Any March & April 05 mums/moms want to chat?

[kq]

Hi Judy, another night with 4 am waking and I read the passage on Wake to Sleep and decided I should not let it go longer than 3 nights so it does not become entrenched! Will wake myself up at 3 am tonight and try and will do so over the weekend. Will let you know how it works/ or not.
I am going to browse the Sleep forum to see if anyone has had success and what they did. Will keep you all posted.
Karen

[Jayri]

Just wondering, can someone quickly let me know about wake to sleep, I have leant my book out at the moment. I can hardly believe how reliant I am on it as well as this website.
I tried a df last night, to heck with it, the night b4, Riley went from 7:30, woke to eat at 2:30 which took maybe 15mins and then up at 7am. Last night when I df she woke at 4, 6 and 7.
Well must dash, just wanted to check in.
Take care, so good to hear how everyone is doing.
Oh, thanks for replying to my request for HOLLYNHARVIE.  

[Erin M]

The deal with wake to sleep as far as I know is you go in to your baby a half hour or so before their usual awake time (it only works with babies who wake up at about the same time every night).  Then you stroke their cheeks, forehead, whatever will get them out of the real deep stage of sleep into a lighter one (without necessarily waking them up).  When I tried it with Katie to try to get past 45 minute naps, I would wait until her eyelids fluttered a bit.  Then, you put your hand on their tummies, pat, whatever gets them back into that deep stage of sleep.  The idea is it interrupts their sleep cycle a bit so when the time for their usual awakening comes, they are in a different stage of sleep and won't awake.  After 3 or so nights of this, then you stop waking them up and they won't wake themselves up.

That's the general idea, I have to dig up the book and get the whole story.

HTH,
Erin

[Little Bear's Mum]

Naomi, I can't help with w2s but fyi I had the same problem with d/f. I found my ds woke more with it. I dropped it after trying for 3 weeks and he's been fine since. Went back to only waking once for a feed between his bedtime of 7pm - 6amish.

I have noticed since leaving him unwrapped for the last three nights though, his wake up to feed time has gone from 3-4am to between 1-2am. Very strange and he seems hungrier. I need to give him both sides.

Has anyone else experienced this once they unwrapped?

Does the time they wake for their middle of the night feed relate in anyway to when they will drop it? Because he used to last until between 3-4am I had hopes that might just stretch out until he didn't wake at all. But now that he's waking between 1-2am what's the chances of him not needing it all of a sudden? Does he need to start waking later and later again before it will eventually drop?

I know every baby is different, but has anyone experienced this before and what happened?

[Nikki~Nathan&Danielle]

Naomi, we had similar issues with the DF hence me no longer doing it and I just have to roll with it.

Little bears mum, with Nathan, he was textbook in the sense that he took the DF then slept through till 4am and then that just gradually pushed out till 7am over 5wks.  But, with Danielle she's so much more unpredictable - I assumed she'd stretch her wake up out too, but not a chance - the times she did sleep right through it was sudden and then just as sudden back in the other direction.  Unswaddling may have cause him to stir and be more aware of it hence the earlier waking, but I think you need to go through that at some stage - there will always be developmental disturbances to sleep, so if you were already waking once anyway, I'd just go with it or pat him back to sleep if you want to.  Did he sleep right through till morning anyway?

[Jayri]

Just had to pop on and say hi and welcome to andrea!, I didn't do that yet.
Is it me or are our days becoming more and more frazzled as our lo's grow.
This stage is new to me as with Jayson at this age I was already back at work :roll:
I think with Riley I am simply winging it at night time, no one is the same. She did however go through a few night wakings a couple of weeks ago, it is probably due to her new found freedom of movement, she loves her belly, but gets incredibly mad when she can't get off of it when she wakes.
I have a child free night friday, not quite sure how to feel about it or what I will do, MIL and DH decided I need a break. Aww someone does think of me every now and then :wink:  :wink:

[Little Bear's Mum]

Nikki - yes he did then sleep until about 6.30am, so that was great. I'm fine with the earlier waking as he actually feeds better now when he wakes for the day.

Interesting development.... I just went to Plunket (for non-NZ'ers it's like a wellchild provider/nurse who checks the baby for development, growth, answers mum's questions etc), and I was talking to her about his short 40 mins naps again since unwrapping. Her advice was to keep him up heaps longer than I am. She said at 5 months he should be down to 2 bigger naps in a day, which is basically what he was nearly doing before I started unwrapping.

He wakes now about 6.30am, so she said keep him up until about 9.30am. Then hopefully he'll sleep for about 2 hours, then once he wakes keep him up again until about 2.30pm. Then down for about another 1.5h.

I questioned what I do when he gets tired, and grizzly and she said he'll get his second wind and be fine. Also to feed him before he goes to sleep again so he's full. Not feed to sleep though.

So it's kind of conflicting with BW routines, especially the feeding bit, but she said it will become it's own routine.

Also, I found he hasn't been getting nearly enough to b/milk. Being totally fed from me, not even the bottle I've never known how much he's taking. We weighed him then I fed and then weighed him again. He took one side and was weighing that he took 100mls. So he needs to have 2 sides per feed. He had only been 2 hours since the last feed, so he wouldn't have wanted the full amount. She also said he may only take one side, then need a 15 min break before the other. Wow, totally different to what I've been doing. The poor little fella has probably been really hungry as I've only been giving him the one side and offering the second and if he doesn't take it straight away not been offering it again. How bad do I feel? !!!!!!! His grizzling is probably because he's been hungry.

Well, I"m going to try her idea with keeping him up heaps longer and see what happens. Hey, what have I got to lose? A few days of a grizzly baby until he settles into it, or 40 min naps forever!

I'll keep you posted and let you know how I go.

Oh dear, he's just woken.... 40 mins wouldn't you know it.

[Nikki~Nathan&Danielle]

Little bears mum - I'm really weary of Plunket advice myself, I've gotten so much conflicting advice.  I dont know if you really want to get in the habit of feeding before a nap even if he isn't falling asleep while doing it, he may get used to needing a full tummy to sleep well and therefore if he stirs in the night he might start wanting a top up - dunno, you've done so well so far and I think this way will also pan out - we're going through quite a developmental stage at the moment at 5mths as it is with the intro of solids soon etc.  Also, 3hrs sounds a really long activity time in the morning at this age - of course, you know your baby best, and if you want to stretch it out, best to do it in short increments rather than going cold turkey on it.

Sorry to be a downer on Plunket, but they also advise on CIO for newborn babies!!  :cry:

[kq]

Am with Nikki on this one. When they saw me at 8 weeks, they advocated formula to get him sleeping through the night even though I made it clear I wanted to exclusively BF. At 12 weeks, they advocated CIO to get Sam to sleep through the night... They are so conflicting and I think should be taken with a grain of salt. However, like Nikki said, you know your baby best!
Karen

[Little Bear's Mum]

Oh I agree with you mums so badly, but I guess I'm going crazy with this 40 min napping again. He's onto his 4th nap already today! It's amazing cos he's going down without a whimper now that he's unwrapped.

I do wonder if he could be kept up longer than he is now, but maybe not just quite the 3 hours. I think sometimes I imagine the sleepy signs because the clock says he should be tired. I know BW says initially we're meant to clock watch but that's just to give us an idea when extending awake times, then after that to go by their cues. Well I clock watch to the minute instead of cues, unless they're extreme. And when I think about it, he's not really that grizzly at 2hours.

I guess I got so excited thinking the Plunket way would solve his problems I forgot about the BW techniques. And the feeding thing I didn't agree with or understand how he would feed so often anyway. Maybe I'll have a think about it between now and tomorrow and work out what the compromise is. Although the night waking and big feed is probably because he's not getting enough during the day. Hopefully now I know I have to feed him both sides to get a full feed then that will solve that problem.

It wouldn't have worked first thing tomorrow as we're off to see a homeopath for his reflux at 10am, so he'd be asleep by then if I was trying plunket's way.  :lol: There goes that idea!

Oh this is sooooo hard sometimes..... there's just too many different ideas and ways to do things, and I like to find out about all of them. Which makes it confusing when ideas are conflicting. Humpppphhhh. :cry:

[Arwyn's mom]

I'm reading about this discussion on wake to sleep with great interest. I don't have BWSAYP yet... it is not in the library and the bookstore is out so I need to order it online.

Arwyn gets up every night at approximately 4 am. It stopped briefly... for two days (if I recall correctly). Then she started doing it again. She wants to be fed at this time (or I think she wants to be fed) and it does not normally affect her morning feed. This morning it did... she was not hungry at all, just ate kind of half-heartedly for 5 minutes. I guess I'll try wake to sleep tonight. It can't be worse than already getting up at 4 am?

Nikki... you said Nathan just kind of stretched it out to 7 am... was it then a gradual shifting of his wake time until 7 am? or did he just drop his 4 am on his own?

Should I be trying to "fix" this waking? I mean, I already feel pretty fortunate to have her waking only once now (compared to her 3 times a night before).

Little Bear's mum -- I extended Arwyn's awake time to 2 hrs. in the morning and she slept for 1h 20m on her own. I'm going to try it again this morning. I am weary of the 45 minute naps. Yesterday, I put her down after 2h 30m for nap #2 and she kept falling asleep, waking, falling asleep and waking for 45 min until she was down for 45 minutes of actual sleep.

Can I consider this part of her nap?? UGH! I feel so neurotic... counting minutes for her nap.

I guess I have been feeling pretty weird & awkward about it all. I can't explain it... just a sad, maybe frustrated, feeling about what I am doing. I look at non-BW parents who haul their children anywhere, anytime and feel like I am being a "party-pooper" somehow. I have to be home before 7 so I can put her to sleep; I have to be somewhere where she can have a proper nap at certain times of the day; if she doesn't get enough "nap time" I have to get home by 3:30 so that I can put her down properly at 4 so that I can squeeze in those additional minutes of sleep before her nighttime sleep. Is this normal? I mean... I think this may be a phase... I didn't feel so discouraged before. On top of this, I am scared to death of starting solid foods for fear that it will affect her sleep!!! Stupid or what?

Whew, that felt good... I needed to vent. Anybody having similar "awkward" feelings?

[Arwyn's mom]

OMG ladies... only 32 minutes for nap #1 today. Tried for 30 minutes to put her back down. Gave up due to possible impending hearing loss due to screaming baby.

Need some support please... :cry:

[herbst99]

Hi Ladies ...
Little bears mom I agree with the rest on that 3hrs is probably to long for your little one to be awake at a stretch ... I don't know if any of you know about sensory issues and how it affects our baby's state. Most of us adults are able to filter out sensory input (touch, smell, sight, hearing, taste, movement, body position) but babies don't have that ability and become "overstimulated" quite easily. Even though your baby might get his second wind, his brain is soooo overloaded that if he sleeps it will probably not be a restfull or long sleep (think of yourself if you had lots to do during the day and lots of new information - many times you wake up in the night and be "solving" the problems of the day) The appropriate awake times for a baby between 3-6 months is 1.5 to 2 hours. After this time you will see baby display "fussy" signals (rubbing eyes, ears, not making eye contact, arching back etc) This is an indication that he is probably getting overstimulated.
As someone else had said - only YOU know your baby!!
The peadiatrician gave me good advice - Decide WHO you believe when it comes to advise. Your mother, friend, clinic sister etc and STICK with that otherwise you will be second guesing yourself all the time!!(To many cooks spoil the broth!!) GOOD LUCK!!

Whew, that felt good... I needed to vent. Anybody having similar "awkward" feelings?

All the time!! What I have decided to do is to just accept that I will for the first year of my baby's life HAVE to do what is best for BABY and not me. I have also decided not to PLAN anything that HAS TO HAPPEN ... I have to accept that Lise will let me know in the morning if we can maybe stray from the routine for the day or if this will have to be STRICT day!!
Have to go DH wants to be on net!
Bye

[kq]

Hi all,
Sorry but did not try wake-to-sleep last night as dh is working the weekend and thought we should try on Sunday night as "there is potential for huge disaster" :wink: . Anyway, was all set to wake up at 4 am to re-settle Sam but what do you know, not a peep till 6 am this morning. We had a little cry at 11.30 pm as the one swaddled arm had escaped. The only difference was that I swaddled both arms as he was so upset. As soon as he was swaddled, it was as if someone turned a switch off and he was out again. Took me 5 minutes.
Little Bear's mum-have you gone cold turkey and unwrapped both arms? I found when I did that, the 45 minute naps returned with a vengence. I swaddled 1 arm and we were fine for a while but short naps are back again and I think it is time for extending awake time.
Judy-thanks for the tip on extending awake time. Sam gets sooo grizzly when it hits the 2 hour mark but will try and wait for 1st yawn.
Arwyn's mum-I am similarly obsessed with naps, have always been... :oops: I count the minutes and subtract the minutes I had to re-settle him with shush/pat and he was crying then add the 5 minutes he was asleep in the car seat.....it is ridiculous, I know!

Anyone else notice they don't always get emails that there's been updates to this thread?

I have found that I get an e-mail and when I check the thread, 2 pages has been added! Maybe because this is such a busy thread...
Anyway, am armed with newfound optimism re: extending naps!
Have an awesome weekend all.
Judy-big HUGS and I hope you get some sleep!
Karen

[Arwyn's mom]

Well ladies, it is now 4 pm in my neck of the woods.

Arwyn has had a grand total of 46 minutes of daytime sleep. No, that is not one nap, that is two naps total. 32 min the first time, 14 min the next. Didn't even try the second time as she put herself back to sleep just in time for mommy to drop her cellphone right next to her head on the hardwood floor.  :roll:  :roll:  :roll:

We are now trying for the 3rd time to go down for a nap... she has been cranky all afternoon (gee, could it be the no nap thing?) Doesn't she realize yet that "mommy knows best"?  :wink:  I keep telling her she needs more sleep. 

I've tried to roll with the punches today... kept the feeding schedule the same... she is fine with that but doesn't seem to be that interested in eating either. I don't know what's wrong or different about today than any other day. Guess she doesn't really need a reason -- it's just me who is looking for one. 

I also don't receive the email notifications regularly. I come and check myself now. I think that you must use the link that is provided in order for more emails to come. I'm not sure but JMO.