2:1 transition with a 1 year old

[Mum2lucy]

Poor you! These babies are sent to test us aren't they?  good job we love them   

I was in quite a good place a few weeks ago with one nap and a wake up of about 6/half 6 with lg doing an 11-11.5 hour night but somehow I've lost it and now she's only doing 10-10.5 hours at night.

I fear mine may get worse as she is about to start nursery next week. I also feel like you in that nothing seems to be working. I read one of the help 2:1 posts this morning again and it says if you are in a real mess, to go to set naps and give it a week or two to stabilise? have you tried set naps?

Hopefully someone on here can give us further advice 

[jessmum46]

We got into a bit of a 2-1 mess at that age so just as a thought here's what we did that eventually helped!  (Though to be honest it was probably time more than anything....)

WU was whenever, if he woke before 6 I went in and lay on his floor which would keep him quiet, then got up for the day at 6am (no earlier).  Allowed a tiny catnap of 15-20 mins max around 9/9.30ish if he was tired - basically I timed a car trip for that time and he had the chance to doze if he needed to.  And then put down every single day for a set nap at 11.30/45 - the earlier time if no catnap or clearly exhausted.  We moved BT early for a while but then realised than in fact DS wasn't a 12h night man at all, and aiming for such actually made things worse.  We took advantage of DST one day to push BT out to 7pm which generally got us a 6am WU, sometimes a bit later.  And it did eventually settle  

It's a yucky time but just hang in there, it does come right eventually.  Honestly I do think they get to a point where *nothing* is right you know?  We can drive ourselves mad trying to fix it!  For me, set naps were great because even if we got NWs/EWs I had some predictability in the day and that for me made a rough period more manageable xx

[Mum2lucy]

Thanks for the reply.

If I do a small Cn in the morning of 10/15mins and a set nap of one pm and she has a OT nap of say 30mins and I can't get her back to sleep, what do I do with bedtime? Keep it at 7pm or bring it forward?

Today she was up at 6.20 (only later due to 3 nw imagine) and she's been for a settle at nursery and has fallen asleep on me (?!?!) at 11.20. I'm giving her 10mins and then will aim for 1pm sleep.

Edited to say: well I tried to wake her after 10mins and couldn't, she kept waking and falling asleep again so I decided to put her in her cot and she only slept 50mins and I couldn't resettle. When doing set naps do you just push through this level of tiredness until your desired time?

[jessmum46]

Ugh, that's a tough one.  I'd bring BT earlier I think, that's a tiny amount of daytime sleep and I think pushing for a late bedtime would just add to the OT build up.

I wonder perhaps if you may need to consider an earlier set nap though?  1pm is rather late in the day for a LO just starting out on the 2-1, often 11.30-12 is where many people aim to begin with.  I mean, if my LO had passed out at 11.20 I'd have just let them sleep, that's pretty much a reasonable nap time for one nap in the early stages.  Yes, with a set nap you push through the tiredness - but you do have to set your nap at a reasonable time. 

Just to illustrate that - for example you could have a 'desired' routine of one nap at 12pm for a 6 month old - but that just isn't reasonable so however much you push through the tiredness it wouldn't work.  IMHO 1pm is too late for an early-waking tired LO in transition and I think you might do better with an earlier one.  If you do need a 1pm nap I would go back to a 2 nap routine for now, allowing 30-45 mins at around 9.30am (experiment to see what works here) and then put down for the main nap around 1pm x

[Mum2lucy]

I've taken your advice and I did my nap at 12 and she was a bit upset but asleep by 12.10.

Today was:

Wu: 5.55 (stayed in room until 6.30am of ideal wu time. Went in at 5.55 checked she was ok then left. Got upset at 6.15 so then laid on her floor until 6.40)
E: bf 6.30 breakfast 7.30
A
S 9.47-9.57 (car ride to baby class)
A 10-11
E: 11
A:
S: 12.10 - 14.33 (was in cot at 11.50, left for ten mins but wouldn't settle so had to shhhh)
Bt: 19.00 sleep 19.15 (left for 10mins but was standing crying getting upset so went in and shhh)

The problem I have and I think I'd have it even if the routine was right is that my lg has learned to stand so the second she goes into her cot even if she's tired she is standing immediately. Tonight for example she was sleepy when I was bf-ing her as part of her routine so I know she is tired. I can't seem to get her to sleep without holding her pelvis down and shhhh-ing her.
I've left her to cry a little bit to see if she settles but she just gets hysterical. She can sit down as she can do it when I ask her to:

Any ideas?

[jessmum46]

If it's developmental then you just have to ride it out really, sorry that's not much help.  I did find with both of mine we had much more trouble with standing/crawling/rolling/whatever at sleep times when they were UT or OT though.  I wouldn't help too much if she knows how to do it herself - as in I personally wouldn't hold her down.  I would either tell her to sit/lie down and get her to do it, or physically lie her down from standing (so just PD rather than PUPD) if she is upset. 

That's a good day you had though   How was the night?

[Mum2lucy]

So it went:

Wu: 5.55 (stayed in room until 6.30am of ideal wu time. Went in at 5.55 checked she was ok then left. Got upset at 6.15 so then laid on her floor until 6.40)
E: bf 6.30 breakfast 7.30
A
S 9.47-9.57 (car ride to baby class)
A 10-11
E: 11
A:
S: 12.10 - 14.33 (was in cot at 11.50, left for ten mins but wouldn't settle so had to shhhh)
Bt: 19.00 sleep 19.15 (left for 10mins but was standing crying getting upset so went in and shhh)

Nw: 22.15 (up standing and laid back down, in 10mins til she calmed down)
Nw: 00.15 (up standing and laid back down, given dummy and left)

Wu: 7am!!!!!!! I couldn't believe it when I woke and it said 7am haha

Much improved wake up and about 14.5 hours sleep over the day.

Day two of set nap wasn't great though. I don't know if 12pm is late enough when she wakes later but I carried on with it.

Wu: 7
S: 12.18 - 13.53
Bt: 7pm, sleep 7.25 (she kept standing and crying, wasn't that easy to get her to sleep, had to shhhh her)

Reckon she was maybe ot by then? I maybe need to put her into bed earlier so that if I have to work to get her to sleep, least then it wouldn't be so late. Danger is that she doesn't like being put into bed when she isn't ready for it. It's hard to find that sweet spot!  I'm expecting an early wake up......

[jessmum46]

I'd think a bit OT perhaps, but tomorrow is a new day.  Some back and forth is normal   I wouldn't go changing your set nap around just yet, you really need a good week or two to bed it in before making any sort of adjustment to it.  I doubt she was UT to be honest, 5h A is a perfectly good A time for the morning for an LO in transition and I would say for quite some time after.  More likely she was still a bit OT, but stick with it

[Mum2lucy]

Hi again

I'm struggling with bedtime.

On a routine of

Wu: 6.30/7
S: 12.00/12.15 - 1.30/2

What would you suggest as a bedtime?

Currently I am aiming for her to be asleep for 7. She is going crazy at bedtime. It's screaming/yelling etc, not a mantra cry so I can't leave it. The second I leave she goes crazy but I know she is tired as she gets sleepy on her last bf at the beginning of her wind down routine. Last night it took me over an hour to get her settled. I've been doing walk in walk out but she doesn't ever really stop crying for me to leave 

[jessmum46]

Maybe try bringing it back half an hour and see if she goes down easier?  Say 6.30? 

[Mum2lucy]

Hiya,

So I went to a set nap of around 12pm (-/+ 15mins) and this was what my week looked like:

Wu: 5.55 (stayed in room until 6.30am of ideal wu time. Went in at 5.55 checked she was ok then left. Got upset at 6.15 so then laid on her floor until 6.40)
E: bf 6.30 breakfast 7.30
A
S 9.47-9.57 (car ride to baby class)
A 10-11
E: 11
A:
S: 12.10 - 14.33 (was in cot at 11.50, left for ten mins but wouldn't settle so had to shhhh)
Bt: 19.00 sleep 19.15 (left for 10mins but was standing crying getting upset so went in and shhh)

Nw: 22.15 (up standing and laid back down, in 10mins til she calmed down)
Nw: 00.15 (up standing and laid back down, given dummy and left)

Day two
Wu: 7
S: 12.18 - 13.53
Bt: 7pm, sleep 7.25 (she kept standing and crying, wasn't that easy to get her to sleep, had to shhhh her)
Nw: 12.04

Wu: 6.45
S: 12.10- 13.36
S: 16.15-16.25 (fell asleep on car joinery home)
Bt 6.40, sleep 7.35 (wouldn't settle, had to put down for the whole time)

Wu: 6.25
S: 12.05 - 13.50 (woke at 45mins, given dummy to resettle)
Bt: 6.55, sleep 7.15 (was upset, had to shhhhh)

Wu: 05.53
S: 09.52 - 10.04
S: 12.15 - 13.45 (went into cot at 11.50 and wouldn't settle without me shhh)
Bt: 6.40, sleep 6.55

Then she started nursery and it's gone horribly wrong:

Wu: 7.05
S: 12.45 - 13.35
Bt: 6.25 (straight to sleep with dummy)

Wu: 5.45
S: 12.00 - 12.40
Bt: 6.20 sleep 7pm (was screaming as she was so OT)

Wu: 6.45
S: 10.30 - 11.25
S: 17.30 - 17.50
Bt: 19.15, sleep 19.30 (went down fine)

Wu: 6.07
S: 12.25-13.10
Bt: 6.25pm

I know it's hard to say as she's just started nursery but the sleep is terrible there. She's got a cold too. The 10.30am sleep is so unlike her though but they said she was tired. They said they tried second naps but she wouldn't do it. I've asked them to try to stick to the set nap of 12ish.

I guess I just carry on trying 12ish when she isn't at nursery? She'll be so tired from the lost sleep though?

[Mum2lucy]

Today she did:

Wu: 6.25 (after a 12hr sleep)
S: 11.30 - 12.45 (woke crying but couldn't resettle)
Bt: 6.30
Nw: 19.25 (settled easily again)

She seemed knackered (rubbing eyes, upset) and has a bad cold so I didn't stick to the 12pm set nap. I can't ever seem to resettle a nap when she wakes from a nap after 40+ mins. So frustrating

[Mum2lucy]

Does anyone have any thoughts on the set nap at 12ish?

[jessmum46]

In case it helps - with the 2-1 we did a set nap (ours was a touch earlier, but on a typical 6.30 start to the day rather than 7) but if DS was tired/struggling I timed a car ride for around 9/9.30am and let him have 15 mins if he dozed off.  I still stuck to the set time +/- 15 mins though fpr the main nap and found that helped until he could consistently make it to nap time x

[Mum2lucy]

Can anyone have a look over these easys please and see if anything sticks out as to why I am getting 5am wake ups?

Wu 6.39
S 11.54 - 13.28
Bt: 18.30

Wu: 6.04
S: 9.45-10.05
S: 12.00-13.30
Bt: 18.30
Wu: 7pm on and off until 7.50pm

Wu: 6.10
S 11.50-14.20
Bt: 7pm, sleep 7.10
Nw: 20.35-20.55 screaming
Nw: 5.22 (went into check her, then left)

Wu: 6.00 (nursery day so sleep always a bit funny)
S: 10.00 - 10.15
S: 12.55- 14.00
Bt 7pm, sleep 7.10
Nw: 5.20 (she woke crying then laid awake quietly for ages didn't go in)

Wu: 7.02 (nursery day)
S: 10-10.30
S: 12.40 - 1.05
Bt: 18.25, sleep 18.30

Wu: 7.10 (nursery day)
S: 12.10- 13.20
Bt: 18.35
Nw: 20.40 (cried for 1.5 hours)
Nw: 5.13 (in to check, medicine given)

Wu: 8.30
S: 13.55- 15.20 ( I know this is off the set nap but there is no way she'd have slept at 12)
Bt: 7, 7.35 sleep (was quiet in her cot until sleep)

Wu: 6.04
S: 9.45-10
S: 12.15- 14.45
Bt: 7, quiet then cried, didn't settle until 7.40

Nw: 04.47 (as I write to you now  )

She has been teething and has the cold but everything is still quite all over the place. She is medicated as much as possible though. If she wakes at 5am ish, she has been having medication for her teeth then as well.
I've asked nursery to try to be more consistent with a 12pm nap.