Author Topic: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old  (Read 3425 times)

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Offline Mum2lucy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #15 on: July 10, 2016, 21:34:47 pm »
Thanks for your reply. It was helpful to confirm my thoughts.

Two days ago I decided to go with the flow and see if I could just keep her up until she seemed tired (easier said than done as she hides the tiredness) but I did so and at 5hrs 35mins she did the tiniest of yawns (blink and I would have missed it!) anyway I took that as a sign as she doesn't even normally do that. I put her down and she was eyes closed at 5hrs 45mins and slept 1hr 40 mins.

I did the same again today going with the flow to see where it got us. She didn't do any signs that I saw and didn't want it to get too OT so she was down and asleep at 6hrs A today and slept for 1.5hours. Improvement!

She's going to nursery for 3 full days. Their nap is at 12 and I think she'll be up at 6.30am on those days. I think I'll see how she does on at 12pm at nursery because as you said, they get more tired. It might be half 12 set nap at home though if that would even work.

Offline Mum2lucy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #16 on: July 11, 2016, 06:35:13 am »
Yesterday was:

Wu: 6.30
S: 12.30 - 14.00
Bt: 18.50 (in cot 6.45 and self settled)

If I do a set nap and she wakes up early like today at 5.15, what do I do? It would be a long time to get to 12/12.30!

Gutted about the 5.15 wake up.... Had thought I might actually be getting somewhere. Might have come from the 6hr morning am making her OT. I see that lots of posts say Emw is because of not long enough morning A time but as I've just pushed this to 5.75-6 hours, surely it's not that? x
« Last Edit: July 11, 2016, 09:16:00 am by Mum2lucy »

Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #17 on: July 11, 2016, 19:35:54 pm »
If you're "set" on set naps, you really have to stick with it for at least a week, ideally 2, regardless of Wu time, with only +/- 15 mins for naps and 30 mins for BT.

For us, EW happens if nap is too early in the day; if she's slept too much, too late in the day; if BT is too early...but none of those seem to fit for you. Another mod told me that waking 9-10 hrs after BT can be OT, especially if upset on waking. 

She's had a big A time jump in quite a short space of time.  I think it sounds like 5hr45-6hrs gives you a better nap (the 1hr15 nap at 5hrs A time definitely looks UT to me) but she probably needs time to get used to it.

I think it would be good to decide whether you want to go with 5.45/6hr first A time or set naps and stick with it for at least a week & see how she goes. There is bound to be some OT whichever you do as she gets used to it.
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Offline Mum2lucy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #18 on: July 18, 2016, 09:34:15 am »
Hiya,

I've tried a week of being consistent and it isn't working really. I'm getting 5am wake ups which I can't resettle.

The last week has been:

Wu: 6.30
S: 12.30-14.00
Bt: 18.50 (in bed 6.45, self settle)

Wu: 5.15 or 5.25 (hard to tell)
S: 9.53-10.05 (was during a time and fell asleep in the car)
S: 12.15-14.10 (woke at 40mins, fell back asleep on me)
Bt: 19.00 (self settle)

Wu: 6.05
S: 12.30 - 14.30 (woke at one hour, fed back to sleep as very upset)
Bt: 19.00 (bed 18.35, kept standing up so wouldn't self settle)
Nw: 20.05

Wu: 05.15 (tried for 1hr 20mins to resettle but wouldn't)
S: 10.50 - 12.20
E: 12.30
A:
S: 16.25-16.45
Bt: 19.15 (in bed 19.13 self settled)

Wu: 5.00
S: 6.00 (managed to get her back to sleep by shoogle)
Wu: 7.40
S: 12.20 - 14.30
Bt 19.00 (self settled)
Nw: 4.24 (managed to settle quickly in 15mins of shhh)

Wu: 07.40
S: 13.50-14.20 (30mins wouldn't go back to sleep)
S: 16.40-17.00 (20mins to try to keep her going to get dinner etc)
Bt: 20.05(tried from 7pm as to not extend the day wouldn't settle, had to rock to drowsy then into cot)

Wu: 6.05
S: 14.05 - 15.30 (was travelling to holiday and wouldn't sleep on the go)
Bt: 19.40 (in bed 7pm and wouldn't settle, upset)
Nw: 20.35 (settled ok with shhh)

Wu: 5.55
S: 10.48- 13.20
Bt: 19.04 (in bed 19.00 self settled)

Today:
Wu: 5.00 (wouldn't resettle)

It seems with her shorter 10hour night she is back to 4hr 40mins (ish) awake time.
She used to do 11-11.5houra at night.

Just generally OT do you think? x


Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #19 on: July 18, 2016, 20:32:40 pm »
Thanks for posting that...looks like a mix of OT on the days she's had short naps or earlier naps and a very  long last A time and UT on the day she took a 2hr nap then wasn't ready for bed at 7 or when she slept in mid/late afternoon so not enough A time to bed!

Are you aiming for a consistent first A time or for a set nap time..or following her tired cues?

Looking at this, I wonder whether it would help to keep trying to aim to have main nap around 12.30- that seems to give you a good nap (1.5-2hrs)  and an easier settle at BT.  On days you get EW (before 6) could you try to AP a 15min CN after the 4hr40 A time to get you to the after lunch nap? I know short am/long pm didn't work for her as a consistent approach but I seem to remember it helped to catch her up on sleep? And might help to get a consistent main nap & A time to BT at least?
« Last Edit: July 18, 2016, 20:48:08 pm by Scottishmummy »
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Offline Mum2lucy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #20 on: July 18, 2016, 21:51:05 pm »
Hiya,

Thanks for replying.

I had been going for a nap based on a times. I just don't see a set nap working when she has such early wake ups unless I made it relevant to her 5am wake up time as she'd never make it to 12ish with a 5am wake up.she has however a few days given me slight tired signs and I've gone with them and those are the days that she has had 2hour sleeps.

I feel like I'm getting myself into bad habit territory with having to rock her at night to get her to sleep. I had to do it again tonight as she was getting in such a state. I had worked hard to get her to self settle and I feel like it's all going out the window. I'm on holiday again just now so that doesn't help.

Today was

Wu 5.00
S: 10.04-11.30 (woken by another screaming baby in the house  :) )
E: 12.00
S: 14.10-14.50 (fell asleep in car journey)
Bt: bed 18.45, sleep 19.50. Wouldn't settle. Hour of tears and standing had to rock to drowsy)

I had tried to get her to bed for 7pm as I thought the a to bed would be OK and keeps bt consistent but she was very upset.

I'll try a short catnap in the morning and down at 12.30 and see what happens.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2016, 21:53:03 pm by Mum2lucy »

Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #21 on: July 19, 2016, 12:08:59 pm »
Naps and routines are always tricky on holiday. She can SS though so hopefully when routine settles so will her bedtimes. Looking at your days, I think the bedtime issues might be UT/OT I.e. UT from a mid-late afternoon sleep but then gets OT when she can't get to sleep.

I would just try the v short am CN if you get wu before 6. 
If you get wu 6 or later try for the after lunch nap-12.30ish
Kind of a 2 option set nap!

ETA- there's a little bit of me that wonders whether she would eventually need a 1pm nap to get a wu later than 6, as she's done a long first A from quite a young age...but I think I would try to focus on getting a more consistent 6am-7pm day first (which I'm hoping will come if we get the consistent middle of the day long nap) then can try pushing to 6.30-7.30 if you want to.

FWIW - I got in a mess with 2-1 with my DS and using the 15min am CN & set naps helped catch us up and sort it out for us in the end
Xxx
« Last Edit: July 19, 2016, 12:33:25 pm by Scottishmummy »
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Offline Mum2lucy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #22 on: July 19, 2016, 21:35:35 pm »
Today we had

Nw: 5.00 (getting her back to sleep isn't easy so today fed her after short time trying to settle her and she was back asleep within 15mins?)
Wu: 7.45
S: 12.50 - 14.30
Bt 19.00, sleep 19.36 (crying and standing whole time before sleep had to be shhhh)
Nw so far: 22.25

Tonight I was hoping for an easier bedtime as it was a longer time to bedtime but didn't seem to help for now. Will see how we go! x

Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #23 on: July 20, 2016, 20:58:40 pm »
Hmm, do you think the EWs are hunger or do you think she just finds the feed soothing?

Do you think she might need 5hrs A time to BT (after a long nap)? I saw you've had a day before when the nap finished at 14.30 and she resisted BT until 19.30.
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Offline Mum2lucy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #24 on: July 21, 2016, 10:47:53 am »
I've no idea re the feed as when she was doing the 11/ 11.5 nights, she never had a feed so I reckon it's just comforting. I'm trying not to wake up the whole holiday household at 5am so it helped.

Yes I reckon she might need the full 5A before bed even if it is a 1.5hour nap.

If she wakes at 6am, and I'm aiming for a half 12 nap, do I just plough on through if she is getting annoyed/tired? Right now she isn't doing that long an A as she isn't sleeping as long at night or as well with the occasional night waking.

Yesterday was
Nw: 04.55 (fed and back to sleep)
Wu: 6.25
S: 11.30 - 13.00
E: 13.05
A:
S: 16.25-16.45 (fell asleep in car on way home)
E: 17.00
Bt: 19.45 sleep 20.00 (kept her up later due to late Cn)

She woke at 6.05 this morning. Later because I put her to bed later but still that 10hour sleep limit

Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #25 on: July 21, 2016, 13:52:49 pm »
It makes a long day & a short night, doesn't it?

I hesitate to suggestions because I know we tried short am/long pm before and it wasn't right for her, but when I got in a mess with my DS' 2-1 I started the follow set nap routine:

Wu:6
Nap: 9.35-45/50 (in cot at 9.30)
Nap: 1pm until he woke (usually around 3 but anything between 2.30-3.30)
BT: 7pm

The 10min CN was just enough to reset him, avoid OT and keep him going until a 1pm nap. 

Would it be worth trying something like that again? Even just to reset her until you get an after lunch nap again, a longer straight A time to bed then hopefully a longer night/later Wu? I imagine for you, the day would eventually be

Wu:6.30
Nap 1-2.30/3
BT: 7.30

But it's just trying to get her caught up enough in sleep to get there.


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"Textbook" DD



Offline Mum2lucy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #26 on: July 21, 2016, 20:09:35 pm »
I'll try it when I'm home from holiday on Sunday.
However she starts nursery three days a week the following week so I don't think they'll be able to do that? The nursery nap is at 12 but they can be flexible with that timing.

Today we had:

Wu:6.05 (slept through from 8pm)
S: 11.30 - 13.00, woke crying went in and shhh, fell asleep again for 10mins. Up finally at 13.13
Bt: 18.45 sleep 19.05 (screaming and standing in cot and had to give dummy and shhhh)

Offline Scottishmummy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #27 on: July 22, 2016, 12:59:21 pm »
My DS always did different naps at nursery to at home. I just tried to keep home consistent and it seemed to even out (although he often needed earlier BT after nursery days or slept in/longer nap at wkends to catch up from nursery sleeps)
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Offline Mum2lucy

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #28 on: July 25, 2016, 07:26:53 am »
Hi,

I'm looking for some advice on what to do with the 5/5.30am wake up. I think a lot of the sleep problems just now are from the 2:1 but also as she has learned to stand in her cot and is doing it loads. When she wakes, she instantly stands up. I've read stuff about not being able to sit back down so I've been practising it. She can do it in the cot but it seems she doesn't want to sit down lol.

Yesterday was:

Wu: 5.25
S: 11.10 - 13.11 (woke at 1hr, managed to resettle her after about 10mins but unfortunately lying on me with dummy)
Bt: 18.30, sleep 18.56 (kept standing up and crying, had to put heavy hand on her to get her to stay down and shhhh her to sleep)

Wu: 5.10

So at 5.10 this morning she was standing and screaming. I go in to check she's ok (no dirty nappy, cold etc) but she always seems fine. If I leave she starts screaming again. Today I laid beside her cot and every time she got up I laid her back down saying sleepy time. Did this for 1.5hours. She did begin to stop getting up every time but no sign of sleep. I got her up at 6.30am and gave morning feed where she fell asleep again. I left her on me and she slept 6.40-7.37. I'm wondering if this is a good or bad thing the extra sleep ie.
Is it still night sleep or is that her having a super early first nap?!

Yesterday morning I went in every ten mins and laid her back down but she just cried and didn't settle. I got her up at 6.30am (I won't let her up to start the day before this)

She is cutting molars (two top are through, two bottom are not through yet) so I don't know if this is making it worse. She doesn't seem to be in too much pain at that time of the morning?

I also wonder if she is getting too OT in general now. Maybe I should go for a set routine based on the 5am wake up and see if I can stabilise her sleep? Maybe similar to yesterday but into bed at 6pm with the hope of getting her sleep for 6.30pm?
« Last Edit: July 25, 2016, 08:03:07 am by Mum2lucy »

Offline zissi

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Re: 2:1 transition with a 1 year old
« Reply #29 on: July 25, 2016, 11:41:13 am »
I could have written that post. including the same nap times, BT etc and also the early wake up. I have no advice for you though, for us it has been going on for weeks now. wake ups getting earlier and earlier. I tried a few times BT at 6pm and even before, while she settled instantly she had loads of NW#s on those nights so I decided that super early BT doesn't work for us. it seems she needs a long day, around 13 hrs maybe but not as long as 14 hrs which she is getting currently with a 5am and 7pm BT bedtime. but I can't fix it. soIm following you to see if something does the trick. BTW it can get worse, last night she was up for 5 hours, I have no idea why. and sometimes she is up for the day at 4am after an 9 hr night.  ??? ??? ???
Franziska