Any March & April 05 mums/moms want to chat?

[Colesmom]

thanks for the good wishes regarding my father.  I can simply hope for the best, that he makes it through his heart surgery and that maybe, just maybe that will be his final wake up call.

Now, back to the babes!  Regarding wake to sleep. I was going to see if cole started sleeping through once we started solids this weekend but since he likely won't take much at first I've decided i must try wake to sleep again.  He wakes at 1:30 or so to feed.  Sometimes later.  And he wakes at 5:30.  Now, is this really an early wake up since he goes to bed at 6:00?  I think it might be pretty normal.  My Q is, do I do WTS for both times tonight?  Or should I be more realistic and just work on the 1:30 one?

Thanks

[Colesmom]

me again. I just wanted to post to say I can't believe how important clock time is becoming with Cole.  I used to think he had to be up 2.5 hours for last A before he would settle.  I think it might be the case if he's overtired and that's just when he'll shut down...but if I don't let him get overtired then he goes to sleep at 6:00.

Catnap ended at 4:05 today when I woke him up after an hour.  So he wasn't even up two hours and he simply babbled for 2 minutes and went to sleep! 

tomorrow i'm going to aim for nap 1 8:30-9:30, nap 2 11:30-12:45, nap 3 3:15-4:00, bed at 6...we'll see how it goes.

okay, i'll likely be back later to see how you're all doing.

Traci

[FrasersMum]

Hi Everyone

Traci - just a quick question - with a 6pm bedtime what time does Cole get up in the morning?  I have read Weissbluth and I understand the prinicple but I'm curious to know how it actually works??

Thanks!
Jo

[Colesmom]

Judy/Jo

Judy, I think the principle Jo is referring to is watching the clock at this age as much as their sleepy cues.  At least...that's what i think you were referring to Jo??

Cole typically wakes at 5:30 and most days will babble and play until 6, but not always.  This certainly isn't ideal for me, as I'd love him to be a 7am waker...but that would entail a later bedtime and it just doesn't work for him.  I might try to start pushing him later...maybe in 5 minute increments over a number of weeks.   I've been meaning to pm MathewsMommy to see what she thinks.   Even if he went to bed at 6:30 and woke at 6:00 that would be so much better.  That time before 6am is just a killer :!:

Judy...is your earlier bedtime working? If so, don't post out loud...wouldn't want to jinx it.  Just reply with a smiley emoticon!!!  LOL

Traci

[FrasersMum]

Oh sorry that wasn't very clear was it  :oops:

Like Tracy, Weissbluth suggests that an early bedtime does not mean an early awake time - in fact, he suggests that the earlier a baby goes to bed the closer they will get to 7am wake up (ie not overtired at bedtime).  However almost everything I read suggests that a baby's overnight stretch will not exceed 12 hours so I was curious to see whether a 6pm bedtime means a 6am wake time, which it seems to in Cole's case.

I ask because we also struggle at the end of the day with getting Fraser to a 7pm bedtime - in fact, he goes down around 6.30 - 6.45 most nights after a bath and crying throughout getting him dried and dressed.  But I am hesitant to start the bedtime ritual earlier in case it adversly effects our 6.30 - 7am wake up time.  BUT we still are still dealing with a night waking (or two or three  :roll: ) so I am questioning whether we are hitting the right bedtime....  Ah, repeat after me, this too shall pass....

Cheers

[Nikki~Nathan&Danielle]

LOL Judy!  Our day starts at 6am too, Nathan then seems to wake Danielle with his talking (when do they really learn about quiet voices? :roll: ) or tantrum if he happened to wake prior to 6am cranky so she's up around 6.30am.

Well her night waking was back to 12.30am - I am soooo confused what she's doing!!!  Patting her just makes her mad. 

Not sure if I reported in with solids - anyway, she's been having a water cracker at lunchtime and the texture is fine with her.  She slobbers her way though it.  So maybe she's going to miss out the puree stage and go straight onto finger foods.  Maybe I need to make her some oven vege fries or something.  Although yesterday she did hold a teaspoon in each hand which was coated in avocado and sucked on them (but when I tried to offer her some I got the tongue out and "arrrrrr")  - so this girl's independent already!!! (just like her mum), Nathan obviously takes after his father......LOL

[Colesmom]

Oh, I gotcha Jo.  yes, many people think if you keep babies up later they will sleep later but in fact the opposite happens and they wake early because they are overtired.  That does happen with Cole.  On the nights he's overtired he wakes for extended periods in the night or way early like 5am.  Mind you...he didn't do it last night :?:   But he did have that half hour from 10:45-11:15 when he puked so that was likely the extra awake time due to overtiredness.

okay, i am totally monopolizing this thread.  i'm going to nap before the night feed.

bye bye.

[mrayohler]

Oh please don't anyone worry about monopolizing the thread.  I love reading all of it and comparing it to our days.

Payton had such a rough night.  She was injured 3 times and recovered rather well each time.  1) Lauren zipped her neck in the sweatshirt (2) I let her play with a plastic hangar (bad mommy!) and she tugged it out of her mouth and caught her lip and 3) the window frame fell out of the window (25 yrs old ugh!) and hit her on the head.  Poor baby! 

When I mentioned not much interest in eating it was more on the solids side.  She always loves her breastmilk.  She is feeling much better now though and seems to be slightly more interested.  She's just not the eater Lauren was.  I know - I'm not supposed to compare.

One fun thing is to give Payton the little fruit/veggie puffs that I think Gerber makes.  They are a little bigger than a Cheerio and they melt in the mouth.  They also stick to clammy baby hands so she can usually get one with the rake grasp and will try and try to get it in her mouth. Its very cute to watch and so funny to see when she drops it on the floor, looks for it momentarily then moves on to the next item within reach.

I know the night wakings and bad naps do stink but aren't the babies just so darned cute?  AND so very kissable!  I still don't know how anyone would have a third but that's my world.

Good luck to everyone tonight!
Michele

[james030405]

I am sitting here with tears running down my face as I write this :cry:  :cry: I hope you don't mind if I cry to you.  I have had my 2nd "fight to sleep"with James.  I know I have done some accidential partenting of late because a lot of the month he has been sick (he is on another course of antibiotics) and teething.  While his naps and night time sleep are great, it is just the settling that is causing the big problem.

James has always been difficult to get to sleep (his spirited part anyway) but we had been making a break through wiht him only doing his mantra cry and then he would go to sleep.  Because he has been sick, I have rocked him on occassions (not all the way to sleep) as I haven't wanted him to aggravate his throat as he has had tonsillitis.  It is now getting to the stage where even when I put him down nearly asleep, he starts to scream.  I went and saw a child health nurse today and she said "let him have a spak attack and let him cry - you may have to let him go for 30mins, just pop in and let him know you are still there". I assuming she is advocating "cry-it-out".  I tried today and he screamed/cry for about 15mins before I had to go into him (he was all hot and sweaty

I eventually went and did pu/pd which I have never done before and it took picking up 3 times and then ending wiht pat/sh and he is now finally asleep.  At every nap/sleep time we do the same thing, I try and watch for cues (rather than the clock) as to when to put him down.  Has anyone done pu/pd and been successful?  I am wondering if this is what I need to do to get back on track.   :? Is there a special trick as to when to put spirited babies down?  I have tried when he first shows signs ie. yawning/figeting and I have also tried putting it off for about 10mins and then doing it.  Nothing seems to make any difference.  I think I get upset because I know he can do it because on the odd occasion, he has done it.  He is sleeping through the night and on wakes if he is at thetop of the cot etc and all it takes to get him back to sleep is repositiong him and a few pats (this child health nurse also said not to do that anymore :shock: )

Anyway, sorry for rambling, I feel better having written it all down.  I have come to accept the fact that james will never go down without crying and that is fine, I just wish he would just do his mantra cry and go to sleep.  I want to be able to leave him with grandparents etc but at this stage I am to scared to that. 

I hope everyone else is happy and well.  Talk on chat tomorrow night

Lisa my to James my textbook/spirited koala bear

[FrasersMum]

Oh big hugs Lisa.  We have all been there - I remember all to well (well, not since the last nap about 45 minutes ago!!)

I will PM you

[Little Bear's Mum]

Lots has happened as usual so I'll just pick up on what I can remember.

Michelle - it sounds like Payton was in the wars I hope she's okay now. I'm sure you made her feel lots better with cuddles.

Judy - how did your different night routine go? It sounds an interesting idea not feeding right before bed. Come to think of it, I never used to but a friend did, so I started doing it too hoping Daniel would sleep later. Even though Daniel goes to bed awake, I wonder if he does relate his night time to needing b/feeding to get to sleep. Infact tonight I kind of dropped/delayed a feed thinking if he took more right on bedtime he'd sleep later. The opposite of what your thinking is. I gave Daniel his solids at 5pm instead of a 'cluster feed' and he gobbled up lots. But then come 6pm for his bedtime feed he was a bit fussy and didn't drink much. I"m thinking I'll DEFINITELY be up in the night for a big feed.

Jo - we have the same prob with Daniel crying through getting dressed after bathtime, unless he's had an afternoon nap. If he's had a catnap he doesn't cry ie not overtired. BUT along with my thought above re bigger feed for last feed, I"ve also wondered if Daniel doesn't need the catnap. He goes down for it fine, but I'm wondering if he really only needs about 2.25h naps per day. As I think the nights he's done big all night sleeps are the nights he's had less sleep during the day.

Traci - how did you come up with the 6pm bedtime? Was it trial and error? Daniel's is all over the place at the moment between 6.30 - 7.15pm and it doesn't seem to make any difference. The weird thing is the best night sleep he's had in ages was the day our daylight savings took effect and he went to bed at 5.30pm his body clock time. So I'm also wondering if 5.30pm is the ideal time, but that seems sooooo early. Maybe I could try 6pm again though.

Lisa - how long is James awake for between naps? I try not to watch Daniel's cues too closely as if so he would be down to soon. He stays awake about 2 - 2.5 hours. Like Traci, I've noticed he's getting a lot better at going to sleep at set times. Infact, even while out he falls asleep at 1pm now if he's in his buggy, and that's about the time he goes to sleep at home. Daniel cried really hard when I was putting him down too soon even if he looked tired. Well done on such a successful PUPD. Only 3 times! I've put off trying it for D's night sleeps as I'm scared it's going to take an hour or two!!!

 :oops:

finally, I'm pleased to say Daniel is LOVING his solids now. He's taking them 3 times per day and now up to about 3 icecube fulls per meal! And enjoying his veges too! Maybe, just maybe this will help with the night sleep. When does the quantity of food start effecting how much milk they take? Could this be why he didn't want to much b/milk tonight?

Enough from me. Take care everyone, happy feeding and sleeping and even happier awake times!

[james030405]

thanks for the encouragment everyone.  James A time is usuallyaround 2.5hrs and it is pretty close to the same time everyday. 

I did have a bit of a break through tonight.  His bedtime is 7pm so we went into his room at 6:15 when he started getting grizzily in the loungeroom.  We played on thefloor for a while and then I put him in his cot around 6:30pm to play.  I just had the lamp on and I sat beside him on a chair.  Every 10mins I put a towel (sorry for a fire hazard) over the lamp to darken the room.  He was just lying in his cot as I cleaned up his toys etc.  I then turned the lamp off with just his night light on and sat down beside his CD player while having classical nursery rhymes playing.  He started to cry a bit so I just said "it's okay, mummy's here".  This was okay for about 5mins and then he started to cry so I just went to him put a sheet over him and did pat/sh.  He then calmed down so ther was no crying and just played with on of his toys.  I stayed in theroom for another 5mins and there was no crying so I went outside.  No sounds for about 10mins and I went in and he was asleep :lol:  :shock: I will try this again tomorrow night although I don't know about the naps.  Even if I get this right maybe it will follow on.  The only thing about bedtime is that he has usually been awake for about 3.5hrs instead of his normal 2.5hrs.  I am not sure how to work in a catnap with him now having dinner.  If he doesn't have a catnap, it would mean his dinner would be around 4/4:30pm.  Anyway, I am too happy that it worked well tonight.  That is what is so frustrating, I KNOW HE CAN DO IT!! :?  :?

Talk to you all tomorrow. 

Lisa

[Colesmom]

well Lisa, I was going to respond with big hugs...but now I'll say a big HOORAY! for both you and James.  There is a spirited thread support group here in the EASY forum.  They might be able to help with how to adjust PUPD for spirited babes.  I think people tend to hold their los a little longer but they should be able to help.

Hayley.  Cole's bedtime was trial and error.  He used to go to sleep really late so I started with 8pm and it just kept getting earlier and earlier.  It's not always 6 right on...but I try not to go past 6:30 for sure.  90% of the time it's 6:00-6:15.

I think I have to shorten Cole's naps.  It seems he's moved his night awake time he used to have in the middle of the night to after his 10pm feed.  He was up from 9:30-10:45.  I'm worried about separation anxiety so I kept going in to comfort him but I think I was interfering with his settling.  I finally let him cry a full 10 minutes then he went to sleep.

Michelle, I saw a woman at the mall the other day with the Gerber finger foods...we can't get them in Canada :cry:   They looked so cool.

okay, i'm off to shower and have my coffee.  praying he sleeps an hour.  I couldn't stretch him until 8:30...made it to 8:15-he was up at 5:30!

Traci

[Jayri]

Hi all, well lasy night was fun, we went out for a walk, traci I walked for an hour yesterday, very proud of myself as it was mostly hills   , and with the kids in the stroller thst is an additional 50lb to push!! :shock:
Well I am playing nusre at the moment, dh got sick sunday with a cold and now both Jay and Riley have it too!! So Ri was in with me last night, I had to put her on a pillow propped up for her to breathe properly :cry: , and dh had Jay and he was all moopy and "nose huts" for a while. Needless to say he is now siniging and dancing to his tv shows and running around with a receiving blanket around his neck like a super hero   , he justs gets to be more fun as time goes on!!
Riley is good, Lisa, I just wanted you to know that Jay still has a little cry before bed, he always has, and I have come to accept it and give him lots of love and comfort.
Bedtime is still a major work in progress, it was going well, Ri at 7 and Jay at 8, that way I am not up at the crack of dawn and they are not sleeping in too late, but with the colds they have that is pretty much out of the window.
Hey it is chat night tonight ladies, hope to see you all there, i was laughing so hard last week I had tears in my eyes!!!
Take Care everyone, enjoy your day/evening.

[Richelle]

Hi all,

I am intrigued with everyone's lo's having such an early bedtime and that it sounds like most of you do not feed your lo's before bed.  Sophie has a FULL bottle at 730 then goes to bed, by the time she finishes talking to herself and kicking around in her crib she's asleep in between 745 and 8PM.  She sleeps through and this AM I had to wake her at 645AM.  Then I suppose if I cut out her 3rd nap and put her to bed earlier that would work?  Has anyone done this to get to the early bedtime?

I went throught the settling thing and problems with Sophie settling a few months ago and found that pupd was too much for her - she has some spirit in her - so I modified pat/sh (Would let her hold one of my hands and gently pat her butt - no shh it was too much) and stayed consistent through the crying, it took a few weeks (not 3 days)!  I also found that whenever she would cry I would react, taking BW advice to the letter.  I would never leave her alone to cry but if she cried full stop I would stop what I was doing and pick her up which is NOT what BW advises.  I am now to the point with Sophie that she knows the bedtime score. HTH Jo and Lisa as I know I was at my wits end with Sophie not settling then it sort of came together once I took a step back and I had some help and made sure EVERYONE was on the same page that would put Sophie to bed.

Nikki - that is great about Danielle helping herself.  Q-When did you start giving her baby biscuits, ect...  Do you think Sophie is too young or can you start those right away?

I put Sophie to bed by the clock also not by her signs.

Richelle