Oh no! Now naps too

[Claire Marie's mommy]

Hi all, I have been working on night sleep with my just turned 7 mo old for about 3 weeks with some success.  Now though, we are struggling with naps!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  I think all of the attention she has been getting at night is affecting her naps.  Now she needs help to go down and stay down at naps!  This started about 3 days ago, and today it has happened with every nap.  Do you think this is because she thinks she needs my help? She has been able to put herself to sleep for naps for about 4 months now.  OR could this be a need to lengthen A time.  She is still on 2 naps + catnap.  1st A time has been 2 hours.  2nd has been 2 hours 20 min, and 3rd has been about 2 hours 30 min.  I'm sooo confused!  Her sleepy cues are hard to read.  When I start the windown, she begins to act sleepy.  Maybe this is just a conditioned response?  Any advice will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Jessica

[Meg's Mom]

Hi Jessica

*I think all of the attention she has been getting at night is affecting her naps*
What do you mean?

*Now she needs help to go down and stay down at naps! *
Please tell me more, what does she do and you do exactly?

Also
Please tell me in this order i know you said in your post but i need to my LO up and this is clearer for me.
Bedtime ________

Awake _________

1st nap _________ for ________ long

2nd nap _________ for ________ long

3rd nap ________ for _________ long

Once I get some info we can go from there.

[Claire Marie's mommy]

Michelle, Thanks for replying so quickly.

"getting attention at night" - I've been trying to quit feeding her back to sleep when she wakes at night.  PU/PD doesn't work for us, so my husband and I have been patting her back to sleep.  It has been a LONG couple of weeks, as some nights she was waking 5 or 6 times, but now we are getting to the point where we can pat for a few min. and she will go back down.  Sometimes she wakes after 20min and we have to start all over.  We're trying to get to the point where we can leave the room when she is still awake.

"needing help to go down and stay down at naps" - We went through sleep training for naps about 3 months ago and she has been able to put herself to sleep and stay asleep for 1 hr. - 1.5 hours.  About 3 days ago, she started waking at the 40 min. mark and I would go in and pat her (just like at night), and she'd go back to sleep.  Today, she is waking at 20 min., then again at 30 min, and then won't go back to sleep!!!!!  She also keeps checking to make sure that I am still there. 

Bedtime - 7 or 7:30.  Used to be earlier, but we have seen less night wakings if we put her to bed after 7.  Don't know if this is a coincidence or not.

Awake - Usually for the day between 6  and 7 am.

Nap 1 - asleep about 2 hours after wake, so somewhere between 8 and 9 am.   Will sleep anywhere from 1 hr. to 1.5 hours

Nap 2 - asleep about 2hours and 15 min. after wake from nap 1, so somewhere between 11:30 and 12:30.  If nap 1 was short, this one is usually longer (but never over 1 hour 45 min.).  If nap 1 was long, this one is usually shorter.

Nap 3 - asleep about 2 hours and 20 min. after last wake, so somewhere between 3:45 and 4:30.  If other naps were short, this one can be an hour, but usually only 40 min.  Sometimes, won't take at all and I rock her for 20 min or so.  If this happens, bedtime gets moved up by about 1/2 hour.

I hope this is enough information.  Thanks again for your help.  She has been kind of clingy lately, so I don't know if this is some separation anxiety or what.  It just seems that since we started the night work, that she is needing more help during the day.   I'm not sure how to handle it.

Jessica

[Meg's Mom]

Jessica

Let me read over your additional information tomorrow when i am not tired.  But i will say, that i am reminded of when we had to do some serious sleep training w/ my LO at 7mos.  I think I was helping her too much and not giving her the chance to settle on her own.  Not CIO or CC, but listening really hard to her cry's and if a moan or mantra as Tracy called it, then leaving her to do "do her thing".  Giving her the chance to settle her self and not going in to help her w/ shh/pat. 

Does this sound as if it might be true in your house?

[Meg's Mom]

Do you think this is because she thinks she needs my help? She has been able to put herself to sleep for naps for about 4 months now. OR could this be a need to lengthen A time.

Hi again,

Well done on quitting that feed to sleep at night! 

It sounds like everything else is fine for naps and that is time to start preparing her to drop that catnap, you said she was refusing it some days too.

The A times for 6-8 month old are:

2.5 after am wake up – nap usually 1.5-2.0hr in length
2-3hr after end of am nap – nap same as above

So a routine something like this - adjusted for your wake up time:
7am wake
9.30 am nap – wake no later then 11am

1.00 or 2.00 pm nap – wake no later then 4pm
7.00 – 7.30 bed

That should help those short naps.  Also, you may need to help her a bit at first, and then it should be back to normal.  Give lots of cuddles and 1to1 time during the day to help w/ the separation anxiety.

So gradually increase her A time, 15min every couple days and let us know how it goes.

Hope that helps.

[Claire Marie's mommy]

Thanks Michelle.  I'll give this a try and see if it helps.  I also think you're point about not going in to early is right on.  I was just afraid that if this was some separation anxiety, that leaving her to fuss too long would only make it worse, but I think giving extra attention during awake time is a good point.   Also regarding the awake time before nap 1:  Today she woke at 5:50 am :? .  She wasn't keen on going back down, so I got her up and we did our normal thing, except she was ready to go down after only 1.5 hours.  She then had an almost 2 hour nap.  Do you think this means that she needs to sleep in a little more?  She had just about 11 hours of sleep.  Any thoughts on that? 

Thanks again
Jessica

[Meg's Mom]

Sorry for the late reply w/ Thanksgiving and the memoral for Tracy.

To answer your question:
She could have a restless nights sleep, but with that said - some kiddios prefer a shorter A time before the 1st nap of the day.  So i would follow her lead, but if those short naps occur then extend A time.

Here is what Ferber states as typical sleep for 6mos old:
Night =   11
naps = 3 1/4 (2 naps)

total = 14 1/2