Author Topic: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all  (Read 486 times)

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Offline AshGop

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Hi there I really need some advice please... my bubs  is 5 and half weeks old and am trying to work on easy 3 hour routine although his A time is prob about an hour I think (although sometimes ends up being ,longer due to feeding taking time along with winding and nappy changes), and Iím trying to look out for tired cues but donít seem to know what they are or if he is even showing any ...
When he has finished feeding I do a few minutes of A time and wind down... I walk with him calmly and /or sing lullaby and when he is calm I swaddle him ... then I hold him a few more minutes to help him drift off.. then as he starts to closes his eyes I put him in cot and keep pressure on his arms and legs as he often then Starts to wriggle so that helps him to stay calm but at this point he often opens his wide again and the can take another 20/30 minutes before he will start to drift off again.
Once he does go down he will often wake within 10 to 50 minutes.... heís only had a few naps where he has slept through for hour and half. Sometimes when he wakes we are able to calm him back to sleep but again this can take 10/20 minutes.

What am I doing wrong???? Or is this just how it will be for now given his age? ( also should add I am breast feeding only)

How do I spot the tired cues?

Is he over tired or under tired? I suspect over tired given his age and how long feeding takes but sometimes his feed is over in about 40 minutes so then I start the wind down shortly after to see if that helps in getting him down quicker after his initial wake time but me often have this same problem of taking long time to get him down and then actually get him to stay down.

Please can someone give me some advice - am feeling very stressed about this as until now Iíve had help but from tomorrow my hubby is back at work and he works long hours so I will need to do all the nap times ...
« Last Edit: July 11, 2019, 09:27:28 am by AshGop »

Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap
« Reply #1 on: July 09, 2019, 16:36:09 pm »
Any advice at all would really be much appreciated!!

Iíve also started shh pat , only since yesterday but already feels like a lot longer since Iím doing every nap and my back is really feeling it!!

I am following the 4s ritual, i take bubs upstairs calmly and so nappy change if needed, swaddle, and then sit for about 5 mins until he is calm and glassy eyed... the I lay him down in cot. Only once had he been calm so have let the room but then he started crying after about 10 mins of being awake so then Started shh pat. All other times he pretty much fussed straight away so,I start shh pat in cot. Usually have to pick him up once or twice with shh pat. On average it then takes about 20 mins of shh pat before he will sleep and I then stay another 5 mins or so after his eyes are closed and slowly taper off the shh pat. But more often than not he will wake within 30 mins and sometimes I can shh pat back to sleep (but again this can take up to 20 mins or more) and sometimes he just wonít go back to sleep.

I some questions and really hope some one can explain this to me

Tracy says it takes 20 mins to go through the 3 stages of sleep (window, the zone and then letting go) but then she also says you need to spend 20 mins with shh pat. So then is the full sleep ritual supposed to take at least 40 mins? 20 mins before you even put them in cot and then 20 mins to shh pat ?

Sometimes he wakes after 15 mins - what could be causing this?

I really want this to work and will persevere but really need some guidance! And to know that eventually he will be able to sleep without 40 mins to an hour of trying to put him to sleep!!

Every nap today he has woken within 15-30 mins and Iíve spent longer trying to put him to sleep than he has actually slept 😟😟😟😟

Please can someone come back to me? Would really appreciate it.


Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2019, 09:50:39 am »
Also, if he wakes after Iíve calmed him and put him down in cot , but then he starts crying and i go in for shush pat should I leave the room again once he is calm but awake ? Or is this when I need to stay for 20 minutes after he has closed his eyes? Tracy mentions waiting until he has melted into the crib....?

Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap
« Reply #3 on: July 10, 2019, 10:33:45 am »
Please help Iím feeling really depressed.... itís on,y day 3 of shh pat and Iíve been trying to get bubs to nap since 1008 this morning .. did the usual 4s routine .. out incot awake but sleepy after about 35 mins ... started crying after 5-10 mins so went in for shush pat .. got him down in 10 mins .. the he woke again after 20 mins ... tried sh oat again but itís not working and. Ow Iíve had to leave him to cry as I havenít been able to eat anything between feeding him and trying to get him to nap and now I just feel so rubbish and guilty ... please help 😫😫😫😫😫😫😫😫😫😫😫 how to do I get hi to sleep more than 20 mins esp after Iíve taken almost 40-50 mins getting him down in the first place.????.

Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2019, 15:23:01 pm »
Is there anyone at all who can come back to me please?? Itís day 4 of shh pat and still no real progress,
Iíve started taking bubs up at about 50 minutes after he has last woken up, to start wind down to see if that will help and I feel he starts to get glassy eyed quicker and calmer so I can put in cot but then last 2 naps he woke up after 35 minutes and at next nap after 25 minutes..... so still wonít sleep very long ....

As the day goes on he has longer awake times as Iím spending so much time trying to resettle him and then give up and do another feed so when we get to next nap itís over an hour of awake time as he takes atleast 30 to 40 mins to feed as need to spend time burping him in between and usually nappy change in between or as part of activity before wind down.

I donít have any help and am just feeling so deflated and like Iím failing because I donít seem to be able to read. My babies cues and canít help him sleep....

Can someone please help with any advice?

Offline Katet

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2019, 21:58:06 pm »

As a BTDT with a 30min napper, I wish I knew about the below link then. Tresillian is where my DH works and I volunteer, it is linked with hospitals in my State (and branches in China) It updated all its information based on current research and global best practices and it makes some of the BW information outdated and not totally correct. Tresillian take into account that there is no one size fits all and that the first 3 months are a connection stage and many babies sleep poorly in a 'lonely' bed. Have a read.

https://www.tresillian.org.au/advice-tips/settling/0-3-months/

Anyway from a BTDT, my second child had a unique routine to fit around his brother and that meant very few naps at home... He's definitely not a 'broken' teen because of it.
So my advice would be, he won't sleep, go out and explore the world, it's so much nicer having a not sleeping baby out and about than it is in tears at home.
Also blink and he will be starting school and stopped napping anyway.

Finally if all that feels too hard, consider if you aren't one of the one in five with PPD... It's very real and I know knowing I had a reason for getting stressed when my baby wasn't like clockwork, and getting help was a great change in my parenting journey.




dc1 July 03, dc2 May 05

Offline Aimi

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2019, 19:34:29 pm »
Would you consider letting your baby nap in a sling or wrap? My DD2 did for the first 3 and a half months of her life and it meant I could get around to do things (like eat) and she was so calm there. I fed to sleep at bedtime cause that was the only thing that worked and slept with her beside me in my bed. I sleeptrained her at 3,5 months without problems (it took a week) and she now sleeps independently in her cot both nights and naps. My point is that you can do whatever works in the beginning and still get to where you want to be later. What do you think?

Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2019, 08:17:49 am »
Hi katet, thank you for coming back to me, the link below has been good to read. But are you saying the easy routine and shh pat etc is now outdated? Or just not right for young babies?
What does btdt stand for?

Yes Iíve been conscious of ppd but I donít think this is whatís happening, it was more that with each day this week things seemed to worse rather than see any improvement or even just stay the same and so I was checking regularly for updates and replies on this board as I really just needed some guidance or tips or some advice, and probably just some encouragement.

Aimi, thanks for your reply also. Yes I have thought about the sling for the short term but I have had quite a fe back problems so itís not going to be feasible at the moment unfortunately .
When you say you sleep trained at 3.5 months did you use the bw method ie easy routine and shh pat etc? Would be interested to know what you did for that week.


Offline Aimi

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2019, 10:38:40 am »
Yes I followed bw when sleeptraining. I did shhpat to get her to sleep and held through the jolts to extend naps. Only needed to do shhpat a few days but it took a week before she connected sleepcycles by herself.

Sorry about your back. I think any forms of accidental parenting this early is fine and easy to wean later. If it is feeding to sleep and letting them nap on you or whatever.

Offline Katet

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2019, 10:57:38 am »
BTDT stands for been there done that.
Easy and shpat aren't outdated as easy is about the pattern of eat, activity sleep, you. But the idea that babies need/should fit to set times of awake times or lengths of sleep to a clock is not considered best practice especially if breast fed. Essentially there is evidence that cuddling a baby to sleep in the early months helps with mental health and connection and babies only sleeping for short cycles shouldn't be seen a a problem... It's actually considered normal in Pacific Islander families to have babies who sleep 20mons at a time in part because their culture is more like how babies were before the industrial revolution in western culture. 
dc1 July 03, dc2 May 05

Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2019, 12:07:04 pm »
Thank you both, really appreciated your responses and advice... am trying to just go with the flow a little more .. still following easy pattern but not watching the clock .. have put down bubs twice today for naps by going pretty much straight up after feed as this tends to last 40 to 50 mins including winding and nappy change and as soon as he started fussing to see if that would work for naps and first nap was 45 mins and he is just coming up to 45 mins for his current nap!! I did keel the room very dark however ... usually I would leave a little light as I thought this may create bad habits later on so wondering if the dark room plus swaddle and then just holding him, soothing him TIL he drops off has worked... still putting in cot when he is drowsy and then he does wake a bit in cot so spending up to 20 mins calming with gentle shh pat or keeping hand on him and the leaving room once he is compel the calm and drowsy or completely asleep!
Am hoping this is the start of slightly better naps!!

Offline Aimi

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2019, 16:58:08 pm »
That's great! Hope you feel a bit better about the whole thing now. Fingers crossed it continues to go well!

Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2019, 19:11:29 pm »
Thanks aimi unfortunately it just seemed to last one day and today we are back to hardly any sleep in the day 🙁 has no idea whatís happening as Iíve been doing the same..... any thoughts?

Offline Aimi

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2019, 19:42:30 pm »
Sorry to hear that. Can you write your EASY for the last day? I 'm really no expert but I can have a look and maybe someone else will aswell.

Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #14 on: July 15, 2019, 08:50:04 am »
Ill try...!

Saturday
E 630am
WU 845
E 9am
A upstairs at 950am, wind down
S in cot by 10am.
Woke at 1045, tried to settle but wouldnít go down.
E 11am
A 1150 - nappy change, wind down and swaddle
S 12pm ish.
Woke at 1245 and was able to settle after 15 to 20 minutes and back to sleep
E 2pm/230pm (canít quite remember)
Canít remember the timings after this feed
S 650pm
E 9pm ish but at this point I was having to call docs as Iíve had issues with my c section wound
BT 1030ish.

Sunday
E 230am ish
S 3am ish
E 7am
S 745am ish
Then had to pump as had to go hops so wanted to leave some milk just in case
E 945am (didnít give expressed as he started asleep until I got back)
Then fro here it just went down hill.... after feeding I took him up after 50 mins or so for nappy change and wind down but he just wouldnít sleep , would drop off but then wake up within minutes of being in cot.
Felt like the whole day was like this...

Will try to post todayís easy when I can but if thereís anything you can get from this that would be great !

Offline Aimi

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2019, 10:19:25 am »
I had pretty much the same problem with my DD2 at that age, and I had the same A-time as you which is appropriate oaccording to the average a-times. What I've learned about her now that she's 5,5 months is she needs a bit more than average. If I could go back I would try to extend her A-time with 5-10 minutes and see what happens. For us extending a in the morning meant she didn't fight the last nap, I don't really know how it works but not enough a has always been the problem for us, I didn't know at first since she was in the average to high range. Is it something you would want to try?

The other thing that seem to help her go to sleep or calm down when she was crying was white noise. We just tried a free app on the phone and have been using it ever since but bought a sound machine now. We kept the bedroom dark and covered her eyes in the wrap which really helped too. But the most important thing was to get the a-time right. 

Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2019, 11:53:40 am »
Hi aimi I actually was thinking the same re a time as yesterday when I was trying to wind him down he still seemed quite wide eyes and alert so have tried today to take him up after an hour and then start wind down so this is my day so far...

Monday
E 610am
S 655am
Nursery run fir daughter so transferred to buggy at 8am , in and out of sleep
E 850am wake n feed ,
A 940 am
950 upstairs , nappy change
S 1030 (957am swaddled n winding down , was drowsy so put in cot 1010 but then more awake.. hav left in cot n now has hiccups  , 1015 fussing while I lay in bed beside him
Picked up as crying n hiccups waking him.. calm in arms 1021 and eyes closed half , gently rocking
1025 placed in cot eyes closed, kept hand on chest TIL 1030 .. in this time eyes open close )
Woke 11am .. tried to settle .. back in cot 1117 eyes closed.. then immediately started  crying fully trying to resettle in cot but just wonít calm ..
taken downstairs so I can eat a little
E 1135
Straight up at 1225 as already been up before feed so didnít want to add extra A time.
Swaddled and was dropping off straight away. Put in cot and within a minute eyes open and fussing .. I donít get it?? Is he overtired now? Fighting sleep?

Calm at 1236, but awake so have left room
Fussing 1240, 1242 calming in my arms, placed on bed and eyes dropping , placed back on cot calm but awake and left room 1245. Itís now 1253 and he is still awake but calm.

Any thoughts?

Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2019, 13:10:18 pm »
Just to add after leaving him in cot awake and calm at 1245 he started crying around 105 , it was a dirty nappy so changed and reswaddled , back in cot at 115, but crying at 118 so walked him about , eyes closed and in cot by 121pm.
Woke up just after 2pm , tried to settle back down but no luck after 10 mins.

Offline Aimi

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2019, 14:36:20 pm »
Sorry no thoughts on that. I got the advise to try a new a time for 3 days before seeing progress or not, it's hard to evaluate immediatly since there are so many things affecting sleep in a day. Of course it could be something else entirely or something that you might not be able to fix.. 🙄

Offline AshGop

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Re: Please help!! 5 week old takes up to hour to nap/not napping at all
« Reply #19 on: July 15, 2019, 18:34:14 pm »
Ok thanks for coming back to me .. will try to keep going..
Hereís the rest of the afternoon in case any one does have any advice...

Woke 2ish, tried to settle back down but no luck,
E 221pm to 255pm
A until 340pm, altho tried to put him to sleep downstairs , but was wide awake. Took him up when fussing and he dropped off straight away, put in cot but woke 25 mins later.
Tried to resettle, fell asleep in arms , but woke again when placed in cot. Given up and feeding again (not even sure if cries are fir hunger or tiredness??)
E 440pm
S 540pm but crying in cot , trying to settle. Itís now 6 pm and hubby trying to settle.
S. 610pm
A 650pm..tried to settle , slept a few more minutes
E 730pm