any tips/general rules about moving from 3 naps down to 2?

[sunnysideup850]

DS is ready to move to 2 naps, I believe.  He really fights the catnap and I generally have to wake him at 2:00 in order to fit in the third nap.  So I think if I let him sleep through until he wakes up from nap #2 then I can get rid of the cat nap.  I am looking for suggestions.

Do I just extend the awake time between his morning waking and nap #1 and also between nap #1 and nap #2?  I find it the hardest to extend him after his morning wake up.  He generally wants to go back down within 1.5 hours.  If I wait or try to extend too long then he cries for nap #1 which usually yields a 35 min nap.  If he goes down not crying then I can usually count on an hour to 1.5 hours. 

Do I make any changes to his feeding schedule?  Right now he is on 4 hours between BFing and he takes a solid meal one hour after BF at 10 and at dinner time. 

Any help would be appreciated.  Thanks!

[sunnysideup850]

I forgot to add, DS is 7.5 months old and has been on EASY since week 3.

[Colesmom]

IMHO i wouldn't extend the first awake time too much as it seems as it's working.  I read in another book that the first nap is an extension of night sleep (more REM) so it's the most important of the day and the awake interval should be the shortest.  If you do, maybe just try 5 minutes for a few days instead of going straight to 15?

Just thought I'd throw that out there.  Of course your lo is 2 months older than mine...so I'm not 100% sure what his awake times should be.

i am interested to see responses so that i'll know when DS is ready to move to 2 naps.  I cannot wait for that day when I can leave the house for more than an hour!


Traci

[Meg's Mom]

HI

Can you post your typical day for me and i can advise better on A times once i have a look.

[sunnysideup850]

Below is her current schedule.  Thanks for offering to help.

5:45-wake
6:00-6:15-breastfeed
6:15-7:30/7:45-play
7:30/7:45-9:00/9:30-nap #1
10:00-10:15-breastfeed
10:15-11:00-play
11:00-11:15-eat fruit and cereal
11:15-12:00/12:15-play
12:00/12:15-2:00/2:15-nap #2
2:00-2:15-breastfeed
2:15-4:15/4:30-play
4:15/4:30-nap #3
awake until bedtimeat 7:30

[Meg's Mom]

Colesmom is correct on the first nap, the A time is usually shorter then the rest of the day.

I am not sure your LO is ready to drop that catnap, have you tried moving it a bit later?  When we were at that stage Megan took her 3rd nap about 5ish, that may help w/ the fighting it.

To be able to do 2 naps you would need to work to a schedule like this:
(adjusting for your wake up time):

7am wakes up - stays awake for 2.5
9:30/10am - 1st nap
11/11:30am wakes up and stays awake for 3 hours
2/2:30pm - 2nd nap
3:30/4pm wakes up and stays awake for 3 hours to 3.5 hours
7/7.30 bed

Hope that helps.

[sunnysideup850]

Thanks Meg's Mom, I appreciate your response.  You are exactly right.  His morning wake-up time and his first A time are not conducive to a 2 nap day.  I have tossed around 2 ideas for adjusting those to help us get there.  I would love to hear opinions, pros and cons, etc. on the following options.

1) When he wakes at his usual time (5:45am) I could keep it really dark and quiet, BF him and put him back hoping he'll go back to sleep for an hour or so.  Then our day would start at 7:00 or so and we could only have 2 naps.  My concern with this is that I am essentially creating a night feeding when he hasn't had one/needed one in six months.

2) I could extend his first A time in hopes of nap #1 starting at 9:00 or so.  But with his current waking time of 5:45 that is 3 hrs of A time first thing in the AM.  His current A time first thing is only 1 hr 45 min and sometimes even that is tough.  Also, when I extend his and miss the window he gets really cranky.  If he cries before naps then they are usually only 35 min naps.  So that defeats the purpose of keeping him awake longer since he will then have a shorter nap and we'll be back in the same position.

I'm really tired of fighting the late afternoon nap.  I've found that he gets cranky around 2.5/3 hours after nap #2, but when I put him in his crib he screams.  When I go in to quiet him he smiles and tries to play.  After a few rounds of this I usually take him out for quiet play and it's like he's gotten a second wind and can go for another hour or so.  The problem is that by then it is 5:30 or so and I know the crib won't work so I am stuck taking him on a car ride or in the carriage for a nap.  I really don't want to be tied to the car or the carriage in order to get him to sleep.

His A time b/t naps 1 and 2 is consistently 3/3.5 hours and his A time before bed has been up to 4 hours so I know he can have long A times, just not after his morning wake up.  Suggestions?

[Aarismom]

You may not like this idea...but I'll post it anyway

General rule about moving from 2 naps to 1 is that you start bedtime earlier. So if he's going to bed about 7:30, then you would probably move bedtime back 1/2 hour to an hour and adjust your day from there. However, I think Meg's mom has a good idea, I'd try that first.

Instead of getting him up for a bf in the am, might you try soothing him back to sleep? Does he cry out for you when he wakes? Can you leave him in his crib until he cries out for you? If you can only get his wake-up time moved to 6:30 or so, that's where I'd set bedtime in the pm for the time being. That way he's getting more sleep at night, and he's not so upset by the afternoon.

Hope this helps!

*HUGS*
Sonya =P

[Meg's Mom]

I don't think #2 is really a good idea just now.  It sounds too much to go from 1.75 to 3hr.

I do think you are on the right track w/ trying to bring his 1st wake up forward. 

I am going to send you a PM on early rising which you will find really helpful.  Also there are a few options w/ this idea:

1) as you said feed when he wakes
2) start a dream feed for a while and see if that helps him sleep later
3) give a feed before bed if you aren't already.  When Megan was this age i did, catnap followed by - E - A of bath - E - S. 

If you decide to go w/ 1) as you posted...don't worry too much about the starting a night feed - HOPEFULLY, he start sleeping later and it will resolve itself.

Hope this helps!

[Paulsmama]

Hi, I was reading this with interest and was wondering what are the signs of getting ready to drop the catnap?  If I could get your opinions on whether you think DS is ready I would really, really appreciate it.

DS is 7 mos and I am now sometimes having to wake him by 3/3:15 in order to fit in a catnap that doesn't mess up bedtime.  I also wake him from his am nap about half the time so he will take a good afternoon nap.  He is getting harder to put down and has occasional nightwakings because of developmental issues (rolling/creeping) and unfortunately we are back to pat/sh some of the time the past couple of weeks.  He seems to be able to handle about 4.25-4.5 hrs combined awake time before his first two naps and about 4.25 hrs combined awake time after that.  So A time is typically 2/2.25/2.25/1.45.  He missed his catnap once last week and was quite fussy and basically passed out after his 7pm bottle, was tired the next day.  I'd love to get rid of the catnap if he doesn't need it because he seems to be really fighting it these days.

Current sleep routine:

7:30/8 wake
9:30/10-11/11:15 nap 1 (sometimes wake him by 11:15)
1:15/1:30-3/3:30 nap 2 (used to wake @3:30 to eat, now catnap too late)
5:15/5:30-6/6:15 catnap (now doesn't want to nap until 5:45)
7:30/8 asleep (past couple of nights 8:30 after 30 min catnap at 5:45)

[Paulsmama]

Wow, sorry if that last post sounded crazy and controlfreaky.  I think I'm too stressed out because my mom is coming to visit next week and she's been pushing me to take away the catnap for the past two months ("He sleeps way too much" -- I wish!).  And because MIL is visiting us this week and DS is overstimulated (as she found out when she spent 40 min trying to get him to take his am nap and couldn't, I finally took him in the closet where he promptly passed out, he had been awake nearly 3 hours).  Anyway, thanks for listening and for any responses.

[Matthew's Mommy]

How is everything going? Any improvements?

[Paulsmama]

Hi, not sure if that was to the OP or me, but our day went a bit better as DS was quite tired after his long morning and managed both a good afternoon nap of nearly 2 hours plus a 40 min catnap.  Bedtime went ok too, but he woke up just before his dreamfeed with a leaky diaper and DH couldn't get him settled after the feed so he was up for over an hour -- I guess he was too excited after sitting on the daybed watching DH clean up after the diaper mess.  He slept in until 8:12 am after that. 

DS has done OK so far today too, 1.25 hr nap in am (woke him up to stay on routine), 1.5 hr in afternoon (woke up on his own), and MIL is offering him his catnap now, so we'll see.

I'm wondering, if he'll nap for 3.5+ hrs combined his first two naps, is it likely that his awake times will naturally stretch to drop the catnap?  I'm sure my mom will want to try this next week, so I was just wondering if anyone had experience with that.  I've just been too chicken to do more than tweak his routine since it had been going so well (thanks to BW!).

[Meg's Mom]

Hi there,
I didn't understand your question...if you still need/would like a reply can you please clarify. 

I'm wondering, if he'll nap for 3.5+ hrs combined his first two naps, is it likely that his awake times will naturally stretch to drop the catnap.

Thanks
PS: if things are well, then don't fix if it isn't broken  :wink:

[Paulsmama]

Thanks.  Sorry for being vague.  My general question is what are the signs that a baby is ready to drop the catnap.

1) DS fights his catnap (but has for a couple of months, and has always ended up sleeping except for a couple of times)
2) Catnap is getting pushed later and pushing bedtime later (by about 1/2 hour now), morning wake time is still the same.
3) Nightwakings, but they have really decreased lately (only one each of past two nights) and I think they were/are developmental/solids-related.

I don't want to mess with a good thing, and I think our routine, with the catnap for now, is pretty good.  I guess I was looking for some information to back up my instinct that the catnap should stay for now, or let me know otherwise if that is not the case. 

MIL (staying with us this week) and my mom (staying with us next two weeks) are critical of the whole routine thing and I've been stressing out.  I'm a first time mom and a bit insecure about it.  They push me to get out of the house (which I'd like to do) and they'll watch the baby, only they don't seem to be able to get DS to take his naps on time (or at all) for whatever reason.  I know my mom has outright said for the past couple of months that DS should not be having a catnap.  She thinks I am crazy to wake him up from his first two naps to stay on routine.  I just don't think he's ready to go 4 hrs of awake time at the end of the day, which is what we'd need to get in 2 feeds and some upright time after his bedtime bottle.  I guess there's no easy answer without trying.  I'll try to get up the willpower to stick to my guns with my mom, it's harder after MIL has worked on me for a week already.

Sorry so long.  Thanks for letting me vent.