Sooooo confused and depressed!

[chell]

Hi, I know I'm always being postitive and I really do mean it, but I hope it's not too annoying  :oops:  I do remember how difficult it is. Jacob wasn't an easy baby at all in the first few months. He was very colicy and used to cry litterally non stop from 8pm until 2 in the morning. It was really horrible. This went on until he was 3 1/2  months old. It was around then that I started to do BW properly after advice from Mathewsmommy. I remember things being tough up until about 6months old, when things began to fall into place. I think it may be the same for you. And I do think you are well on the way to an easier life.
Oh, Yes and you are allowed to be upset... you wouldn't be 'normal' if you weren't sometimes. I was in tears many times. But for the past 4 months things have been really really lovely - I know this will happen for you too.   You are working so hard. That is plain to see.



Yes I see what you mean, about it only working if they are up at 7ish.

1. Was wondering if Oscar is having a growth spurt if he was so keen to   feed at night? It's usually around 6 months though.
2. Did he sleep through the night at the clinic?
3. Did he go to sleep ok at 7pm, or was he ready for bed before then?
4. Did you try to resettle him when he woke at 5.30am?
5. How many feeds does he get during the day, does he seem satisfied after?
6. Are you following everything exactly as they did at the clinic? ( or is this not possible now you are home and if not , which bits aren't you doing?)

 I know it's lots of questions, but was hoping we may be able to work something out.

Jacob used to wake 2-4 times after I put him down for the night up until he was around 5 months, it was nearly always wind. I never used to believe him, until I picked him up winded him for a good 5 mins!

The baby massage sounded really cute! What a little toad, lying there & enjoying it after you said he wouldn't like it!

xxx

[oscar10405]

Never annoying!  I just wish I had your attitude!

1. Was wondering if Oscar is having a growth spurt if he was so keen to feed at night? It's usually around 6 months though.

I'm not sure?!  We had him weighed today and he's put on 300g in a week, so maybe.  He's a big boy though - he's now off the scale for weight and in the 97th percentile for height!

2. Did he sleep through the night at the clinic?

No, to be fair, he didn't.  He did have longer stretches though - 5 hours one night.  We were only there 3 nights so hard to tell.

3. Did he go to sleep ok at 7pm, or was he ready for bed before then?

He went fine but woke up at 8pm, then 9pm, etc

4. Did you try to resettle him when he woke at 5.30am?

Yep.  For about 20 minutes, he kept drifting off, then waking up etc.... I gave up at 6am.

5. How many feeds does he get during the day, does he seem satisfied after?

Every 4 hours - so....if the first is at 6, it will be 10am, 2pm, 6pm and 10pm.  He seems satisfied because he pulls off when I know there's some left but he's had enough and starts grinning at me.

6. Are you following everything exactly as they did at the clinic? ( or is this not possible now you are home and if not , which bits aren't you doing?)

Pretty much exactly, they had an exhaust fan in the room that was pretty noisy, we have the radio on static, not quite the same noise but close.  He was also in a bassinet, now he's in a cot. 

I feel a bit better today - I made him stay in bed until 6am, I basically rocked the cot till then!  He's had 3 sleeps today, all 1.5-2hours long.  We'll see how he goes tonight - he's due to go down at around 8pm.  I think I am still obsessed with his sleep and get nervous all the time, wondering when he's going wake up.  I am on edge all the time, knowing I'll have to go in and resettle after 40 mins, and a few times after!

Anyway - I am probably worrying myself to sickness!  My hair is still falling out!

xxx

[chell]

Sounds as though things are begining to come together.
But, your hair, you poor thing. Please try not to worry so much. You really are getting there. I know you don't believe me, or can see all the progress, but you are going to be so experienced in sleep problems after all of this, you'll be running the BW site before you know it!!

Wow! that's great that he's on the 97th percentile...Oscar is very like Jacob, cos he is on that one too!

 1. I'm not sure?! We had him weighed today and he's put on 300g in a week, so maybe. He's a big boy though - he's now off the scale for weight and in the 97th percentile for height!
I think if he really was hungry then its ok to feed him, but it would be good to get rid of all those night feeds

Every 4 hours - so....if the first is at 6, it will be 10am, 2pm, 6pm and 10pm. He seems satisfied because he pulls off when I know there's some left but he's had enough and starts grinning at me.

I know you've got a good routine of feeds going, but I can't help thinking that if you were able, and Oscar was willing to have an extra one or two feeds during the day, that he would sleep for longer at night. Tracy said that if you are able to increase their calorie intake during the day, especially while going through a growth spurt, you won't get them waking at night. Not sure quite how this fits into EASY, but it is what I did, before I started weaning. It got a bit manic as I was doing 8 feeds all during the day, but it sure meant he didn't wake for night feeds.

2. How did they get him to go back to sleep during the night at the clinic? Also are you still swaddling in the same way? I think swaddling is sooo important to babes like Oscar

3. He went fine but woke up at 8pm, then 9pm, etc

Just wondering if he has always done this...is it habitual? If so I think its just a matter of perseverence.

4. Did you try to resettle him when he woke at 5.30am?
Yep. For about 20 minutes, he kept drifting off, then waking up etc.... I gave up at 6am.

I think this is fine. I'm sure that if you keep going he will eventually get the message. This is what I did with Jacob.

6. Are you following everything exactly as they did at the clinic? ( or is this not possible now you are home and if not , which bits aren't you doing?)
Pretty much exactly, they had an exhaust fan in the room that was pretty noisy, we have the radio on static, not quite the same noise but close. He was also in a bassinet, now he's in a cot.

Does he have a favourite soft toy, to go to sleep with? It is quite a good idea to introduce one, of your choice, before he decides to become attached to your best nightie or grubby old tea towel!!! (not that you have anything that is grubby!! :lol: ). It's just that they can pick the stuffed animal up and pop it over their eyes independently to block out any stimuli, which could help Oscar to sleep and get back off when he wakes . Do you block out stimuli with your hands over his eyes if not? I do both with Jacob when necessary. It really helps.

You have done so well getting him to have all those sleeps! CONGRATULATIONS!!   :lol: 

For 4-6 months they should have4-6 hours sleep as naps.
xxx

[oscar10405]

Thanks Cheryl!  You are so kind and helpful.  I will see how he goes next month when we begin solids (looking forward to that!).  I'm going to take it really easy and slowly though - just incase he has any food intolerances like Mum.  I'm sure his wake ups are habitual!  He really needs us to resettle him - we'll try to ease off the rocking later on.

I was up at 5.15 this morning, rocking for about 25 minutes!!  Arggghhh - but he went back to sleep until 6.30 so that's okay.

We have a sheet over his end of the cot (sounds funny but it's pegged to the cot etc) and it blocks out any stimuli.  We rock the cot from behind, he can't see us.  He has his 'snuggeze' which is a proper 'blankie' with a dog's head!  He's not really into it yet but it's been in his cot for a while now and he sometimes looks at it when he's nodding off.  He can't hold it though because his arms are in the swaddle!.  Swaddling has been the best thing for him, sometimes he's closed his eyes whilst I'm wrapping him up - so cute.

The clinic said it was fine to feed him at night - they didn't really go into that too much - they seemed to think he would need his night feeds for a while yet?  I don't know......I think I'll 'review' that one later.....

We are having some friends over tonight for dinner - the first time in 6 months!  We haven't been able to do it before because Oscar was in our arms!!  Finger's crossed he doesn't hear us talking too much and get disturbed.  We'll have to ask them not to laugh too loud! (how insane is this baby life....?!)

Hope you and big Jacob are doing better now with that flu thingy.....xxx

[chell]

Hi! Sounds as though you're doing everything right. It's so lovely when they enjoy being swaddled. Jacob used to do this sometimes! Oh yes and also when they come off you after a feed and smile..aww! I do miss it sometimes! Jacob never did that when bottle fed.

Wow, having friends over, that's great! Have a brilliant time!     :lol:  . Oh don't fret about the 5.30 wake up...actually Jacob woke at that time today, doesn't usually (maybe he's in caahoots with Oscar :wink:  naughty naugthy) He wanted to be fed the little toad, but did go back for another hour. Think he's pretending to have another growth spurt. You sound much cooler and in control now.

I am really frustrated with the nursery. :roll:  Although they are very good, in a lot of ways..caring, give the bubs a lot of 1-1 attention, look after Jacobs health well etc, BUT they just don't get it about how IMPORTANT SLEEP IS!!!! :evil:  Yesterday he had one little nap of 30mins and again today -he was there for the morning - 25 mins. They said he had been fine happy, but when I got him home he was so overtired, I had to renap him he didn't sleep well for his pm nap and he wasn't as happy as usual. I've explained so many times, talked about the books, Tracy, the bw website, even leant them a video, suggested I come in and show them the techniques......I can't think what else I can do without sounding like a nag or what else would help. They don't have bubs themselves, & can only think that they just don't understand and never will until they do!!!!! Sooorryyy to go on just wanted to have a vent.

Hope you have a great night
xxx

[oscar10405]

Hi!  We had a great night, thank you.  I put Oscar down at 7.45 and he didn't peep until 10.30, which is when he was due for a feed.  It was good actually, as it kind of ended the evening and I went to bed!  He had a pretty good night too - didn't wake up until 3.30am for another feed, then kind of 'stirred' throughout the night (not sure of the times but was aware that he was stirring) but kept going back to sleep.  We had HUGE winds last night and so the window was banging away and DH accidentally let a door SLAM this morning when he left for work at 6am but Oscar (stirred) didn't actually get up until 7am?!  Brilliant.  Let's hope it's not a one-off.

That is frustrating for you (nursery).  Sounds like you've done all you can.  I have to admit, I'm surprised they listen to you at all, I can't imagine any day-care here even giving it a go?  It must be a special nursery that you've chosen?  I imagine that they don't quite get it though - does anyone unless you've been there yourself?  I know my friends and family don't understand my obsession with Oscar's sleep.  I was having a chat with my Dad the other day, who was surprised when I said that Oscar's awake time was 2 hours...he actually said....'can't you just keep them up all day so they sleep at night?'.  Obviously he played a very small role in our upbringing!!  Grrrr :roll:

It breaks your heart when they are quiet from lack of sleep doesn't it?     I hate seeing Oscar like that! 

I am going to a toy party (like a tupperware party!) on Sunday.  My first 'outing' with other Mums.  The starting time is 10am though so I will be very late as Oscar is always napping at this time.  I find that lots of 'baby' meetings etc are in the mornings and I can rarely make them!  I don't know when other people's babies sleep!!?

I hope today went better for Jacob and his nursery nap?  Wish I could offer advice, but, as usual, I am the dummy here......xxx

[chell]

Glad you had a brill night, and well done Oscar! Don't know if you've been following any of hana1978's threads, (she is having a bad time of it) but she mentioned about the clocks going back which got me thinking, I don't want to be getting up at 5.30 instead of 6.30. Think I may try to creep Jacobs bedtime on a bit!

You are not a dummy!!! You are a lovely devoted mummy.

When you said you had huge winds last night  I thought 'oh no you poor thing!' then realised you meant the weather! :lol:

Think it is good that you are making some noises (& I don't mean the wind! :lol: ) - so Oscar doesn't get too used to the quiet.
xx

[oscar10405]

I usually do have huge winds (ever since giving birth for some reason!) but I was talking about the weather!!

I was naughty this morning and fell asleep with Oscar after his morning feed, we got up at 7.30 which has mucked up his body clock a bit - I can tell because he's getting tired at the wrong times.  Really cranky with myself for doing it!  Oh well, live and learn.......  Maybe I should actually 'sit up' or something.  It's so yummy having him fall asleep in my arms after booby, but not worth the consequences!

I haven't been following anyone's posts - i will have a look around now.  I need some activity ideas as Oscar is getting bored with his current toys!  I didn't even think about daylight savings (is that what you call it there?!) - that would muck things up a bit for them!  You have quite extreme daylight hours in your summer don't you?  I remember going to bed at some crazy time like 10.30pm and it still being light outside - bizarre!!  How on earth do your babies know when it's night!?

Hey - i know you are a busy lady so if you want to slow down these posts to me - just do it!!  I love chatting to you but don't want to be a burden! 

xxx

[chell]

Hi, started trying to alter Jacobs routine, towards 7-7. He's not keen and demands his milk just before 6 whatever! We lowered his cot base too, cos I think he is about to start trying to stand! He's crawling around everywhere now! It's really cute.

Think there is something wrong with one of my rabbits. Got to go and check in a minute. Looks as thought there is some blood on her rump. Hope it's not serious. Trouble is, I'm ashamed to say, I'm not as vigilant with them as I used to be, now I've got Jacob.

You're not a burden....but I guess I ought to be helping out a bit more on here! It's been great getting to know you, I call people on here "my virtual friends!"

Gotta go now, loads of washing up and stuff to do, plus checking out the bunny.

xxx

[oscar10405]

I hope bunny is okay?  I'm a cat person and my puss has been a bit neglected too - only with cuddles but I still feel bad.  She doesn't seem the least bit interested in Oscar - never has been, as though he's always been there!

It's been lovely to chat to you too.  Send me a PM anytime you want!  I'm pretty lonely over here so don't mind a chat now and then!

I have no doubt that I will have some Oscar-challenges soon so I will probably post again!  He is still not the champion sleeper but things are manageable, as long as I get early nights, otherwise I'm stuffed as he wakes up a fair bit at night - even if he just makes noise but puts himself back to sleep - it disturbs me etc.  Think he'll need to go to his own room soon!

I can't wait for Oscar to crawl - I can see he's getting frustrated with lying on the ground all the time!!  His tummy-time is good but he's a long way off actually moving.

Take care.....xxxx

[chell]

Hi, just thought I'd let you know that I think the bunny's going to be ok, although she has been pretty badly wounded. Vet thinks it may have been a cat attack (I do still like cats though!). Trouble is she is just an ordinary bunny, I used to keep english lops, they were like small dogs and would chase off cats or dogs! but she would run away rather than stand her ground.
 I'm so glad you are enjoying Oscar now, it's all such an interesting journey, having a bub.

Look let me know if you get stuck with anything or want to have a chat and let me know how you get on.

lol cherylxxx

[oscar10405]

I know cats can be evil - it's just cat-nature but it's a trait i don't like either!

I'm stuck already!!! 

For the last 2 days, Oscar has resettled himself for his day naps (that is, after 40 mins, he makes a bit of noise then goes back to sleep).  I was thrilled with this, and surprised.  He has been having two 1.5 hour naps and a 45 min nap around 5pm.

Today though, for his first nap this morning, he did 40 mins and wouldn't let me extend this - he wasn't crying, he was yelling - an angry yell.  He was very tired still but I got him up and made him stay up for his 2 hours anyway.  He was quiet and red-eyed.  I don't know what happened today - the only thing I did differently was wrap him a slightly different way because he's been getting out of my other wraps.  I don't know if this would be the problem??  It wasn't tighter or anything, I just wrapped each arm separately instead of together (they showed us this technique in Adelaide) - sounds funny but I hope you know what I mean....

The other 'dilemma' is the mornings.  He seems to stir around 5.30 but goes back to sleep until around 6.15 or so.  I accept this time so I get him up and bring him into bed to feed him.  The problem is that he goes back to sleep after the second booby and doesn't show any signs of wanting to wake up.  I have been literally picking him up and trying to wake him slowly but it's hard because I would personally like to sleep longer too but once I've fed him, it throws the day out if I let him sleep.  Eg: Say he's fed at 6.30am, then sleeps until 7.30am,  he would go down at 9.30am.  On the 4hr EASY, he'd be due for a feed at 10.30am, so his nap would be only an hour!  I suppose the answer is just to get him up after the feed anyway. 

Sorry to be a pain again!  Why, oh why, do I find all this so damn hard?? :oops:

[mirshine]

Hi there
How old is your lo at this stage?
It sounds like you're in a pretty similar situation to us when we started on this plan.  Our lo was just over 3 months.
I found the posting by I think its Jennifer such a help.  We were doing the PU PD but holding her until she settled and then putting her down the way it said in the article.  However, once we started not holding, literally just picking her up and putting her down (pretty much like weight lifting!) things started to gradually improve.  I find that if she begins to settle I turn her on her side towards me and stroke her forhead and back just shushing or making soothing noises.  This helps to calm her down completely.  If she gets hyper again,  I do the PU PD again and continue until she settles a bit and then do the stroking.  The cycle continues.  She's now 5 months and at night time she settles no problem.  Naps are still a major issue, but we're getting there.  It helped getting her on the four hour easy schedule also.
Let me know if I can be of any more help.  I hope I'm not just repeating whats gone before, my lo is in the middle of a bad head cold so don't have time to read through the other replies!
Lots of hugs in your direction.  Don't despair.  And don't give up on it.  It'll only make things even more difficult to get sorted and leave you feeling even more guilty.

xx

[mirshine]

Hmm sorry, I was a bit slow in typing, you've gotten a few replies since  :oops:
Don't despair, trust me, I went through the whole, crying while walking in the park, almost willing to give my baby to a stranger thing, which was a bit worrying for dh!! 
It really is hard, you are not alone in the struggle.  It doesn't make you a bad mother.
I've heard that sitting your baby up wakes them immediately!!  I've tried and it works.  Even if you just have some quiet play.
Our system is not quite easy at this stage.  Sarah will only have 30 min naps at one go.  So she eats, has activity, has a 30 minute nap, more activity, if we're lucky another 30 minute nap and then eats again.  I guess its all trial and error.  I've tried everything to extend the naps, but 30 minutes seem to be all she needs for a while anyway.
Hope this helps and I'm not just rambling!

[chell]

So, is Oscar 5 1/2 months now?

I think for this age, most bubs do 2 naps, but I don't want to muck uo the stuff which you did at the clinic. Jacob would do three, but only because the first 2 were 45mins each. For a 6 month old it should be 2 naps of 1-2 hours and 12 hours at night. I'm not sure when Oscar goes to bed. Just wondering if this would affect the time he goes back to sleep.

I think if it was me, I wouldn't worry too much about him going back for that extra hour, I think eventually he will drop that moring feed and sleep right through, although not for a while yet, so you will really benefit. I would just feed him a bit later instead, when he wakes and just adjust the rest of his routine. I 've found that I i've caught up time eventually by the afternoon and the routine is abck in order.

Gotta go speak again soon.
xx