6mo 2-3 night feedings and extra wakings

[N_Mom_S]

Hi everyone!

My LO was having great nights until he got sick and we've been trying to get back to that without much success. He was having 1-2 feedings a night and no additional wakings. That was huge for us because he's never been a good sleeper and he has reflux, although it's supposedly under control now. We've using shh pat for naps quite successfully but when he was sick we had to rock him. It's getting better at most of the NW, but during the first one he still wakes up screaming and only rocking+patting works, sometimes not even that and I have to feed him. He'll be 6mo in 2 days and he's on a 4h EASY, breastfed.

My question is, is it normal to have 2-3 night feedings at this age (and he eats quite a lot in each one of them)? We just started solids and I thought that would help, but it hasn't. I'm fine with feeding twice a night if he really needs it (3 times is too much because the third one is usually very close to WU time and he either stays awake or falls asleep until late), but I want to know if there's something I can do to eliminate them if he doesn't need them and just got used to them.

Apart from that, I'd appreciate if someone could take a look at our EASY to understand why that first NW and how to get rid of it. I'm going to try wake-to-sleep tonight, fingers crossed! I just need him to last like an hour longer so that he doesn't need a third feeding so close to WU time.


The last few days (our ideal WU time is 8:30):

WU 7:15 tried resettling, had to feed
E 7:45, 8:50 (the first one to try to make him sleep without success, the second one his normal WU feeding)
S 9:35-10:40 (1h05)
S 12:35-1:00 (25m) we had to squeeze in another nap to avoid nursing to sleep
E 1:45+solids
S 3:35-5:00 (1h25)
E 5:15
S 7:10-7:40 (30m)
E 8:40 asleep by 9:35

NW: 00:00 (rock, pat, no success, feeding at 00:30), 1:20 rock-pat, E 3:00, 4:00 pat, E 6:30



WU 8:50
E 10:00
A 2H30
S 11:20-1:15 (1h55)
E 2:00+solids
A 2h35
S 3:50-5:20 (1h30)
E 6:40
E 8:15 asleep by 8:45, OT

NW: 9:15 pat (OT), E 00:00, E 3:50, pat


WU 7:10
E 8:20
A 2h45
S 9:55-11:55 (2H)
E 12:35+solids
A 2H55
S 2:50-4:20 (1H30)
E 5:15
A 2H40
S 7:00-7:25 (25m)
E 8:20 asleep by 8:50

NW: 11:35 rock, pat, had to feed at 00:05, then E 4:40 (good night)


Today he had two naps and BT was happy and easy:

WU 8:30? (he was quiet)
E 9:00
S 10:40-1:00 (2H20)
E 1:10+solids
A 3H05 (aimed for 2h30 but he cried a lot during shh pat)
S 4:05-5:25 (1h20)
E 6:00
E 8:45 asleep by 9:25


I'm trying to push A times to get ready for the 2/3 transition. He has some occasional days with two naps and sometimes he ends up overtired and sometimes not.


Any advice would be appreciated!! 

[FPT23]

Hi there!! I'm glad your LO is feeling better how was he sleeping before he got sick? Was he sleeping on his own- going down independently? It's very possible the AP you began to help him to sleep might have got him used to it. I would suggest teaching him slowly how to sleep again or attempt by now if you have not already

Having a look at your EAS, it looks pretty good to me IRT A times for his age. You could very well be stepping into the 3-2 nap transition if he's starting to EW or have some more NWs. If you look at your last EAS he seems to have had a better night on less day sleep. Sometimes that CN at the end of the day is needed to make it to BT when transitioning. Especially if naps start to get short and you need to/start to push those A times and eventually get the CN out of the way. Slowly but surely. At this age, 3 hours per day is good enough (2, 2hr naps and one 45 min CN- ideally) ...this of course varies with child. Some are higher sleep needs while others need less sleep

Here's the link if you haven't yet taken a look for the 3-2 nap transition and signs they may be ready

All about the 3-2 transition- 5/6 months

As far as his NWs... It's common to have 1-2 NWs for a BF baby at his age. With that said however, there is a GS at the 6 month mark so if he's waking and eating fairly well, then just keep feeding. You may consider feeding more often during the day as the GS passes through. Maybe every 3.5 hrs and top off before BT. It will pass! With that early NW I would just attempt to soothe and settle the best you can. If you are slowly working on I.S again then attempt to shh pat (varied to his preference) ...W2S I feel is more for habitual wakings-- if he is waking at the exact same time every night, then it is habitual. If it changes from time to time it could be he's just needing help settling.

Also, keep in mind as well, solids have just begun and can cause some mild discomforts in their nights at times... And of course, any signs of teething ...lots going on at this time so treat each NW with these tips in mind!

Hope that helps!

[N_Mom_S]

Thank you for your help! I'm sorry I haven't answered before, I've been busy, but I followed your advice regarding the transition! He was definitely ready for that! We still have some days with a 3rd nap, but just occasionally. And I think w2s worked! It eliminated the dreaded first waking, and from that he went straight to 3am, 4am the next day, and yesterday it was almost 6am and only one feeding! 
Since these is long stretches of sleep are new for me, should I let him get closer and closer to his morning (9am) feeding or should I feed him at around 4am so that they're not so close in time? (and for the sake of my breasts, too!) Would that create a habitual waking?

[FPT23]

Oh great news!

Glad to hear!!


I would feed at the 4am wake time. That is a long stretch without a feed. I don't think it will cause a habitual waking right now. He still might very well need one night feed kwim? And for the sake of the breasts haha! I know how that is !

[N_Mom_S]

Thanks for your advice! We'll see how it goes 

[FPT23]

Your welcome!

[N_Mom_S]

Hi again!!
He's 7 1/2 mo now and we've gone several steps backwards after another cold (and that was 3 weeks ago).He wakes up 2/3 times to eat, at around 00:30, 4am, 7am. Then, on a good day, he goes back to sleep until 8:30 or 9am. On a bad day he doesn't. I've tried w2s since it worked the first time but this time it didn't. I'd like to stretch them so that I can make that 7am one disappear and avoid the risk of an early WU just because he's hungry or used to eat at that time. During the day I feed him every 4-5h (depending on when he wakes up from his nap) and solids 1h after; would feeding him more often help eliminate the night feedings or just the opposite? At night I do 5-6pm breast, 8pm breast, 8:30 cereal (usually 9-9:30 BT). His A time is around 3h and he usually takes two 1h30 naps, although it varies, but it's usually around 3h in total.

Also, he's getting much more difficult to put down, both for naps and BT. He always cries, sometimes more, sometimes less, but he hates it. At some point a couple of months ago he was even self-soothing some days, and shh pat was very easy, but now it's increasingly more difficult. Should I use another method, or re-train him somehow? I'd like to avoid PU/PD if possible. Our routine (for naps and BT) is story, song and white noise. Usually he starts complaining as soon as we enter the room because he knows he's going to bed 

[FPT23]

Awww I'm sorry! Colds can really throw stuff off. Hope he's feeling better

Can you please post your EASY?

It's just so much easier to help that way and see if we can figure things out from there. Track for a few days for me then come back

From what I can see, he might be needing another push in A time. If he's 7.5, he might be nearing 3.5 A time. Sometimes after a cold, some retraining is needed if you AP'd through it. It shouldn't be too difficult as he's done it before... Gradual withdrawal from shh/pat if that's what worked before. But if he's refusing it and is crying, there might be something in his routine that needs adjusting. Possibly.

Hugs xo

[N_Mom_S]

I'm starting to suspect he cries more when either my husband or I put him down (he cries the most with me) than with his grandma. If that's the case, I don't know what to do. Hiring my mum for all his naps and BT is not an option, haha.

The last 3 days' EASY (I used to do solids 1h after nursing and now I'm pushing it closer to naptime to prevent him from waking up from his nap due to hunger, but I don't know if it helps or just the opposite):

WU 9:00
E nurse 9:30, solids 11:15
A 3H
S 12:00-1:30 (1H30)
E nurse 1:45, solids 3:30
A 3H
S 4:30 (crying a lot) - 6:00 (1H30)
E nurse 6:00, nurse 8:00, cereal 8:30
A 3H30
BT 9:30 (with grandma, less crying)

E 1:15, E 4:45, E 7:00


WU 8:45
E nurse 9:00, solids 11:00
A 3H15
S 12:00-12:55 (55M)
E nurse 1:15, solids 3:15
A 3H20
S 4:15-6:30 (2H15)
E nurse 6:30, nurse 8:10, cereal 8:30
A 3H30
BT 10:00 (little crying)

E 00:45, rock 3:30 (sh pat didn't work), E 5:45


WU 8:45
E nurse 9:00, solids 11:15
A 3H40
S 12:25 (crying a lot) - 1:40 (I had to wake him up) (1H15)
E nurse 1:40, solids 3:45
A 3H15
S 4:55 (he started to cry with me so grandma took over and he didn't cry at all) -5:30 (35m)
E nurse 5:35, nurse 8:00, cereal 8:30
A 4H10
S 9:40 (crying)

[FPT23]

Thanks for the easy layout

Is there a reason why you consider the 7am wakes a NF? Does he go back to sleep?

Also, his awake times are on the high side. You have him at almost 4 hrs if not at 4hrs for some days. How many weeks is he exactly? I would consider cutting back on the awake time and put him down sooner, see if that helps. Does he currently have wind down routines?

I think the NWs are due to OT. Is he actually eating a lot at all 3 NFs? How does he go to sleep? Independently?

[N_Mom_S]

Yes, he goes back to sleep. Both BT and WU are later than usual because that's what works best here in Spain 
He's 7 months and 2 weeks. With wind down do you mean the story, song and white noise or something else?
He eats quite a lot during the NFs. And at BT he usually goes to sleep after letting him cry for a while (being there with him) and start the shh pat again. Usually continuing the shh pat non-stop makes him angrier.

Last night it was E 00:35, E 4:00 (tried rocking but it didn't work), and there was no 7am waking, could it be because he only slept 1h50 during the day?

Thanks for your help!

[FPT23]

Yes wind down- some babies like a quick and simple wind down as well.

Yes that could very well be. If he's still eating well at NFs then continue them OR your may want to consider adding more feeds in his day so he is not compensating for them at night, kwim?

Here's a link for you if you'd like to read into it as well as typical amounts of A time for babies his age more or less

Typical Amounts of Day and Night Sleep

Average A times- BOOKMARK ME!

If he's having multiple night wakes one last thing to consider is teething? Very common around that age as well!

Hugs xoxo

[N_Mom_S]

Yeah that was one of my doubts, will feeding him more often during the day decrease the NFs? Or will he eat the same amount in the end? He used to be a snacker - feeding every 2h - and it was difficult to stretch the feeding times but we finally got it, I don't want to risk going back to snacking!!! 

Thanks for the links, I think we'll shoot for 3h15 A time, we'll see!

[FPT23]

Keep us posted!

Positive vibes xo

[N_Mom_S]

Here I am again!

The dreaded first waking is back - at around 00:30, 3h after BT - and yesterday I tried W2S and he woke up at 1:15 instead. Does that mean I need to keep doing W2S every hour until the next waking (at around 4-5am)? Nothing soothes him but the breast, and he only eats from one breast so I guess he's not super hungry.

Also, I need to mention he always wakes up mad at that first waking, unlike the other ones.