How to improve nap times on the 3 hr Easy routine

[kdruve]

Hi Everyone,
This is my first time to use this site, and am hoping to receive some much needed advice. I have a 3 week old who I am trying to put on the 3 hour EASY routine. Firstly, is it too early to be trying this? Should I just let him set the pace at this early stage? My main concern is that my bub is not getting enough sleep on easy. For example, I am trying to feed him every 3 hours (nearly always have to wake him up) and it normally takes an hour to feed him. (I am offering breast and then giving him a full bottle as I do not seem to have enough milk supply). He nearly always gets sleepy by the end of the bottle, but takes a long time to get to sleep once I put him down. Sometimes he only has 30mins or less left to nap before I have to wake him for his next feed. I am worried that I am not letting him get enough sleep and that he is getting overtired.
Also, should I be doing the extra cluster feeds of any evening. If I feed him that much I dont think he will take much at the df and then will wake up earlier in the night than if I gave him a big feed around 11pm?

[Keren]

Hello Karen!!! 

Welcome to the boards! 

From your post are you saying that it is taking almost 2.5hrs to get him back to sleep after he wakes and gets a feed? If so I would definately let him sleep longer than the 30mins to the next feed. I would let him sleep 1.5hrs at that stage. Ie 4hrs from when he last woke up.

If it is taking an hour to feed he will probably be ready for a nap soon after finishing his feed. Can you tell us what you/he are/is doing after he finishes his feed. Ie tired signs, settling etc. Maybe we can help you settle him quicker.

I really can't help you with if it too early to put him on 3hr EASY as we unfortunately didn't start whispering until Josh was 3months old. Hopefully someone else can help you here.

I am not too sure about the df either. But they do have little tummies and can't hold all that much anyway. We didn't cluster feed and Josh went to 11pm ok, but maybe other mums have different experiences.

Hope you get some advice here.

Cheers Keren

[Katet]

Karen, are you bf & do you plan to continue doing it, because the only way you will be if you don't offer the bottle, (offering the bottle will prevent you from ever having enough milk as it is a supply & demand thing, you only produce more if your baby demands more) you may need to bf every 2 hours to get up your supply, in which case you would virtually need to feed, put down for a nap, feed etc. Or when you offer the bottle, pump for at least another 20mins afterwards, at first you may get almost nothing, but in a day or 2 the supply will increase & you should be able to reduce the bottle & hopefully drop it after 3-4 days.

Also the reason why your lo may take so long to settle is if you bf then bottle, you might be giving to much so he gets a belly ache (how much is a full bottle, a 5 week old should probably take about 100mls  (3-4 oz) maximum & that would include your bf as well.

[kdruve]

Thanks Keren and Katet for your advice. Keren, for example this afternonn I fed bub at 1645pm and then again at 1945 as trying to feed him about every 3 hours. Between those feeds he did not sleep at all. After the 1945 feed he was very settled and seemed like he would drop off as had that drunk/full/content look about him. I put him in his cot (after sitting quietly with him and swaddling him) and here it is 2100 and he is still not asleep. Although he does not cry constantly he is not asleep. (He lets out a cry and then stops and constantly fidgets). Eventually, he becomes more upset and I have to pick him up and soothe him otherwise he gets himself too worked up. Doing the ssh/pat doesn't seem to make any real difference. I really need some tips on how to settle him. Also, have decided to just give him the bottle and express if my supply allows it. Bf as well as bottle means feeds always take an hour and think that may be wearing him out too. Have just started giving him 120mls of formula as per directions on can. If you have any ideas on how I can settle him more easily would love to know.
Karen.l

[Keren]

Hi Karen

After the feed does he show any tired signs at all? Yawn, clench fists, become jerky in movements, start to fidget or get cranky, rub eyes? These can be all tired signs.

If he doesn't you could be correct in that the feeding him for so long is wearing him out and he might be already past the tired point and into overtired. Maybe try to put him down straight after you feed him. Change his nappy first so that would be the quick "A" time and then try to get him down to sleep.

I used to sit with Josh up on my shoulder/chest just sitting with him in a darkened room, and let him settle on my chest until he was just drowsy. Most times he would try and lift his head and look around and sometimes even cry (if I had passed the tired point). Then I would lay him down in the cot. If he cried I let him go for about 10mins to see if he would settle himself and then help him if he couldn't.

There is a mathematical formula for how much a bub can take at a meal. Try posting on the bottle feeding board if you aren't sure if it is the correct amount.

Have you seen your GP about colic? There is something else I have heard called silent reflux. I don't know much about it but there is another board for reflux. Maybe pop over there and see if your bub has the symptoms of silent reflux. This could be why he is squirming a lot too.

HTH Cheers
Keren

[Meg's Mom]

Hi girlies,

I have the formula for how much if you need it.  Just let me know what his weight is.

I just wanted to add something.  I had a really hard time getting my LO to latch (took about a week).  So during that time i was bottle feeding and pumping.  But once she did latch and BF i was so afraid she wasn't getting enough (I wasn't doing it right) that i would offer her the bottle after a BF.  She always took it!

So i thought i wasn't producing enough.  But her Dr said she was taking the bottle for the suck reflex, not because she was hungry or that i wasn't producing enough.  He recommended a paci and it helped.

Lastly i wonder if he is getting in a catnap during the feed.  Could that be why he is taking an hour to feed? and then not really tired so taking a long time to settle?

[Keren]

Michelle - I like your points. I was going to suggest a paci too after thinking about it today.

Karen - Does it seem that Thomas is going to sleep during the feed? If so then run your fingers up his back, or put a cool facecloth on his forehead to keep him awake. Josh sometimes did this and he hates having fingers run up his back  :lol: .

Also Josh never showed me tired signs in the afternoon so I really had to go by the clock and I was putting him down to sleep about 1hr 15mins after he woke up. According to my baby book that my mum kept, I never napped in the afternoon until I was 3 months old. I musn't have showed her any tired signs either. Geez I would have been a cranky baby come bedtime  .

If you want to go the paci (dummy) option, try not to let him have it for the whole nap. Let him have it until the furious sucking stops and he is drifting off into a deep sleep, then very gently remove the paci. If he cries for it let him have it back again until he drifts off again. Sometimes it may just drop out of his mouth. If he doesn't cry for it don't put it back in. This way he won't make it a prop. I used a dummy that way a lot with Josh for his naps, particularly in the afternoon when he was so overtired and couldn't settle easily.

How did your day go? Any better?

cheers
Keren