Author Topic: new baby  (Read 404 times)

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Offline eva026

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new baby
« on: July 14, 2017, 21:03:33 pm »
just popped on with a question.
how much constant nursing is normal with a newborn? She's 4 days old.
Day 1-3 were on the breast most of the time but naps in between with NF every 2 h
Now on day 4 she started nursing at 1pm and hasnt stopped till 10pm. Shell drift off for 15 then in back at it again. Im wondering how I'll sleep tonight.
So is this much normal and when does it stop? my back is killing me and peeing with a nursing baby attached is not easy!





Offline eva026

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Re: new baby
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2017, 21:13:18 pm »
Just added info, its not a supply issue. I can feel the milk is constantly being produced and my breasts are filling up very quick. Im worried they will be balloons tomorrow with blocked ducts.





Offline eva026

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Re: new baby
« Reply #2 on: July 15, 2017, 07:21:37 am »
I'm in a crisis here. Really thought BF would be ok this time and we'd just have the other stuff to worry about. Dd has been nursing constantly from yesterday. At night I managed to get her down 3x for an hour each. The break between the last night feed and the morning one was 1.20h with rocking and persuading her to use a dummy. Since 6 am it has been more of the same. I made sure she got a full feed- 30 min total with 2 breaks for nappy change and a tickle to wake her. This hast helped at all, she'll drift off and then wake and start rooting again. My breasts are producing milk like crazy, dd has a good pattern of suck-suck-suck swallow so it's not supply, she's definitely swallowing something. I'm using nipple shields because my breasts are pretty big and she couldn't get enough, far enough into her mouth to not cause cracks and blisters. Right now I can't nurse without them at all because my nipples are raw, even with the shields. I'm considering expressing and giving a bottle





Offline becj86

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Re: new baby
« Reply #3 on: July 15, 2017, 10:28:23 am »
Tongue tie?
Have you tried expressing a bit so she can latch more easily?
Would you try expressing and bottle feeding? I had to early on with my supply just being too much and inverted nipples didn't help.

Offline eva026

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Re: new baby
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2017, 10:43:26 am »
She latches fine with the shields and keeps swallowing, I'm so engorged I'm spraying milk all over the place, no need to express. It's like she's using me as a dummy, refusing a normal nummy but can't sleep more than 10 min without suckling. She was fine till yesterday afternoon, regaining weight and now I don't know what's gotten into her!





Offline eva026

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Re: new baby
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2017, 10:50:11 am »
Engorged breast - cabbage leaves, ibuprofen and nursing one sided as long as possible ? Not sure I remember everything





Offline aisling

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Re: new baby
« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2017, 18:59:14 pm »
Would you consider a dummy for a short time?  DS was a fab feeder from the get go, so I had no issues with confusion and my milk supply was great.  I didn't want to be a human pacifier, so we used the dummy.  He eventually gave dummy up but he was learning much better to self soothe, but man it got me through those early days. 
The 5 S's kept me sane until I moved on to BW EASY.
Swaddle (#1)
Side or stomach position (#2)
Shush (#3)
Swing (#4)
Suck (#5)

Hugs

Offline becj86

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Re: new baby
« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2017, 23:08:08 pm »
Is she burping well? Wonder if she's feeding more often to help move gas along her system? With that much milk, its a possibility - you could try lying back a bit so gravity is on her side... http://www.biologicalnurturing.com/video/bn3clip.html

She might also be tired - DS' tired cues were rooting as if hungry.

Either way, I'd persevere with the paci, try different shapes and see if she'll take one - spacing those feeds out will help to drain the breast better as will feeding from one side as you suggested.

Engorged breast - cabbage leaves, ibuprofen and nursing one sided as long as possible ? Not sure I remember everything
Yes, these. Watch you don't drop your supply too much though. You'll want the supply soon. Expressing can give your nipples a break if she'll take a bottle.

Some info from the Aussie breastfeeding association:
https://www.breastfeeding.asn.au/breastfeeding-whats-normal_mar17

And La Leche League:
Numerous preventive strategies have been seen over the years including: restricting fluids, prenatal expression of colostrum, prenatal breast massage, postnatal breast massage, binding the breasts, or wearing a tight bra. Mothers experience less severe forms of engorgement with early frequent feedings,6 self-demand feedings,24 unlimited sucking times,25 and with babies who demonstrate correct suckling techniques.26 Short frequent feeds were shown to increase engorgement in one study,15 probably because abbreviated feeds (as short as two minutes) did not allow sufficient drainage of the breasts to prevent milk accumulation.
A technique called alternate breast massage has been shown to significantly reduce the incidence and severity of engorgement while simultaneously increasing milk intake, the fat content of the milk, and infant weight gain.27, 28, 29 Alternate massage involves massaging and compressing the breast when the baby pauses between sucking bursts. Massage alternates with the baby's sucking and is continued throughout the feeding on both breasts.
A plethora of treatment modalities for engorgement have been put forward, both anecdotally and in the literature, such as hot compresses, hot showers, soaking the breasts in a bowl of hot water, cold compresses after feedings, cold packs before feedings, ice packs, frozen bags of vegetables, both hot and cold therapy, oxytocin, proteolytic enzymes, stilbestrol, binding the breasts, manual expression, mechanical expression, no expression, lymphatic breast massage, ultrasound, frequent feedings, alternate massage, chilled cabbage leaves, room temperature cabbage leaves, and cabbage leaf extract.
Heat application in the form of hot compresses, hot showers, or hot soaks is poorly researched and has usually been more of a comfort measure to activate the milk ejection reflex, rather than a treatment for edema. Some mothers complain that heat exacerbates the engorgement, causes throbbing and an increased feeling of fullness.20
Cold therapy, including cold applications in the form of ice packs, gel packs, frozen bags of vegetables, frozen wet towels, etc. , has been studied under various conditions. Cold application triggers a cycle of vasoconstriction during the first 9 to 16 minutes where blood flow is reduced, local edema decreases, and lymphatic drainage is enhanced.30 This is followed by a deep tissue vasodilation phase lasting 4 to 6 minutes that prevents thermal injury.31 Robson20 discusses that application of cold for 20 minutes would have a minimal vasoconstriction effect in the deeper breast tissue and that venous and lymphatic drainage would be enhanced in the deeper tissues due to the accelerated circulation to and from the superficial tissues. Sandberg32 reports on the application of cold packs for 20 minutes before each feeding on a small sample of women. Mothers reported increased comfort compared to heat, decreased chest circumference, and no adverse affect on milk ejection or milk transfer.
Thermal (continuous) ultrasound treatment of engorged breasts has not been shown to improve pain or edema.21
Lymphatic breast drainage therapy is a gentle massage of the lymphatic drainage channels in the breast. Lymphatic drainage is thought to improve the movement of the stagnated fluid, reduce edema, and improve cellular function.33, 34 Wilson-Clay35 reports the relief of discomfort and better subsequent milk yields during pumping following manual lymphatic drainage therapy in three women with unrelieved severe engorgement.
Chilled cabbage leaves. Rosier36 anecdotally describes the use of chilled cabbage leaves applied to engorged breasts and changed every two hours in a small sample of women as having a rapid effect on reducing edema and increasing milk flow. Nikodem et al.37 showed a non-significant trend in reduced engorgement in mothers using cabbage leaves. Roberts38 compared chilled cabbage leaves and gelpaks and found similar significant reduction in pain with both methods, with two-thirds of the mothers preferring the cabbage due to a stronger, more immediate effect. Roberts et al.39 studied the use of cabbage extract cream applied to the breasts which had no more effect than the placebo cream.
Expressing milk. Refraining from expressing milk because the mother will "just make more milk "cannot be justified. Hand expressing or pumping to comfort reduces the buildup of FIL, decreases the mechanical stress on the alveoli preventing the cell death process, prevents blood circulation changes, alleviates the impedence to lymph and fluid drainage, decreases the risk of mastitis and compromised milk production, and gives relief to the mother. It is not known what degree of engorgement or duration of milk stasis presents a situation from which milk production may not recover. The milk production in the alveoli not experiencing engorgement continues normally. The breast is capable of compensating to a point. Future research would delineate this further.
http://www.lalecheleague.org/ba/nov00.html

Offline aisling

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Re: new baby
« Reply #8 on: July 16, 2017, 00:35:24 am »
Ds didn't like the slippery silicon dummies. He liked the more real skin like textured ones. Do you baby wear like with a sling?

Offline eva026

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Re: new baby
« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2017, 05:38:36 am »
things are looking up a bit. I'm doing the breast compressions and massage while she feeds and I think she's getting more in. We managed to increase time between feeds too. Fist night was up to 1h, last night I even got in 2 stretches of 2 hours - I honesly never thought I'd be so grateful for 2h sleep in a row! During the day she's also either hanging off the breast or sleeping... I'm sending DH off to get more different types of dummies today. I really dont want to nurse to sleep but nothing else works at the moment and I'm desperate. I'm probably going to regret this later :(
I have a hard area in my right breast which I managed to push through yesterday but it comes back every time the breast is full and the area is still a bit tingly and sore. Keep applying heat and massaging out while she feeds or could it just be swollen and sore for being blocked before?
My nipples are another story, totally skinned:( I'm using lanolin cream, nipple shields but at this rate of feeding I don't see how things will heal? Her latch looks Ok to me, lips out, gripping some of the areola too. Not sure if it's from the damage from before I used the shields that just doesn't get a chance to heal or if sth is still off. I'm getting the local midwife in this week to see. Very reluctant to introduce a bottle so early on, we had massive issues with DD1 because of that, tons of nursing strikes.






Offline aisling

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Re: new baby
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2017, 15:01:57 pm »
Hope DH finds a dummy that she will take and let your boobs heal a bit.  hugs.

Offline *Ali*

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Re: new baby
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2017, 22:28:31 pm »
You might consider cup or spoon feeding if you choose to express and don't want to risk a bottle preference.

I'd definitely get some IRL help from a qualified LC and ask for baby to be checked for TT.



Offline eva026

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Re: new baby
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2017, 10:30:36 am »
Going in to see LC today. Will see what she says.





Offline mulvia

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Re: new baby
« Reply #13 on: July 25, 2017, 21:00:16 pm »
Hi there and big hugs! Sounds like my LO (3 days old) is taking after yours  ;)  :o - I do have one piece of advice from first DS and that's those silver nipple cups if you're still having problems. They worked wonders for me. A bit expensive and not so subtle under thin clothes but for your nipples' sake it's worth a try. Good luck!

Offline eva026

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Re: new baby
« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2017, 17:09:16 pm »
Wow, that would have been amazing! I was in so much pain for days, anything touching would hurt like crazy, to the point it was waking me up at night.
Thankfully I'm all healed up now. Still a bit raw because LO has a crazy strong latch but I think we are on the right track.
I saw the LC and she said DDs latch is fine for now but she'll have to grow into my breast size for it to improve...
I'm trying to take one day at a time and feed on demand, will worry about EASY later. It means she's either BF or sleeping, still can't get her to take a dummy.
Nights are ok, she goes 4h once, then wakes every 2 - 100 times better than she was last week!