's supposed to gently encourage fewer, shorter, feeds. If that doesn't happen, you may need to resettle her in other ways when she wakes, which is why I'd personally prefer to use gradual withdrawal during the day, so that she can get used to another way of going to sleep, which is what you'd repeat at night if she wakes, say, less than 3h since her last feed. At first she may wake at 2h after her last feed and you may spend an hour trying to resettle her before feeding. But the next night, you may find you have success resettling her without a feed, and she ends up going a bit longer before she wakes again, and then you'd feed her.
Now it may be that you'd like to work on her routine whilst continuing to feed to sleep - which may possibly work, if she's able to keep up those longer naps. Then once she's better rested, she may be better able to cope with sleep training. However, it may be that the feeding to sleep is such a strong prop that she can't maintain long naps until that's weaned, and if that turns out to be the case then I'd encourage you to concentrate on weaning that. Either way, I'd be a bit flexible with 2 vs 3 naps for now - if she does short naps then she'll need shorter A times in between to keep her from getting too OT, so you'd squeeze in a third; if she has nice long naps then you may get by without one. Most LOs need to be doing at least 3h A time before they can completely drop the third nap - have a read of this:
All about the 3-2 transition- 5/6 months