Author Topic: Tearing my hair out  (Read 635 times)

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Offline Twomagpies

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Tearing my hair out
« on: January 26, 2017, 20:54:43 pm »
We just cant seem to settle DS, whos just over 3 months. We have been super consistent for 3 weeks with a bed time routine, and sometimes, about one night in three maybe less, it works well and he settles. The rest of the time, he either goes to sleep only to wake again 20 mins later, or cant get to sleep. There has not been ANY noticeable improvement with the routine TBH.

It goes feed, bathtime, rock and cuddle a while, then down into cot, with a dummy if he'll take it. The lights are low, the door is shut, we play a bit wave sounds as white noise. We both do the same thing. If he fusses we put a hand on him, or pat on the back, but if he screams, which is the usual response we pick him up, calm him, put him back down. Then he screams, repeat. Eventually he doesnt scream and takes a dummy and we sit with him till he falls asleep, but the whole process takes 2-3 hours plus, is immensily stressful for all of us, DP and I take turns to try and avoid getting too stressed. We eat/look after our eldest in relays...
Getting him down for naps no particular problem.
Daytime is as follows
7am feed then play/get dressed etc
8.30am nap (90mins)
10am feed then play or babygroup
11-1.30pm nap (2-3 hrs)
1.30pm feed then play
3pm nap (1hr)
4.30pm feed then quiet play
5.30pm feed again then bath & bed around 6.15pm

Then wailing/crying!!! For hours
If he's still crying around 9pm i feed him again
If not he wakes around 10pm, 2am and sometimes 4.30am for feeds (and goes back down again without difficulty)


Any thoughts???




Offline ireneasheard

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Re: Tearing my hair out
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2017, 02:26:36 am »
Hi there

Just my thoughts - at 3 months old my baby was being shhh patted to sleep. I would swaddle him up and cuddle him and wind him down then put him in cot and roll him to his side and pat his leg, not his back. This seemed to work well with him. I guess I shouldn't say shhh because he didn't like the shhh so it was patting and some background music. Background music was gurgly and womb like, he seemed to appreciate it.
The routine looks okay to me. Trying to remember but I think that sounds like good awake times. I tried to go more on tired signs generally which has paid dividends as my little one has gotten older as his awake times have leaped upwards so quickly (often much more quickly than you may think). I think for us my baby was low sleep needs so I was having to cap his late afternoon nap - he was not doing more than half an hour initially but then this got shorter and shorter and he is on one sleep at 9.5 months old (this is the early side but I digress).
At this age more hands on for us worked better - just a hand was not enough. Babies need so much touch that I would not be afraid to hold your baby. I would be reluctant at this point to suggest that picking up and putting down is suitable as it can be quite disturbing. If possible try to lay your baby down in the cot asleep and then try slowly making it earlier and earlier for the put down so eventually baby is in the cot and being patted to sleep if he stirs. Don't be afraid to keep your baby up a little longer if you think he could do with a little more awake time as I found that putting baby to bed too early would also lead to resistance, so less schedule and more signs. This became more important as baby got older, I now put him to bed when I see he is looking tired.

I know this is stressful, I remember feeling how hard it was as I too have an older child, he was 4 at the time. It is hard to find time to resettle when you have another child to look after. I tried persisting with morning sleep resettling and if that didn't work focused on going out for the afternoon and taking both kids out for a walk, my eldest would ride his bike and I would have youngest in the pram. If you babe is willing perhaps you could use a carrier?

Re overnight feeds - I would try initially resettling - the patting, work on this during the day to get babe used to this and then persist at night to resettle before a feed. I found that the feeds spaced out further until there was no more feeds when I did this, they dropped off naturally on their own.

Good luck xx
DS 1: Textbook baby, February 2012. Kind and loving big brother to...
DS 2: Textbook (with a little touchy) baby, April 2016. My smallest and dearest bear.

Offline KBolton

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Re: Tearing my hair out
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2017, 06:10:39 am »
Does your LOs last nap end at 4pm? An awake time of 2h 15m could mean he is overtired. I had a similar problem and I was spending hours trying to get my LO down. We ended up adding a short cat nap in the early evening and then bath, feed and bed. If he's up at 7am, I would try and get the bed time around 7pm.

If you are getting great naps with your current sleepy time routine, I wouldn't change it.

I hope you manage to get it sorted soon!

Offline creations

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Re: Tearing my hair out
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2017, 13:01:19 pm »
Thanks to  ireneasheard and KBolton for supporting and paying it forward :)

Twomagpies - I agree with KB, that last A time looks super long.  Your LO is napping well for naps 1 and 2 - I wonder why nap 3 is shorter? Are you capping at 1hr or is LO waking naturally at 1hr for this nap?  That last nap being shorter is resulting in a 2hr 15 A time before bed which is around double what he can cope with through the rest of the day, this leads to OT, screaming and fussing at BT, inability to relax to go to sleep and screaming NWs at 20 min intervals for the first part of the night sleep.  Certainly sounds like OT at the end of the day to me.

I would look to extend that third nap and see if you can get 1.5 - 2hrs which would really help you get through those day hours and towards BT without the OT building up.
S 3.00 - 4.30
A 1hr 20 to 1hr 30
BT 6pm

Although 6pm may seem early if he can't handle longer A times yet then he will need an early bed time. Over the next month A times will likely increase and naps and BT can move a bit later, heading towards 7pm.

3pm nap (1hr)
4.30pm feed then quiet play
5.30pm feed again then bath & bed around 6.15pm
It's fine to cluster feed in the evening and feeds can often be closer than 3hrs apart at this time of day. I would expect to see a feed directly before BT here, so if there is a cluster before bath time I would put a BT feed in after bath and before sleep if you do not already have one (maybe you forgot to type it in).

The night feeds look fine to me - are you BF?  There can be increases in NF through GSs as well as one longer stretch showing up.

hope this helps


Offline Twomagpies

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Re: Tearing my hair out
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2017, 14:50:20 pm »
Thanks guys appreciate the support.
I dont think i really realised till i typed it out how long the last A time was... i think probably that is the problem and he is overtired. Will try to extend the afternoon nap i think.
No BF after bath as im trying hard not to feed to sleep. But bath is quite exciting so then i need some kind of wind down before bed really...

All seems so much more manageable in light of day compared to when it is actually going on! 😝

Offline creations

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Re: Tearing my hair out
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2017, 18:44:07 pm »
I understand you wanting to avoid feeding to sleep but the last feed really needs to be closer to BT.
 
5.30pm feed again then bath & bed around 6.15pm

Then wailing/crying!!! For hours
If he's still crying around 9pm i feed him again
I think you can avoid a lot of this crying by just feeding him, it's a very long time to go from 5.30 to 9pm especially if he is using a lot of energy in crying.

I would bring bath time earlier if possible. So:
S 3.00 - 4.30
E 4.30
A 1hr 20 to 1hr 30
bath 5.00
E 5.30/5.45
BT 6pm

If he accidentally falls to sleep whilst you are feeding you can tell him in quite a loud voice with a pleasant tone "I'm going to put you down now so you can sleep properly. Night night, call if you need me" put him down and leave him. It is unlikely that this will cause any major problem happening from time to time and if it is regularly we can look again at your routine as it may indicate he needs to sleep earlier - but do keep in mind that with a longer last nap he will not be so exhausted by BT but rather ready to sleep without OT - I always feel that telling a LO you are putting him down is helpful towards independent sleep, they often hear things in their sleep and even if he doesn't understand the words yet he will get the message.

After BT I would expect to feed every 3 hrs+ so any NWs which are 3hrs or more from the last E time I would feed.  There will likely be one longer stretch of sleep, say 4 or 5 hrs between E.  So NFs might be at 8.30, 11.30, 2.30, 5.30