Help with 2-1 transition gone wrong

[JennVanessa1083]

I think I made too big a leap from putting him down almost asleep to wide awake. I need to do teeny tiny stepsfoe this to work. I don't mind spending time on it.

I basically wind down by changing diaper, giving teething tablets, reading a story, then humming the same lullaby, white noise, walk around with him. It used to be walk around until I saw he was drowsy then put him down awake. He would roll over then knock out, sometimes he would crawl around a little bit then lay down.

I have been walking until fully asleep then putting down.

[Scottishmummy]

Ok so tiny steps as you say... I'd go back to walking with him until drowsy then put him down and soothe in cot until he's asleep, if you need to. You can then start stopping cot soothing earlier and letting him do last bit himself.

Hope that works better xxx

[JennVanessa1083]

Yes I can definitely start doing this.

Last night we made huge progress. He did a nice 7 hour stretch woke to feed then back down.
I still feel he went down a little OT so tweaking is still needed.

Yesterday we did:

WU 7:30
S 11:15-11:45 (I realized too much A; he wouldn't go back down)
S 3:15-4:40 (about 3.5)
BT 8:15ish pm (he did almost 3.75)

He was twitchy in the beginning of the night and did a touch shorter than an 11 hour night. So I tried a 3.5 A in the am and he woke up exhausted after 30 minutes and knocked out after nursing. Soooo looks like I may need to do a 3.25 first A or should I just stick it out for two more days to see if it was a fluke from yesterday.

I'm thinking maybe:

WU 7:30
S 10:45-11:15
S 2:45-4:15
BT 7:45 pm

My only concern is him not doing a 12 hour night. He doesn't really do it unless he's catching up.

Any tips?

[Shiv52]

I'd do the same thing for 5 days and wouldn't tweak A times at all.

An 11 hour night in the 2-1 is totally fine. Neither of mine ever ever did a 12 hour night. One did 11 and one did 11.5.

[JennVanessa1083]

My DS is the same. Right now he does more of an 11 hr night.

So I'm sticking to this then:

WU 7:30
S 11-11:30 am
S 3:15-4:45 pm
BT 8:15 p.m

Does that look ok? Last night he was fighting bedtime and did an almost 3.75 A; however, he was OT bc he was very twitchy but then had a nice long stretch of 7 hours before even waking up so I know I'm getting close!

[Shiv52]

That looks good xx

[JennVanessa1083]

Thank you!

Today is a mess. Seems either teething has intensified or something else is up. Calling the doctor tomorrow. He's been hysterical crying in pain and strangely tired as well as extra cuddly which is strange bc he's a ball of happy energy usually.

[JennVanessa1083]

I have a general question:

Do teething babies have inconsistent A times?

Today I tried the am nap for 3:40 A time ( meant to do 3.5 but we had a photo shoot that ran long). He's still sleeping! I thought about waking him to preserve the EASY but between yesterday and today he's been extra tired. I'm thinking perhaps it's signs he may cut finally? They are right there at the surface ready to break any second taunting me lol

I'm thinking I may have to pull back A times closer to 3.25 for the morning to get more of a UT nap rather than OT before his pm or should I have woken him anyways and aimed for a shorter second A? Say 3.25 hours?

This is really tricky!

[Shiv52]

I tended to not change A times due to teeth. I don't remember it being an issue but our routine was fairly set at this age.

I'm not sure about aiming for UT nap. If he'll settle without needing more assistance from you then am sure it's fine. Mine would never sleep unless properly tired.

I think lovely and don't mean to sound like a broken record but I'd just pick what you think will work, what your gut is telling you and start your five consistent days from tomorrow. It takes time for these things to take so at this age I wouldn't judge day to day at all.  So much can affect them including activities etc

Sorry screaming 6 week old clearly sensed I was heading for the shower!!!

[JennVanessa1083]

Lol I hope you got your shower in!

Ok thank you for the reassurance to just push through. I needed the broken "record." My DS is the same. He will fight tooth and nail if he isn't too tired or if he's OT. 

The only issue in having is stretching my day to s 13 hour day bc DS is doing 11 hour nights and wakes up ready to go.

This is what I have been aiming for:

WU 7:30
S 11-11:30 (but maybe he will sleep until 11:45 but hasn't yet)
S 3-4:30 (hopefully one day 5 pm)
BT 8 pm

[JennVanessa1083]

I have another question: does a 1.5 NW where DS is babbling and tumbling around while trying to stand alone common? Is it teething? Is it UT? He was fine in the beginning of the night then woke up screaming 3 hours after BT so we have him Motrin. Then he wakes up 3 hours later but puts himself back to sleep then wakes up 45 minutes later wired!!!

I didn't do anything different in terms of A times except the am nap he slept a little longer and pm nap was cut short due to noise. But all in all a total of 2 hours day sleep. Was the longer am nap the cause?

I haven't had a long NW in awhile so seems strange that it came seemingly out of nowhere. I don't want a repeat tonight bc I'm exhausted and gradually weaning NF so long NW are definitely not going to help this process. 

[~*Nicole*~]

Just throwing it out there that often a LO won't be tired enough to fall asleep at bedtime if they've had a later nap. I remember having to make sure my second nap ended early enough to ensure LO was properly tired for bedtime and often having to make sure the nap wasn't too long even if they had no morning nap because too much day sleep would cause us issues. That 4:30/5 pm ending would have meant disaster for us trying for an 8pm bedtime, either in resisting going to sleep or NWs later from UT. Then they'd be OT by morning because they didn't sleep and it would start a vicious cycle of short OT morning naps, longer afternoon to make up for it, resist bedtime or NWs from UT and so forth.

[JennVanessa1083]

Hmmmmm that is a good point. I have read articles indicating late afternoon naps mess with bedtime. The problem is that if I do a long am I get tons of pm nap resistance then end up with a OT short pm nap then OT to bed. I am wondering how to construct a routine that would give me 11-12 hour nights without long wakings and EMW. I am stil getting strange shorter nights where he will have a 10 hour night and wake up. I nurse him then he dozed off for 30-60 minutes until WU.  It really is a delicate balance.

[JennVanessa1083]

I'm thinking DS is very OT. NW are increasing. This is day 4 of doing the short am/ long pm routine of:
WU 7:30
S 11-11:30
S 3 pm- 4:30 pm (wakes up about 1:15/1:20 tired and cranky)
BT 8-8:30 pm

 I have been reading different posts on people who do short am/ long pm and this is what they generally do and it seems my A times after a short nap maybe too long?

What if I did something like:

WU 7:30 am
S 11-11:30 (he wakes up on his own fussy so should I make this nap earlier?)
S 2:30-4 pm (4:30 would be a dream come true)
BT 7:30 pm

Has anyone done this sort of routine where it worked out?

[~*Nicole*~]

I actually did this type of a routine with DD around the same age. I think I had a morning nap nearer to 10am if I am recalling correcty and kept it short...30-45 minutes, then an afternoon nap around 1-3 or 2-4 (can't remember!!). I know as the morning shortened and phased out, then the afternoon nap moved earlier and earlier. Then we alternated 2 nap and 1 nap days as she headed into not needing 2 naps all the time. 1 nap days, she'd nap around 11:30/12pm and then I'd determine bedtime based on when she woke up. That was always a bit tricky. When she refused naps in the morning but I knew I needed her to take one because she was OT or whatever, I'd just drive somewhere and let her take a short 15-20 minute nap in the car for the morning until she settled totally onto one afternoon nap each day. She was the most difficult of my LOs with sleep and she needed everything to be JUST SO. Tweak here, tweak there and it was always like that until she grew out of naps entirely.

Here are some old sample routines that show some of the different ways people have gone about it:

chronological EASY samples, 10-12 months