Author Topic: Help please re sleep  (Read 2448 times)

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Offline esfm

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Help please re sleep
« on: September 27, 2005, 12:13:54 pm »
Hi everyone.

I have started the EASY 3hr routine with my 12wk old 5 days ago but need help with his napping routine.

We have the feeding routine sorted but when it comes to him having his naps during the day he is only sleeping for 30 to 45 mins at a time, when he wakes I have to do the Shush/Pat routine for 5-10 mins, or the pick up put down/shush/pat for 10 mins, he will go back to sleep but not for long before we have to start the routine again, before we know it, it is time to wake him up for another feed.  Will it get easier as the days go by as I am pulling my hair out, he is sleeping through the night with him waking only one time and he settles with the shush/pat and dummy after about an hour.

Can I use a radio in the room with him to see if this will help settle him back to sleep, there is nothing in the book re this??

Please please help as I am suffering from severe sleep deprivation and I am worried that i am doing something wrong that will hurt my ds.

Thanks in advance

Raquel.

Offline albertasweetpea

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Help please re sleep
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2005, 13:24:20 pm »
Hi Raquel - firstly, congrats for getting started on the BW techniques! My DD is now just over 5 months and I am so thankful I found BW and stuck with the sleep training!
Unfortunately, between 3-4 months was the worst sleeping period for Molly. She rarely took naps longer than 45 minutes and would wake often at night. I never thought I would survive!! The only way I did was to try to keep her to the schedule and get her to bed by 7 pm. That way I could get myself a few hours of sleep before her dream feed. Are you alone? Can you get some help? Everything always seems so much worse when you are missing out on your sleep!  :cry:
When your DS wakes from his nap, do you go straight in to try to get him back to sleep? Have you tried leaving him to fuss it out for a few minutes?
When you put him down to sleep do you shhh/pat him to sleep or put him down and leave him?
I would say go ahead and use a radio or sound machine if you want to! We got one from Walmart for about $20 (it is Conair) and has about 10 different sounds on it. It also shuts off after 60 minutes or you can just leave it on. It saved us when DF had his wisdom teeth out and he couldn't do Shhhhhhhh!  :lol:
Keep doing what you are doing...it will eventually sink in!! Hope something here helps, there are so many knowledgeable Mom's (and Dad's Gareth!) on this site to help you keep your sanity!
Hang in there!
~Michelle (Spruce Grove, AB, Canada)

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Offline esfm

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Help please re sleep
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2005, 17:13:32 pm »
Hi Michelle

Thanks for your support. its nice to know that other mums have been through the same.  I am going to try ds with a radio as he woke earlier with some noise from outside :roll: I will also try leaving him for a few minutes to see if he settles himself.

Again thanks,

Raquel

Offline Noelle

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« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2005, 17:24:01 pm »
Hi Raquel...
A 4hr hour routine is usually recommended at 4months...however, 45 minute naps can be a sign of needing to transition from 3-4 hours and all babies are different.  If you have gotten him back to sleep for a nap, it's usually ok to let him sleep 3.5-4 hours, he might even increase his feed this way too.  I wouldn't let him go past the 4 hour mark though.  It sounds like you are doing a great job  :D

Also, if you like, post your routine and I'll take a look at that too and see if I can see anything...
**Noelle**  Formerly JohnandZoesMom



Offline esfm

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« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2005, 09:22:32 am »
Thanks Noelle

We have him on the 3 hour routine at the moment.  But he was up again all night last night.  We got up at 7am as per our routine, he had his feed and when he finished at 7.30 he started yawning straight away I did his wind down and he started to kick and wave his arms so I put him in his cot and did SHH/pat for 1 hour before he went to sleep, left room and he stirred 20 mins later so tried wake to sleep, had to shh/pat again until 10am, which is his next feed time.

should I be giving him longer activity before his sleep, I am only 5 days into the plan, am I expecting too much too soon??  Please help.

Is there a helpline or anyone in the UK who I could chat too, as i am nearing the end of my tether and really need to talk to someone who has been through this.

R

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« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2005, 19:33:08 pm »
Hi again!  :D
Why don't you go ahead and post your schedule...it's hard to give advice when you can't see  the whole picture  :wink:  :D   Also, does he use a paci or have a lovey?  What is your wind down routine? Is he able to put himself to sleep?

I'm a little confused too,sorry!!  In your first post you had mentioned he wakes once at night?  Has he all of a sudden started waking multiple times at night?  If so, when did it start? Sorry for all the questions, just trying to get a good hold on what is happening.  Thanks!  :D
**Noelle**  Formerly JohnandZoesMom



Offline esfm

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« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2005, 21:11:13 pm »
Hi Again Noelle

I have been posting Raquel's questions while she tells me them down the phone as her computer is caput at the mo.

She is coming here tomorrow without her ds to post all of her questions and routine without the bother of translating what she wants to say down the phone :lol:

Both our boys are the same age, we met in hospital after giving birth within days, but two different babies you have never met :shock:.

Thanks for all your help so far, both Raquel and I appriciate it.

Cheers

Sarah

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Help please re sleep
« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2005, 00:52:39 am »
What a neat way to meet!!!  :D   I'll be here!!!!!
**Noelle**  Formerly JohnandZoesMom



Offline RaquelP

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« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2005, 09:22:07 am »
Thanks Noelle

I have now registered as myself, this is going to be a long one though.

I am doing the 3 hour EASY, I started on Sat 24th Sep, Ross is 13 weeks and weighs 15lb 15oz.

7am Wake & Feed
7.30 Activity
8.00 Take to room Shh/Pat till sleep aprox 30mins
9.00 He crys, go to room shh/pat PU/PD for 1 hr
10.00 Feed
10.30 Activity
11.00 Take to room Shh/Pat till sleep aprox 30mins
12.00 He crys, go to room shh/pat PU/PD for 1 hr
13.00 Feed
13.30 Activity
14.00 Take to room Shh/Pat till sleep aprox 30mins
15.00 He crys, go to room shh/pat PU/PD for 1 hr
16.00 Feed
16.30 Activity
18.00 Feed
18.30 Bath
19.00 Bed
22.00 Dreamfeed

This is the routine that we try to stick to everyday.  Some nights he has only woken once but others he has been up all night. 

We started on the Sat, Wed he was up all night, on Wed we started waiting before going in when he stirred at naptime to see if he settled himself, he wouldn't.  On Thurs we tried the wake to sleep method 1st time didn't work still had to do shh/pat pu/pd but 2nd time it did work and he napped for another 30mins but had to stay in room.  Last night he would not go down at 19.00 he was relaxed did shh/pat but as soon as I put him on his back he woke up, he didn't cry but would not sleep until 21.00 I dreamfed at 22.00 he went back down no problem, then he stirred at 4.50 he settled himself til 5.30 settled again til 6.00 he cryed out went in and he was dirty so changed him quietly put him back in cot and he screamed, had to do shh/pat pu/pd till 7.00.

I have some questions if thats ok. :roll:  :roll:

Feed - before routine he was b/f mainly but had 2 bottles a day, we have now got him on bottles full time, will this have unsettled him??

Activity - I put him on activity mat for 15mins then talk to him on lap for 15mins quietly then we move to bedroom an my lap until he shows tired signs then put down he crys then I shh/pat till he sleeps, is this ok??

Wake to Sleep - Leave room when in 1st deep sleep, go back in after 30mins or if he sighs, I then pat his shoulder/rub belly until his eyes open, then i put him on his side and shh/pat gently until he goes back to sleep.  Sometime he will fight me and it take longer with shh/pat so am firmer, is this right??  How long should I continue doing wake to sleep??

Can I leave him to sleep on his side during his day naps as he seems happier??  I do use a paci but not all the time, only when he is inconsolable.

I am a wreck and feel that its not working and feel like giving up, my partner can't cope with the crying, my Mum has been helping out but cannot keep asking her as she works full time.

As I don't have full access to a computer, could I have contact by phone with someone just to talk as feel very alone, I don't mind ringing America.

My doctor has said that my health cannot take the stress of the new routine and I have to stop if he doesn't settle soon, but I am worried that I will do more harm than good by changing he routine again and again.

Sorry to go on but really need help as he didn't have a routine before and he was not happy and I don't want to regress back to there after starting EASY.

PLEASE HELP.

Thanks, Raquel

Offline Noelle

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« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2005, 00:55:13 am »
Ok...first thing I want to let you know is that I'm working on finding someone to talk to you from the UK  :D

Since you started on the 24th, bumps in the road are to be expected.  Do you have Tracy's 3rd book?  If not...highly recommend with lots of step by step instructions  :D

Prior to starting EASY...how was he put to sleep?  Rocked? Fed? on his own?  This might depend too on the first steps we take to get him to take better naps.  Just guessing here but it seems as if he doesn't know how to put himself to sleep yet, causing most of the sleep problems.  It can take a few weeks for him to learn...and if you get a chance, check out the nap forum...there is TONS of information there.

One thing that did stand out from your schedule is that it looks like he only getting the 30 minute nap...you are doing pat/ssh pu/pd to extend it which is good.  What I suggest though, until the naps start sorting themselves out, you are probably going to have to tweak a bit which is perfectly OK!!! The main thing of EASY is to help to not feed to sleep to avoid overeating/snacking and establish a routine, making reading your babies cues much easier  :D

7am Wake & Feed
7.30 Activity
8.00 Take to room Shh/Pat till sleep aprox 30mins
9.00 He crys, go to room shh/pat PU/PD for 1 hr
10.00 Feed
10.30 Activity
11.00 Take to room Shh/Pat till sleep aprox 30mins


If I read this right..he wakes up 7, falls asleep around 8:30 and sleeps until 9..given you can't get him back to sleep?  In this case, is he showing tired signs at 10 or so?  If he is, it's ok to put him down right after a feed, just try not to feed him asleep.  Also, if he his having erratic naps, it's ok to let him go past the 3 hour mark now and again to get that extra sleep.  EASY is pretty flexible really.

Also, if the pat/ssh and pu/pd is wearing/stressing you out - you don't HAVE to do it.  With my second I just went with the flow...if she woke up early and I couldn't get her back to sleep within 20 minutes, I just got her up and went on with the routine.  It was much less stressful for me.


Feed - before routine he was b/f mainly but had 2 bottles a day, we have now got him on bottles full time, will this have unsettled him??
I don't think so....is there any chance he has reflux...does it seem like he wakes from pain?

Activity - I put him on activity mat for 15mins then talk to him on lap for 15mins quietly then we move to bedroom an my lap until he shows tired signs then put down he crys then I shh/pat till he sleeps, is this ok??  This sounds perfectly ok  :D

Wake to Sleep - Leave room when in 1st deep sleep, go back in after 30mins or if he sighs, I then pat his shoulder/rub belly until his eyes open, then i put him on his side and shh/pat gently until he goes back to sleep.  Sometime he will fight me and it take longer with shh/pat so am firmer, is this right??  How long should I continue doing wake to sleep??
I've never done wake to sleep...but I believe that you just rub/pat until he stirs vs until he opens his eyes and then leave...he should put himself back to sleep.  I think too, wake to sleep is usually used for night wakings...you should do it consistently for 3 days waking him an hour before they usually wake.

Can I leave him to sleep on his side during his day naps as he seems happier??  I do use a paci but not all the time, only when he is inconsolable.  Absolutely.

I am a wreck and feel that its not working and feel like giving up, my partner can't cope with the crying, my Mum has been helping out but cannot keep asking her as she works full time.  Hang in there...you've just started.  He's had 3 months of one way and switching to another, it will take a few days  :wink:  :D   Take some deep breaths, relax and go with the flow.  Try to use the clock loosely, not as a definite  :D


Sorry to go on but really need help as he didn't have a routine before and he was not happy and I don't want to regress back to there after starting EASY.

PLEASE HELP.

No problem at all...I just hope I/we can help some  :D

You're doing great so far...{{HUGS}}
**Noelle**  Formerly JohnandZoesMom



Offline mum of three

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Help please re sleep
« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2005, 01:52:24 am »
Hi i to am having trouble with my daughters napping, shes all mixed up and i do blame myself as to not being consistent enough.

The only thing that is consistent is her bed time, and her feeds use to be but i think she is trying to work out her schedule changing from 3 hourly to 4 hourly. Shes all over the place. Sometimes she drinks all her bottle on 3 hourly and sometimes leaves over a quater to half.

I just put her down for a sleep and she woke after half an hour and i tried to resettle her. I've been in her room 3 times and now she has gone back to sleep. I'm trying to get her to sleep an hour and a half to 2 hours.

She also uses a dummy thou last night she got put down awake (usually let her fall asleep then put her to bed) without her dummy and she went to sleep without a whimper. She fed at 7pm first. She woke again at 2.30am so i gave her a bottle. (she has slept from 7pm til 6.30am 3 days in a row once but i knew that wouldn't last but was happy when she did it.
I don't give her a dream feed as i don't want to disturb her and she doesnt drink it all either. Should i try and wean her of her dummy as she wants it in the middle of the night.
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mum to Joshua d.o.b 10 of Nov 2000
mum to Hayley d.o.b 17 of June 2005

Offline Noelle

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« Reply #11 on: October 01, 2005, 02:32:59 am »
Hi,
EASY is flexible, but being consistent is an important part  :D   Here is a link in regards to moving from 3-4 hours.  If you don't have Tracy's 3rd book I highly recommend it...it has lots of how/what/why and instructions  :D

Here are some signs of needing to transition:
1. Not taking as much at a feed (baby not as hungry at 3 hours)
2. Erratic Night Wakings
3. They are extending their awake times
4. Starts taking 45 minute naps


How does she get to sleep normally? Is she only waking the one time in the night?

 :D
**Noelle**  Formerly JohnandZoesMom



Offline RaquelP

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« Reply #12 on: October 03, 2005, 10:47:52 am »
Dear all, Still having problems!! As just started over a week ago on the 3 hour easy, would you advise going straight on to four? As not getting past 45 min nap without my help.Does seem to get tired though 45 mins after feed has yawn! do I have to keep him up or what?
This morning he stirred at 4.00 put his self  back by 4.50 then woke at 6.00 and could tell it was a hungry cry so feed at 6.15,scoffed 8 oz then by 7.30 he was in bed zonked!! We went back up half hour later he came semi out of sleep and then went back down till 9.20am. kept him quiet on shoulder till 10.00am is this right?? then we fed at 10.00 scoffed 8oz again and that is different than other days as he has messed with bottle.
How long do we keep up wake  to sleep?already been doing this 5 days he is tired when he goes back to sleep!
Really struggling dont know how many more days can keep this up.
ps also in evening after bath seem to be having problem then all the one's in days the first put down is easy.
Do we need to do wake to sleep at his 7.00 one.
Do i still have to stick to 7.00 feed in morning.