How much EBM should 17 week old need???

[Sabine]

My 17 week old is currently 18lbs and 70cm long...he was a 10lb baby.  He has been EBF from birth.  BF him has not been easy..reflux, nursing strikes etc.  I still have him on 3hr EASY but I am wondering if I need to stretch his feeds.

This is my dilemma...if I don't feed him right when he wakes from his nap he will only take a few gulps and pop off and look around.  I have tried to feed in the dark, quiet etc.  This doesn't work only if I feed right after a nap.  I have tried to stretch to 3.5 and even 4hrs but he will be so distracted and not eat. He is still waking 2-3 times per night to nurse (i figure b/c he doesn't take enough cals during the day).  I have tried the DF and CF but either don't work for him and he won't stay on long enough to feed for the CF.  Should I not be feeding him at night so he is forced to take more during the day (I feel bad doing this).

 He isn't the type to cry either (ie. when hungry) so it has been very difficult for me to read his cues.  I too will be going back to work soon and will need to introduce a bottle which I am not looking forward to.  We  have tried giving him several bottles before DH to do feeds and he likes the Avent but will only take 2oz and no more. 

I don't know what to do....HELP.

S

[GraceKellysmom]

Wow, he sounds absolutely normal!  :wink:

Keep on working with him, this is the peak of the distracted age. He will start nursing better for you again, just give him time. As for the nightwakings, feed him if he is hungry. He is likely waking for developmental reasons and realizes he is hungry. You can try posting in the nightwakings forum for more advice on how to get him to sleep without feeding if you think he isn't hungry.

And the bottles, when will you return to work? It is funny, most babies come to realize "hey that's my food!" and will eat from a bottle fine for a care provider. The first few days will be tough on both of you, but it will improve.

[annamum]

Normally babies his age drink between 19 to 32 oz per 24 hours. And this amount stays more or less same till they are 6 months old. How much he is actually taking at one feed is hard to say but I would probably prepare a few bottles of EBM 3 oz each for his caregiver. He may easily take a bottle from another person once he realizes you are not around.

As for nightwakings, if you are thinking he is really hungry, and that would translate to ravenous and longer feeds, I would feed him. THis age is typical for distracted feeds during a day and making it up at night. He will grow out of that, but yes, I can commiserate with you for what you are going through right now.

There is also a thing, if he is going to have bottles, he may be drinking and be "active" at the same time, he may actually increase his intake because he won't be tied down by nursing, just a thought.

[Sabine]

Thanks for the replies...

Here's an update...today I BF only once at night the other two times he woke he was able to self soothe.  I did a DF at 1030 and he woke at 330 and downed both breasts.  He woke again at 645 and gulped down my R breast. 

I have started expressing during the day and can get anywhere from 4.5-8 oz from both breasts.  I fed him the bottle 3 times.  First time he took 4.5 oz.  Initially he took 3 and it took me another 1/2 hour of trying before he took more.  The next feed he took 5 oz again 4 okay but the last oz he was frustrated with.  The last feed he took 4 oz and then I changed his nappie and he unwillingly took another 2 oz.  His naps today have been great too!!!  He slept 2 hrs b/w feeds (ie.  4hrs b/w feed times).  I feel as though the last oz or two I am forcing the bottle...he needs the cals though I think. 

Please help...I am very unhappy :cry: .

Also, I had been single side feeding and now I am pumping both sides...if I nurse him at night and in the morning (which I plan to do) is this going to affect my supply at all.  He is so distracted I doubt he will nurse long enough to take both sides

S

[GraceKellysmom]

Please help...I am very unhappy :cry: .

Forgive me for being daft, but why? He sounds like he is doing great with the bottles. This type of thing doesn't happen overnight, it is an adjustment for both of you.

Are you sad about going back to work? When do you return? Will you be full time or part time, days or shift?

Supply can be tricky when you are pumping for most of the feeds. We have moms on the board to help and support you, they've done great with pumping and have kept up nursing. See the post : "I made it a year!" by Melissa, what an inspiration she is.

[annamum]

Sabine,

why are you unhappy? Because you are going back to work? I can understand that...

Let us know what how we can help  .

[Sabine]

I should clarify...I am sad b/c I feel I am forcing the last few oz. of milk on him.  Should I strat to stretch his feeds to 4hrs in hopes he will take more???  He is a big boy...18lbs and I find it hard to believe he can survive on 4 oz every 4 hrs.  He has 6 feeds a day so that would be 24oz by bottle...I don't think that is enough.

This am I fed from bottle..took 4.5 oz and refuserd the rest.  Tried rewarming, warming teat..no avail but would search for breast.

Advice please...

S

[Sabine]

I should add there is a baby across the road who is 2 mo old, 9lbs and takes 5-8 oz EBM beautifully.  I shouldn't compare babies but he is sooo much bigger.

[Erin (redstarfalling)]

I know it's hard not to compare!  It really sounds like he's doing well, though... 4.5 oz at a feed is great - you breast milk changes as he gets older...he's probably getting what he needs. As long as everything else is going well and weight gain is good, I would try not to worry too much about the last oz or 2 in the bottle... It's a distractible age! :roll: But he'll likely nurse more out than you think.

[Sabine]

Here is the latest...

He is taking the Playtex bottles and nips well   .
The only thing is that he is taking only 3-4 oz at a feed.  He gets 3 bottles during the day.  I top him up before bed and he takes a DF of 6.5-7.0z every night.  I also BF him when he wakes...he has been sleeping through the last two nights 11-5 or 6 am.  I am not complaining. 

I know the BW book said that each baby needs b/w 5-8 oz per feed and I am afraid he isn't getting enough.  He clearly takes the bottle well but will fuss and turn his head when he is full and that may only be after 3-4 oz.  He is feeding every 3.5 hours now.

Should I be worried or is my milk such that he doesn' t need more than this??  I think with his size (18 lbs) he needs more. 

Sabine

[Sabine]

I have been pumping for the feeds and taking herbs to keep my supply up and have been successfully pumping 5-7 oz each feed from both breasts.  The sleep must be helping.   

[annamum]

I really think that breastfed babies know how much they need. Usually formula fed babies are prompted to have some more to eat one more oz or to finish the bottle while nursed infants finish when they are done. Don't worry about it, he knows the best. Don't try to push one more oz into him, he needs to trust his own instincts, his own judgement when he is full.
I read an article some time ago about parents making their infants take more food in an early age, it backfired later, when babies became toddlers they were too fat, eating too much because their natural feeling when they are full was not there. Not a surprising thing, if you think about it.

[kzener]

According to this article on the Kellymom.com site, babies generally take in 25 ounces a day, but just alter it.

http://www.kellymom.com/bf/pumping/milkcalc.html

If that is the case, it sounds like your baby is doing great.  Especially if he is getting a pretty large feed before bedtime.

See this index of related topics..I found these to really help me with working, pumping and all the logistics:

http://www.kellymom.com/bf/supply/index.html

[Sabine]

Thanks for the replies and helpful websites...my lo will take on avg 25 oz so I guess he is within the normal range.  Is it possible he doesn't need more than 4 oz a feed because of my milk composition???

Right now this is how I am feeding him

6am BF ~30 min to feed both sides
930-10 bottle ~ 4oz
130 ~ 4 oz
430-5 ~ 4-5 oz
7 bath, top up BF
11 pm DF by dh takes ~6.5-7 oz

Sleeps until 6 am.

Does this look okay??
I am thinking he is probably getting 25-27 oz per day.

Sabine