Bedtime for 14.5mo

[labrodyk]

Most definitely a typo sorry, 12.50 she woke!

[creations]

Can you try for those 12hr nights to be a bit more frequent I wonder?
If she wakes roughly 7am daily, I know you are not 100% sure on the time that's okay, can you put her to bed at 6.30pm every night so that she is asleep by 7pm?  Mine couldn't really add on to his night length by sleeping later in the morning, strong body clock just woke him up at the same time each day, but he could add on to his night length at the beginning of the night.
could be worth a try.

Sorry I feel I am not helping you much. I think this is a case of her having to get used to the one nap and it is just taking time to settle down.

[labrodyk]

Hi Creations, I thought the same in regards to 6.30 BT and tried yesterday. It's SO inconsistent, I can't work out why it works one night but not the next.

Friday 10-Feb
WU: 7.00
nap: 11.55; 12.05-1.30
BT: 6.30; 7.30 asleep
^ was unhappy as soon as we got her in the bath, screamed when we went to her room and cried in my arms. Sat with her a while to calm down and when I PD she was okay but cried 20 minutes later and then chatted/made noises until 7.30.

Saturday 11-Feb
WU: 6.40
Nap: 12.00-1.28
^ nearly fell asleep in car at 11.30 and then screamed when I took to her room at home.
BT: 6.35; 7.20 asleep (fell asleep sitting up and then face planted into the mattress)

I'll keep going, thanks for all your help!

[creations]

Wow she really doesn't like BT does she?

What the whole WD routine like for BT?
I wonder if something there could be changed to help her relax.
Some people find bath at BT is over stimulating for toddlers - maybe try bath at a different time of day?
Could you dim the lights prior to going up for bed to indicate it is evening and time to begin winding down?

[labrodyk]

No, she doesn't, but she's also waking earlier Now, chatting at 6.30am this morning!

WD is currently below (although we've tried a million different things).... Give or take 1/2 an hour if EBT. We used to do bath then read and play in the lounge room but we found the screaming so bad when we went to take her to her room that we changed it. We then were reading books in her room but she would tantrum when the books were over so we removed that. She does love the bath but I have little left to do with her in the WD if we don't bath her.

Dinner at 5ish
Play and then
Milk at 6.30
Bath
Into dimly lit bedroom with white noise on
Get dressed and into sleeping bag
Prayers and a few lullabys in my arms
Close to 7pm, into cot, leave the room.

At the moment it's daylight saving so it's super bright here (and hot, we are having a 45 degree heatwave. We have air-con but our home is bright so can't really dim lights like in winter.

This was our day today...

WU: 6.30
Nap: 12.00; 12.05-12.25, dozed until 12.33 and then awake until 2pm
^ Almost asleep in the car at 11.30! Didn't like going straight to her bedroom...
BT: 6.50; 7.40 asleep
^  I removed sleeping bag because it was over 30 degrees in her bedroom and gave her pillow and a sheet. She chatted and rolled around.

[creations]

I've just scanned right through the entire thread again hoping something would jump out at me - it didn't.

What is disturbing her then?
She seems tired all morning but if she naps earlier than 12 the afternoon is too long leading to OT NWs.
She is grumpy and clingy much of the day - yes?
She is likely teething on and off to add to the mix.
She's getting approx 1hr 20 or 1hr 30 nap and approx 11 night

How are you spending the days?  Is there any activity which helps her mood?  Anything which you notice makes her mood worse, such as a busy toddler group or not getting out and about? Maybe?

[labrodyk]

Thank you Creations!

You're right on all the below. The only thing I noticed from my log is that when she started sleeping in until around 8/8.30 and I still put her down at midday, she slept 2 hours which would indicate a shorter A. But I've never been able to replicate that.

Books help her mood and swimming but that isnt something we do that regularly. I'm not in a position to go out every day so we do stay home a fair bit and I need them both to be okay with that. I also don't risk going places to avoid falling asleep in the car.

Heaps of things make his mood worse but mainly it's anything where she doesn't have my 100% undivided attention. Which everything I read is that if she can't play alone or be happy for longer than 10 seconds then she's overtired.

Tonight for example, after her bath and massage, there's no wind down. She's go go go. I was trying to hold her to hum a song and get her quiet and she won't stop talking and wriggling and fussing about stuff she can see but can't reach. I sat down in her chair and she was dozing but once I stand up she pushes her arms off me and talks and looks around. SO frustrating especially since her A to bed tonight was 6.5 hours and she took over 1/2 an hour

Monday 13-Feb
WU: 7.10
Nap: 11.00; 11.05-12.26
BT: 6.30; 7.10 asleep

[creations]

I wonder if she neds more physical activity to get her properly tired? What do you think?  I know the clinginess and grumpy mood would indicate some OT (although her routine looks pretty regular every day and she does have the opportunity to sleep longer if she needed) but sometimes toddlers need huge amounts of physical activity to really wear out their bodies to sleep well.
Could you for instance do an afternoon bath time play with lots of tubs for water play etc but in the bath as an activity?
Have you tried setting up an indoor assault course?  I used to set out a route with chairs to climb onto, crawl under, etc, and challenges such as jump 10 times whilst singing a nursery song, do frog jumps that sort of thing. I made some prompt cards so mine would roll a dice and see where he got to along the course like a life size board game.
I set up heavy work, carry canned or dried goods, or big bottles of paint from one room to another.  Amazing how  mine enjoyed lifting and carrying!  I set them up at the furthest rooms so he had to walk with the weight.

[labrodyk]

What great ideas - thank you! My other issue with AJ is that she needs constant interaction and change of scenery. She might do a game like you suggested for 5 minutes and then she's over it. My 4yo is very similar. They don''t sit or do any type of activity for very long. They run around or go on the trampoline for 10 minutes at the most and then they're done and moving on but usually Audrey just stomarts crying because she doesn't want to do it anymore.

Admittedly I probably put her down to nap because the crying and the million activities attempted in just a few short hours have worn me down and I'm tired! Gosh knows I could sleep for hours.

I'd like to do some more things with her but by the time I've worn her out, she wants to sleep in the car on the way home. She also doesn't eat much for lunch so I'm worried she might be hungry. She then wants lots of food when she wakes from nap.

[creations]

the million activities attempted in just a few short hours have worn me down and I'm tired!

I remember this.  Constantly thinking up new ways to entertain my DS and every time it being ME that was exhausted.
I would have thought your 4yo could is old enough to entertain himself for a period of time now though.  Have you seen this:
Cycle of Activity-Help Build Independent Playtime
Just reading my own post there I see my LO was roughly the same age as Audrey and the initial post by aisliing suggests starting the process at 16months to 3 years but to use the same methods for an older child.

it is hard when LO depends on you for all of their entertainment, it doesn't leave any time to just "be" and breath.

She also doesn't eat much for lunch so I'm worried she might be hungry. She then wants lots of food when she wakes from nap.

If you are giving her three meals and 2 snacks I think she can work out for herself when to eat and how much. Try not to worry about this unless there is a very clear indication of loss of appetite, constipation or other ill effects.

[labrodyk]

Thank you for the link - great reading.

My 4yo isnt great at individual play unfortunately. I have followed many of the suggestions for individial play but he is truly over it all and bored, moving on. Or it just starts with "no,  I don't want to do that"and he'll watch TV. It's not for lack of trying either, he just detests playing alone in general and it all lasts less than the time it takes us to set it up.

She did a 12hr night last night but I couldn't get her down before almost 1pm (unfortunately a hazard on Tuesdays) but she still couldn't sleep longer. Sort of good she didn't because it still took an hour at bedtime!

Tuesday 14-Feb
WU: 7.00
Nap: 12.44; 12.54-2.34
BT: 7.00; 8.00 asleep
^talking, squealing, rolling around, sitting up.
NW: 11.00 cried out

Wednesday 15-Feb
WU: 7.00 ? Not sure
Nap: 12.00; 12.15-1.15 at the latest (at a friends house)
BT: 6.30; 7.30 asleep.
^ No crying, just rolling around, squealing and talking.
Nw: 10.10 cried out a few minutes and continued ever 10 minutes.
NW: 10.20
NW: 10.30
NW: 10.40

I don't understand her at all! lol. Kids, who would have them? 😂

[creations]

I'm amazed she can just roll around and chat for an hour at BT and not be upset!

[labrodyk]

Me too.... She does suck her thumb quite rigorgously (poor thumb is quite sore atm but I think that's from teething).

She was quiet the rest of the night but awake from at most 6.50am. Her day nap was in the portacot and I thought she had 2 hours but given how quickly she fell asleep tonight I'm going to guess not.

Thursday 16-Feb
WU: 6.50 at the latest
Nap: 12.00ish - 2.00. That's when she sat up and chatted. Potentially only an hour at most.
BT: 7.00; 7.20ish asleep.

[creations]

Hmm..well only 20 min to fall to sleep at BT, that is a big improvement but a mystery. I wouldn't bet on this being a new pattern lol

[labrodyk]

No... Considerting she cried out and was unsettled and awake most of the night I'm going to bet it won't be a regular thing 😔


Thursday 16-Feb
WU: 6.50 at the latest
Nap: 12.00ish - 2.00
BT: 7.00; 7.20
NW: every 30-90 minutes all night crying out for variable amounts of time

Friday 17-Feb
WU:
Nap: 11.10; 11.20-12.00, ~12.10 woke again but went back to sleep (I think) until wide awake at 12.38.
BT: 6.18; 6.45/7.00
^ crying after a few minutes then happyish before falling asleep.