Miserable with nap extensions

[FreddieEden]

  Hi there,

Hoping someone could offer me some sort of hope (or at least sympathy).

My DS, Daniel, is three months old and has been on a three hour EASY type routine since about three weeks.  He has been 45 minute napping since he was about 7 or 8 weeks.  He is not really a shh pat kind of baby (it seems to distract him) and unless he is really upset and overtired the best way to get him to sleep is simply to leave him in his cot and he will grizzle for a bit and then go to sleep.

At first, I was able to extend the naps simply by waiting to hear him grizzle at the 45 minute mark then going in and giving him the dummy - it took a couple of goes but normally worked and he would then nap for two hours plus.  Then it took me staying in the room avoiding eye contact with my hand on his chest holding the dummy for about half an hour and I would get another 45 minutes.  Now nothing works - he just wakes up, whether I go in before or after he has actually woken up, is full of smiles and ready to get up.  But 20 minutes later, he is very upset and tired and won't go back to sleep.  I have been trying to keep him calm until the next feed, feeding him and then putting him back down (still awake).  But he is so tired and unhappy and this has a knock on effect for the nights as he always has a bad night if he has not had enough daytime sleep.

 He has just had a couple of particularly bad nights (seems to have regressed a bit when he used to be good at putting himself back to sleep at night) and because he can't compensate for it with his daytime sleep the last couple of days have been really miserable for both of us.  He is so tired that it is taking him thirty minutes plus to get to sleep, whereas when he is well rested he will be off in ten minutes or so.  It makes it really difficult for me to go anywhere as his awake period is so short (and as he gets older he seems to find it more difficult to sleep in the buggy or the sling).  And it is a shame for him as he is so keen to discover the world but so affected by his tiredness.  He is always smiling and talking through his tired cries and yawns.

I don't swaddle as I didn't feel it made a difference, I was worried about cot death and because he is starting to suck on his fingers, which I am keen to encourage as a dummy substitute.  I don't use white noise because I didn't think it made a difference and watching him stir around the 45 minute mark it isn't the noise which is causing the stirring.  The room is darkened, though I don't think that is particularly the issue as he still does his 45 minute naps at the end of the day when it is dark outside.  Difficult to post any kind of schedule because it all depends on when he gets up (early waking is part of the night problems when he doesn't have enough daytime sleep).  Basically it starts off with a feed and an hour and a half of wake time and then starts to go wrong from there on.  Bedtime is always between six and seven, which must be the right time for him biologically as he never does the 45 minute wake up after six o'clock.  It will need to be later when he is seven months as he will start nursery then and won't be picked up till six (but we can deal with that as and when...).

Better go - he is stirring.

Freddie

[tracefo]

You have just posted the story of our lives!  I wish I could offer you some hope but....my daughter is now 4 months and still doing the same thing.  I think you could try to extend the feed times maybe to 3.5 hours and then maybe there will be enough time between feeds to get in another cat nap.  I try to go out after the first cat nap even if it is just for a walk so that she is not being too active.  You could also try extending the first activity time so that at least the 45 minute nap comes closer to the second feed time.  I don't know if that helps at all but I really think this is just a developmental thing they will grow out of and I try to get in as many 45 minute naps as I can!  If nothing else, your not alone!
Tracey

[mommyof2boys]

I totally understand what you're going through.  My little guy is almost 16 weeks and we're going through similar issues.  He used to take great naps, but now almost always wakes up after 40 minutes to one hour.  I've been using the pacifier (sometimes 4x within half an hour) to extend the naps, but that only works part of the time.

Nights have gone bad recently too--four wakeups three nights ago, then 2 for the past couple of nights.  I'm wondering if he's waking up thinking he needs that pacifier to go back to sleep?  He's also coming unswaddled which wakes him up; how does one stop swaddling, anyway?

Let us know how it goes today--perhaps try limiting the wake time to an hour and 15 or 20 minutes.  That's what my little guy does.  Also, try just an hour or an hour and 10 before the morning nap.  I've read several places that this makes a difference, and it seems to with my guy--at least sometimes.

[TnTsmama]

Oh my gosh, you just described my 11 week old to a tee!  I have almost the exact same issues.  We are on a loose 2 1/2 hour easy, and I can't for the life of me get past those 45 minute naps.  To top it off, he won't take a paci at all!  Spits it right out!  So, I just try to get in as many 45 minute naps as I can for now.  Otherwise I end up at the end of the evening with a very overtired baby who ends up just screaming himself to sleep in my arms!  Very miserable for mommy and baby.  He is touchy, and pat/ssh seems to distract him as well at this point, so I just lay my hand on his chest to calm him if I can.  He also turns in for the night at around 6-7ish, and that seems to be it for him, until about midnight, when he wakes hungry.  I am desperate for help, too!  Totally unsure as to what to do next, except to just go with it and hope for the best!
I am curious, do you do a dreamfeed?  How long of a stretch is the night sleep?  I can certainly sympathize and will be looking for advice as well!  Good luck!

[FreddieEden]

We have had a better couple of days (and a better night last night) so I think maybe some of the stress of the really miserable couple of days might have been development or a growth spurt or something like that.  There is just no pattern to the nights.  We used to do a dreamfeed between 10 and 11 but I dropped that when the daytime sleep got really bad as I just thought I didn't want to interfere with any decent stretch of sleep he was getting.  For a while he was waking up at 11 or 12 and then again any time from 3 onwards, sometimes as late as 6.30.  Last week, he teased us by doing three nights in a row where he did a continuous stretch of 8 to 10 hours from bedtime onwards but then followed that with some of his worst nights ever, waking up three or four times.  So frustrating when I know he can do it!  I think he is easily capable of going 3 and a half or 4 hours between feeds as he has done it the times I have got in an extra nap and he is huge (sixteen pounds four ounces at three months - all on mummy milk).  But, if he is still refusing to take his nap by the time it is three hours since the last feed then I start to feel guilt about whether he is not settling because he is hungry (and a breastfeed often tips him over the edge to sleep, though that's not very Baby Whisperer!).  I keep hoping it will all pass and clinging to the magic four months when he is supposed to have organised his daytime sleep but also I keep hearing of people whose children didn't sort it out till six months or even nine months...

[Matka]

I know right where your at, sister!  ds is 3 months and the 45 min naps are making me crazy!  It's so hard to get anything done when every ten min. I'm up trying to give his paci or shhh/pat.  How can anyone only sleep for 10 min. at a time?  I'm glad he's sleeping through the night.  You're not alone.  Hopefully, we will all get through this together.

Sending you a (((((Big Hug))))!

Kathy-Ann

[FreddieEden]

Oh dear, another bad night.  He was up at 6 yesterday ready to start the day, which made me think at least we would be sure to get five naps in.  But he refused the last nap, even though I kept him going till bedtime (he was shouting with his eyes shut - really odd).  So by the time he went to bed, he had been up for three hours and was so exhausted that he zonked out on the breast.  But, predictably, overtired baby led to waking up at 10 o'clock, when I fed him even though he wasn't that interested, then at 1.30 and then at 6.  At six I fed him and put him back down and refused to let him up, he slept till 7.45 but I think he just took till 7 to go back to sleep and then did 45 minutes     Is just about to finish his first nap (9.45 our time) which he fought really badly.  I am going to take him to church even though he will probably be cross and tired as I just feel life has to go on.  I don't know if this sleep fighting is to do with being three months and that much more aware that there are exciting alternatives to sleep.  Oh for one of those babies that just drift off in their parents arms...

[corrina01]

I just wanted to reply it does get better believe me.  My DD is just over 5 months, and all parents battle with 45 min naps.  My DD was nearly 4 months when she started to extend naps. 

Her awake time is 1.30hr, when she goes down for a nap, she wakes up at the 40min mark, I put the dummy in her mouth, then walk out into our bedroom, if she spits it out I don't go right in, I wait until she starts fussing then I go back put it in, then she starts to go back to sleep.  All in all its takes about 5 - 10 mins.  At the dinnertime nap she goes right through for 2 hrs.

So it does get better, once you have battled the daytime sleeps the nights get a whole lot better.   

[Mia & Scarlett's Mummy]

Hello

I too just wanted to offer you some hope. My dd is 14 weeks now and has just started to extend her naps past the 45 minute mark....and do you know what I did in order for her to do it?  I listened to my instinct and backed right off.   She was and is a brilliant sleeper at night but I was the one having sleepless nights worrying about her not getting enough daytime sleep!! 

After driving myself bonkers for a couple of weeks and spending every waking moment in her darkened room doing shush/pat, wake to sleep etc I finally called my hv in tears and she told me it was only a problem if I let it be a problem.  She also told me it is developmental (something I have also read on this site) and they sort themselves out eventually.

Anyway what seems to have happened with Mia is that she's become alot more active in the past week - lots of kicking and she's just started rolling onto her side plus she's babbling away like never before.  All this I think has worn her out and she is naturally napping longer.  Granted when she was 45 minute napping she was exhausted by the end of the day like your LO and would often scream herself to sleep which is heartbreaking.  But I think even though she was tired it was just from taking in her environment and being a baby.....now she is wearing herself out and needs longer daytime sleep, hence a natural progression.

The other thing is when I tried to intervene and was trying to extend her naps she became very upset and developed a bit of a cot and nap phobia, a very upsetting time indeed.

I think this site is fantastic and a huge support.  I am also a huge fan of baby whispering, through reading tracys books I have a happy little girl who sleeps through the night.  But I am also a huge believer in my own instinct.  What works for one mom may or may not work for you and your baby.....It instinctively felt right to back off from Mia.  By following tracys advice on wind down routines for naps Mia falls asleep pretty easily and is now working on staying asleep past the 45 minute mark (okay I have to pop the dummy back in sometimes but rome wasn't built in a day!)

I hope things get better for you, I'm sure they will

Louise

[TnTsmama]

I'm so glad Freddie posted this struggle, since it seems that my lo is so similar.  All of the advice and encouragement is great, and I am wishing the best for us moms who are still fighting this nap battle.  But what do you do if your lo won't take a paci?  And pat/ssh seems to just distract him even more?  I'm at a complete loss.  Freddie, I know just how you feel.  I'm hoping for nap miracles for us both!

[corrina01]

Jenean, if he won't take a paci, and he doesn't like to be pat/sshh,  then either do the pat or the ssshh, if doesn't like either one, just try laying a hand on him.  I thought my DD didn't like the pat/ssshh  so I just experimented, and she did like the ssshhh not the pat.  She doesn't like either now so I just lay my hand on her, and works a treat.

[TnTsmama]

Thanks, I'll give it a try.  I have tried experimenting a little, and things are getting worse before they get better.   So, I'll just keep plugging away for now, but I'm feeling pretty defeated.

[corrina01]

Don't be.  You are doing a great job at getting your lo to sleep.  That will get better believe me.

[alex and danny]

Strength in numbers!  I too was crying along with my lo and ready to quit all of the techniques.... my wonderful friend, husband and my mom all mentioned to me that not all babies respond the same... to try and go with my instincts....  I stopped the Shhh wich just annoyed my lo and patted him gently, until that wore off and instead he liked humming and a firm hand on his back and arm... try different things, again all babies are different - and even though it does get better, which it did for Jacob - I was so impressed and proud, after a month and a bit of sleep trainning.... Something always emerges just when you think you got it.... developmental, growth spurt, teething etc.... Do know that these little wonderful people were given to us for a reason.... no one said it would be easy, but they do need our help sometimes and other times they sort it out.  I think what's most important is that you enjoy your moments together and be there when they need you!  We are not alone in this   :wink:

[FreddieEden]

Thanks for all the expressions of support.  It's good to know I'm not alone.  And lots of sympathy for all the rest of you out there.  I must say I'm feeling pretty defeated at the moment.  Nights are just completely variable with no pattern as to what is causing wake-ups.  I'm feeding him when he wakes up but don't know if that is the right thing to do.   We have had a couple of really grumpy days and when I have tried to go out to things it has all gone horribly wrong (two hours of overtired crying on Monday because he had been awake too long).  The older he gets the more alert he is and the more difficult it is to get out.  He won't sleep in my arms and it now takes him half an hour to get to sleep in the buggy or sling and he now seems to wake up when I sit down with the sling.  So, it seems like I just have to stay home and forget about things like postnatal groups.  I guess I should be grateful he sleeps in his cot as other mums have the opposite problem.  It's been suggested he might be hungry as he is so big and I should start giving him formula at night but I don't know if I want to do that.  If I have a supply problem that will make it worse and I feel at least breastfeeding is a way we have to bond when the day is going badly otherwise. I'm taking him to the doctors this morning and really dreading it as they are always running late so I fear he is going to get really upset by the time we get seen.  Still, I think I will  mention the sleeping and at least the doctor might take me seriously!  Mia's Mom, your health visitor sounds great - I have never had any sensible advice or support from a health visitor.  They always just make me feel like a rubbish mum.  Think it might be a London thing.

Freddie