Tired signs - are they for real? (LONG!)

[Luisasmum]

My 10.5 month old has always hated going to sleep. As soon as I start the nap time or bed time routine, she starts crying and struggling. Apparently babies thrive on routine?? Well, this one doesn't seem to.

This last 5 days I have really tried to read her a bit better as I thought maybe I had missed a little yawn or a rub of the eyes and she was just over tired. So at the slightest rub of the eyes or the thumb in the mouth, I start putting her down for her sleep.  Then comes the screaming. When I look at her, she is clearly not ready but I persist. She yawned, rubbed her eyes so she must be tired, right?

This morning she woke at 5:45am and had her formula. At 6:45am, she rubbed her eyes and started sucking her thumb so I put her down for a sleep. Pat/sh seemed to stimulate her, as did pu/pd, so I left her. She cried for almost 10 mins and is now asleep.

Now, the crying I guess is normal as I have only been doing the "right thing" for 5 days (and she is getting slightly better, I must say). My question is, she has been showing tired signs after about 1.5 hours awake time so I put her to bed. Surely she can't be tired after 1.5 hours at almost 11 months? And if she is, that would mean she would be having 3 naps a day instead of the recommended 2. She isn't on a strict time schedule because she is so erratic and unpredictable and believe me I have tried! Now I just do everything in the same order to try and get some sort of routine in her life. So is that my problem? Do I need to try harder at the schedule thiing, or could I be over stimulating her and that's why she gets tired sooner? :?

[Maddy's Mum]

HI there,

I think she sounds like she is overtired at the moment, hence why she is only able to have 1.5 hours awake time - could you tell us a bit more about your routine - is she on a version of EASY? i.e not feeding to sleep? How has she gone down for naps/sleep up until now? You could also be dealing with multiple issues at 10 months because she could be feeling some seperation anxiety, so I would urge you to stay with her and comfort her if she cries when she is going to sleep - negative sleep associations at this age can be a long process to sort out.

I think the best thing I did, when sleep training Mads was to have a couple of weeks where I just concentrated on getting her on a routine and sleep trained, we didn't go out around nap times so that she would learn to sleep in the crib and not pushchair/car seat and the consistency helped alot.

I think if you could work on gently extending her awake time ( I found doing a new activity with Mads would keep her active and awake a bit longer) and implement PU/PD consistently, you would see a huge improvement.

Dee
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[Mom to M&M]

I've often wondered the same thing, although my DD is only 11 weeks old. She is also on a four hour schedule (her own wish) and sometimes starts to yawn or rub eyes after only up 45 minutes. However, she seems to be able to stay up for between 1 1/4- 1 1/2 hours before sleeping and still nap well. So should I be acting on the first yawn or eye rub and putting her in crib (or wherever I plan for her to take that nap)? Or just change then to a different and less stimulating activity and see if that helps? It's so hard to know.

Karen

[Luisasmum]

Thanks for the reply, Dee.

From about 8 months up until now I have been keeping her awake for 2.5/3 hours and waking her up (gently of course!) after 1.5 hours sleep just to try and get her into a 2 nap routine but I was having trouble getting her to go to sleep so I resorted back to a 3 nap plan. This is what we are trying now:

She wakes anywhere between 5.00am and 6.30am but I will work with 6.00am for now...

6.00am Awake - formula
7.00am Tired signs so put down for a sleep
9.00am Awake - breakfast
10.30am Tired signs so put down for a sleep
12.30pm Awake - Lunch and formula
2.00pm Tired signs so put down for a sleep
4.30pm Awake - dinner and formula
5.30 Bath
6.00 Bedtime

Which works fine for me but she just won't go to sleep unless I pat/sh. Sometimes pu/pd works well too and sometimes nothing works. When I was doing the 2 nap routine, I would get a week where she would go to sleep by herself, then another tooth would come along and/or she would get sick. Then I would have to start again.

I think I will try what you say and extend the awake time to 2 hours. Anyway, I guess I shouldn't worry about it too much. Next thing I know those first molars will come through and we'll have to start again.

Karen, I was thinking last night, I often yawn and rub my eyes 45 mins after I wake up because of broken sleep (thanks dd and dh!) so I thought maybe babies who have had a less than good nap would do the same? Who knows! I wonder if men have the same trouble trying to work women out!

[Mom to M&M]

I know - I was thinking that too with the yawning and eye rubbing. But does that mean she is still tired and I should have left her sleep longer or that she needs to go back down sooner?

[Jack's Mummy]

Hello everybody - this is my first message but certainly not my first visit to the site!  I live in Auckland, New Zealand with my husband and 8month old boy.  I'm having similar problems lately.  Jack's getting up and then sometimes as early as 45 mins he's rubbing his eyes and yawning again!  I can keep him going longer ie 2 1/2 hours but these days he doesn't laugh as much and always seems tired and grumpy.  Grizzling etc and it's really hard to deal with. I'd love some ideas on what could be the problem.  I'm still breastfeeding 4 times a day and solids (about 1/3 cup) 3 times a day.
 :?: 

[Luisasmum]

Well, I have been trying really, really, really hard to watch my daughter every second and make note of EVERYTHING she does as the 1h 30m mark approaches and I've managed to work out her subtle clues!! For this week anyway! Last two days she has gone down without even a whimper and she was sort of jumping out of my arms into the cot if I tried to give her a cuddle before her nap.

Anyway, thanks ladies once again for your helpful advice and comments. Don't know what I would do with out you BWs.

To Marisa Mum, after my rather obsessive and intense observations of my dd in the last few days, I decided that the early eye rubbing was kind of like a wake up thing for her. Even when she had slept for 3 hours, she was still doing it not long after she woke up. One nap she only slept for 1.5 hours and was rubbing her eyes 1 hour after she woke so I tried putting her in bed and she wasn't ready. 1 hour later she was rubbing her eyes again and when I put her to bed she went off straight away. Kids :roll:! and ya know, we spend all this effort trying to get our babies to bed and when they become teenagers, we will be forever trying to get them OUT of bed!

[Maddy's Mum]

Well done you  :lol:   :lol:   :lol:

Dee
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