4 month old has always done 45 min. naps!!! Need help!

[meghan]

I am thoroughly confused. I have read Tracey's books and read these posts daily to find some answers to my lo's nap problems, and I am getting confused....

Some say to extend the A time to help naps, and some say to put them in the crib at the first yawn. I have tried both, and niether are working (probably b/c I try both ways!  :? )

My DD is almost 4 months old and has never taken long naps, although she needs them b/c she wakes up cranky. I usually get her to sleep a little longer by putting her in her swing, which I know is a bad habit, but I've been desperate. I try the Pat/Ssh, which works, but only to extend her naps for another 10 minutes or so- she always wakes up again. She does use a binkie, which settles her back to sleep after she wakes up, so maybe she is too dependent on it? I want to take it away, but am so afraid! I dont do Pu/Pd, because I would have to take the binkie away if its a prop, right?

She is exclusively BF every 3 1/2 to 4 hours. Our A time consists of playing on the floor or reading books, but she is usually tired after 1 to 1 1/2 hours. I swaddle her, but she usually ends up getting out of it by the end of her nap, and when she wakes up her arms are flailing about.

She always wakes up a lot at night. I give her a DF at 10-11 and she sleeps until about 2 or 3, but then wakes up every 20 minutes or so starting at 5 am! I feed her again around 7 am.

I'm sorry to go on for so long, but I have read how you ladies have helped so many others, and I am desperate for a plan that works!
Any advice is greatly appreciated!!

[zelkad]

Hi..

Have you ever gone in 5 minutes before she wakes up?  Someone gave me this advice on the website a couple months ago and it worked!  Go in 5 minutes before the 45 minute mark (VERY QUIETLY) because this is the light part of their sleep cycle!  Gently place your hands on your baby's shoulder and hip (if she is a side sleeper).  The pressure of your hands should keep baby fairly still when she hits that 45 minute wake up jolt.  In total your hands would be on her for 5 minutes before and 5 minutes after the stirring.  If she's a back sleeper, perhaps put your hands on her chest and legs.  Like I said, it worked for us.  We don't do it anymore because our lo has learned to put himself back to sleep at this 45 min mark.  Occasionally we hear a little grunt at the 45 min point but that's about it.  Good luck!

Zelka

[meghan]

THanks for the tip, Zelka. I tried that today. I went in and put my hand on her chest (she is a back sleeper). A few minutes later she jolted and cried. She slept for maybe 10 more minutes. Does it take a few days to work??

[Onewoman]

Hi, I've had good results from doing the same as Zelka. At first, you will probably need to stay for about 30 minutes....getting up to the bedroom at 35 mins, waiting til they start to rouse, putting your hands on and maybe doing a little patting, waiting til they are back into a deep sleep, then waiting a little more! It's a bit time consuming, but worth it!

The dummie might be becoming a prop also. It's better if they can get to sleep without one.

HTH

[zelkad]

Yes, I agree that you might have to stay a bit longer the first few times.  I think it's a great sign that it worked, even though briefly the first time!  I agree that getting rid of the pacifier would be great.  We did that a couple weeks ago and it has made a huge difference. (not always an easy process!)  Now, however, he sucks his thumb but we'll tackle that hurdle later.  The fact that he can put himself to sleep is worth it to us!  Please let us know how the naps come along!

[Lucysmom]

Susana -

My dd had no trouble getting through the jolts for almost 3 weeks and now has trouble again.  I have been able to extend her naps but only by staying in her nursery the whole time to help get her through the jolts.  Sometimes the 10 minute one is the worst, other times the 40 minute one, other times the 60 minute one.   :shock: So I feel I can NEVER LEAVE!!!  I know this is a stupid question to ask, but how long is it going to take for her to be able to get through the jolts again??  I once again have no life except for dd!!!!  :shock:

Thanks!

[meghan]

We hit an all time low yesterday. Because Lauren isnt napping well during the day, bedtime is always a struggle. She usually goes down around 7 or 7:30, but sometimes I think she is ready at 6! She gets overtired SO quickly, I dont know what to do.
Last night we were both crying. I finally put her in her swing to get her to sleep for an hour, then carefully moved her to her crib. I know its a terrible habit, but she just screams and screams when we try to put her to bed. We have a wind down ritual that consists of a bath (if she isnt already too tired), soft talking and low lights, rocking, swaddling, and in bed. She arches her back and screams- not cries- screams!
I want to be consistent, but it is so hard b/c I dont feel like we ever make any progress. DH is frustrated and doesnt' really buy into the Baby Whisperer advice, although he says he'll support me. (But how much support is that??)
Anyway, last night I was so upset, I was practically yelling at her. Then later I cried b/c I felt so bad. I mean, she's only a baby!! Gosh, I feel like such a failure. Parenting is so hard. You'd think going to sleep would be easy.
Please help... I love her so much it breaks my heart to see her so unhappy and tired!

[albertasweetpea]

Hi Meghan, you say you think she may be tired at 6 pm? Sounds like that is probably true with her napping very little during the day. Have you tried putting her to bed for the night at that time?? It may take a few days for her to catch up on her sleep then you could try extending her bed time by 15 minutes or so every couple of days until it is 7 or 7:30.

[zayandme]

I didn't start BW until my son was 4 months old. He too took 45 minute naps. Our key was that he had too much stimulation.
I toned it waaaaaay down during his awake time, and if he squawked I wouldn't do anything but face him a different direction in the room or switch rooms.
Within 3 days he was taking 1.5 hour naps and his awake time went to 1.5 hours.
May not work for you but it couldn't hurt to try!
Please let me know if that was too vague or if you have questions.

[Meg's Mom]

Hi Meghan
Sorry you are having such trouble, but you have come to the right place, so hang it there!

To clarify, for an infant under 3mos – we say to put them down at first yawn.  For an infant over 3mos who is doing the short naps, we say to start gradually extending A time.  We need to find a plan and stick to it for a few weeks before changing it.

I can’t say if the binkie is a prop, but lets deal w/ the short naps first and you CAN use the binkie w/ PU/PD.

Have a search for the Auzie swaddle on our board or look at the miracle swaddle (search the web) which can be used w/o putting their feet but should keep her arms in the swaddle.  We used it till Megan was 7mos or so.

It sounds like her naps and night wake may be due to the fact that she doesn’t yet know how to fall asleep independently.  What does your nap routine look like and what do you do when she wake as night?  Feed and then what?

Finally, give me some more information…post your typical day and also tell me how long she has done the short naps?

You are NOT a failure and Yes, parenting is hard!  Sleep is taught, but it is rare to hear anyone talk about the fact that you need to TEACH an infant how to sleep just like you teach them how to walk, talk, etc.

[meghan]

Thanks for your replies.

Yesterday Lauren had one good nap. I went in at the 40 min. mark and put my hands on her before she jolted awake. I stayed in her room for 20 minutes- she kept stirring and then settling, stirring and settling. After that she slept another 40 minutes or so! Yeah!

This morning I didn't even have to go in her room- she slept about 1 15 minutes. ALthough, she did still have the binkie in her mouth, so I think that helped soothe her back to sleep if she did wake up.

Her second nap today was 30 minutes! I wasnt even ready to go back in yet, and I heard her crying. So, I shushed her, gave her binkie, and left. She talked/cried for about 20 minutes, then fell back asleep for another 45! So, I think she can fall asleep on her own, IF she has her binkie.

Nightime is still rough. I can't seem to read when she is ready for bed. We try to get her bath, feeding, and wind down done w/in an hour, cuz sometimes she is already crabby after that!

Here is our typical day:
awake at 7 am
E 7:15
A very low key until about 8:15
S 8:15- she usually goes down really well for this nap.

If she wakes up after 45 min. I try to get her to go back to sleep, but in the past, if she cries long enough, I give in and put her in her swing b/c I know she will fall asleep in it.

We have just transitioned to the 4 hour EASY, so she would eat again around 11, be awake until about 12 or 12:30 and be ready for a nap again. Because she can't stay awake for 2 hours it messes up the 4 hour schedule.

We repeat all of the above, eating every 4 hours with a catnap in her swing around 5 and then she is usually in bed (but screaming) about 7:30 and she will cry until she is exhausted (even though we go in and comfort) until 8:30 or later.

Sorry to go on for so long....

Someone mentioned keeping the A time very low key- what do you suggest?? I try to play quietly on the floor w/ her, but even that doesn't make a difference.

I am beginning to realize and accept the fact that Lauren is a touchy and maybe even (gasp!) grummy baby. She is such a challenge. It seems she cries all the time, for no reason, and her mood swings--- they are so unpredictable. One minute she is smiling and the next she is screaming, and we haven't done anything! I am beginning to wonder if she has tummy problems or something...

Thanks for the help and please keep it coming!

Meghan

[Onewoman]

Hi  The jolting thing is usually down to overstimulation and/or overtiredness.

Lucysmum - have you introduced new toys or are you doing more in activity time? If you can manage to keep your lo calm then she shouldn't jolt and you wouldn't need to pat her so long/for so much of your day.
Meghan - Have you tried not playing with your lo and just leaving her to look out the window or something like that? It's good if they can learn to be by themselves for a while as well and not need you to constantly be playing with them. (At 2 years old you will definitely want them to be able to play on their own for a while!) Also, the tv is very stimulating, maybe you could turn it off if you have it on. Another idea is to sit and cuddle 10/15 minutes before you take your lo up for a nap/bedtime. Oh yes, maybe your lo gets overstimulated by bathtime, could you do it at a different time of day?

I'd try bedtime at 7 if she is overtired at 7.30 or even 6.00/6.30. Could she eat a little sooner at 3.5 or 3.75 hrs, so she is not awake so long? 

Pat/shh is great for calming babies...have you tried it with her on your chest for a good 5/10 minutes before you put her down?

Hope something from this helps! 

[zayandme]

yes, my son is touchy and at this age I learned (after 4 hard months!) that all he needed was for me to set him on the floor to stare at the cieling fan, or I would drape a striped dishtowel near him, or set him next to a window, or near his crib so he could stare at the slats.  Instead of singing and playing and reading with him for most of his awake time, I switched to "doing" almost nothing.
the difference I saw was amazing. Please ask if you need further clarity.

[marylou]

sorry i dont have any advice...just wanted you to know that I am in the same boat................(((((hugs)))))))))))))))

[Meg's Mom]

Meghan

It seems she cries all the time, for no reason, and her mood swings--- they are so unpredictable.

That statement made me thing of reflux, I don't know a lot about it - but have a read at the reflux board and see if anything rings true.

If the 4hr EASY is not working as she can't stay up 2 hrs, why don't you do either 3.5hr EASY or EASASY.

Let us know how things are going, you have gotten some great ideas for low key activities.

[meghan]

Thanks for the replies, I am trying out a few different things.

One, I have been putting her to bed EARLY- like around 6. I feel weird doing it, it seems so early, but she has been going down a lot better. In fact, my husband was able to put her down last night, and usually she balks when he does it.

I am going back to a 3 or 3 1/2 hour easy. I thought she was ready for the 4 hour, but maybe her fussing is partly due to hunger? So, we'll see how that works.

Am trying to keep it low key during A time, but its so hard. I cherish our time to play, so I know I am probably doing too much with her. Will work on that.

She still wakes up after 45 min. even though I go in her room during every nap to try to "catch" her before she jolts awake. I feel like now she is waking up because she knows I will be there to put her binkie back in. Somedays she will close her eyes and sleep (?) for another 10 minutes or so, but thats about it.

We are going to the Ped today to have her weight checked. She had a cold last week and when I took her to the ped, she had only gained 1 lb. in almost 2 months. This makes me think there is a problem with my milk. Perhaps that is a factor?? AGGH! So many unknowns- I feel like everyday I have a new theory and it makes me feel so incompetent and confused!

I dont know anything about reflux, but I will do a search and see if it sounds like Lauren. Thanks for the thought.

Also, I have read about the EASASY schedule, but need a refresher. Does anyone else follow this schedule? How does it work?

THanks for the help- I come on my computer everyday to see if anyone else has ideas, so keep 'em coming! :wink:

[Meg's Mom]

If i catch you before you go to your ped, - ask about the reflux, explain what you were saying to us that she would be fine one minute and screaming the next.  DON'T let him push you off until you get enough information that you feel comfortable with the subject. 

Again, tell them about your concerns w/ feeding and weight gain.

If going back to either 3 or 3.5 I would recommend 3.5 so that you can keep her A time long enough to keep combating the 45min naps. 

I know it gets confusing, it is like solving a puzzle but your only feedback on if it is working is Lauren's reactions.  I just want to add, once you decide to try something, stick w/ it for at least 2wks.  As change in an young one takes time!

[zayandme]

Oh, I know it is so hard! Just go easy on yourself, you are doing the very best you can with what you know! Take it one day at a time and be persistent for awhile with each new thing ( like meg'smom said). Please keep us updated!

[meghan]

I did some research online, and now my husband and I are convinced that she has reflux. She has all the symptoms! You were right, Michelle. THank you so much!

Spoke to the ped. and they agree that it could be reflux. However, they dont want to start her on med's yet- they want to try to thicken her milk. Since she is breastfed, I am starting rice cereal. Also, I think my milk supply has diminished recently since Lauren has shown little interest in eating, so the doc wants me to work on getting my supply back up and see if part of the problem isn't hunger. I am taking Fenugreek, an herbal pill that is supposed to help. I am also supplementing with formula.


Today she has nursed and taken a bottle each feeding and seems pretty happy. She also had her first rice cereal and did pretty well. SO, we'll see what happens tonight. If she remains pretty happy all day, I guess the problem was hunger, or giving the rice helped.

I am so grateful for this website and you wonderful, supportive mommies!! I'll let you know how it goes...

Meghan

[Meg's Mom]

Well done!  I am glad to hear your ped is on board and has given you a plan. 

I took fenugreek and it worked well.

Let us know how you are doing.